China Coronavirus

[Angelo]

I find that a good rule of thumb in any discussion about Covid is to ignore anybody who uses the word "scaremongering"

One word, but it says a whole lot about a person's mind

I think it's better to ignore people who speak with authority on something they're not qualified to.

Aye

A lot of them use the word "scaremongering"

I think you'll find "scaremongering" refers to the doom merchants who know nothing about the virus.

The virus has ran riot up North at the minute, the infection levels are rampant. The next 5/6 weeks are going to tell us all about those who dismiss the virus and those who are running around scaremongering. If the scaremongerers are right we are going to see mass deaths in the north overt he next 5/6 weeks in relation to the virus.

Do you think anybody who doesn't know everything about Covid knows nothing about Covid?

Also these death figures that you feel people have predicted in 5-6 weeks time. Where are you getting that from? Who has made those predictions?

I'm just going on the doom merchants beliefs. If this virus is as deadly and dangerous as they believe then surely there will be catastrophic numbers of fatalities in the north in the next 5/6 weeks when you look at how rampant infection rates have been of late.

I have no idea what way it will go but if you are on the scaremongering side then you would believe we are probably looking at death totals in line with the first wave which would point to 7-800 deaths in the next 5/6 weeks?

Do you think shutting down of the economy, loss of livelihoods, employment and all other negative knock on factors that lockdowns mean are neccessary for a virus that might just have a 0.008 mortality rate for confirmed positive cases - many of whom already might have terminal illnesses or underlying conditions?

If you had to hop into your car today to go on a 50 mile round trip and you were told there was a 0.008 chance you or someone will die as a result, would you take that chance?

I don't know this but the data with regards to this over the next 6 weeks will answer a lot.

[Angelo]

I find that a good rule of thumb in any discussion about Covid is to ignore anybody who uses the word "scaremongering"

One word, but it says a whole lot about a person's mind

I think it's better to ignore people who speak with authority on something they're not qualified to.

Aye

A lot of them use the word "scaremongering"

I've posted this before but it sums up the modern age where anyone can read a post from Facebook and suddenly they a leading expert in that field:

https://medium.com/discourse/the-dunning-kruger-effect-explains-why-society-is-so-screwed-up-1432aca90aa8

Put simply, the Dunning-Kruger Effect is the tendency for people to misjudge their abilities. People with less than average abilities tend to overestimate their true abilities, while those with higher than average abilities tend to not realize how much better they are. That is, some people are too stupid to know how stupid they are, while smart people assume most can do what they can.

The mask argument is a point in case. The amount of "experts" that masks don't work, they affect your breathing and so on is frightening. How hard is it to stick on a mask when in a shop? These so called experts will be in the first in line to call out everybody and anybody for not acting in a timely fashion if the death rate does start to shoot up. I've seen people I know and know well on Facebook sharing content from various right leaning commentators around the world about how this is all a scam, it's big pharma and Bill Gates planning a mega payday and the like. Then without any irony at all they'll share a post from a medical professional asking us to respect social distancing, wear masks and be responsible. The past 6 months months have shown us the best of humanity and the absolute worst. 

If people would simply listen and do the right thing we wouldn't be in the position we are in now. Hearing stories constantly about people going to other family members houses when they have received positive test results or are awaiting test results, school children having sleepovers in each other houses, house parties (which adults who should know better), packed wake houses and so on. It is these things that is dragging this out and unfortunately it is a significant minority engaged in this behaviour. The argument that "sure the children are in a bubble anyway" doesn't wash. That is fine when they are at school where they are at least in a reasonably controlled environment, therefore the spread has not been prolific in schools. Plenty of schools have had to close due to isolated cases but I don't think there has been any major spread of COVID in a school environment.

Listen to who?

The "experts" who say masks work or the "experts" who don't.

This is science in a nutshell, they don't know, none of us do. I've no issue with wearing a mask, sanitising, social distancing, closure of pubs/restaurants, etc, etc.

The north has not acted to enter a second lockdown despite its rampant spread, the Free State more or less has. In many ways the assembly had their hands tied as they did not have the financial means to support a lockdown as Westminister controls the purse strings. I think the FS is scared shitless of their dysfunctional health service and that is what is influencing their every decision down there. Most European countries are taking a much more relaxed approach to a surge in cases.

There are two factors here, the doom merchants who think we are all going to die from the virus and the ones who claim the whole thing is a scam - none of these hysterical two sides know anything more than the others. The rise in cases in the north at present is through the roof - we will see in the next 5/6 weeks how that translates to deaths and that will give us a better idea on who is closer to the truth, the doom merchants or the scam sceptics.

Where these experts involved in public health and concerned about the supply of face masks and the general public buying them up leaving insufficient for medical, care and key workers?

Definitely if you are looking at evidence you would be wise to check the date stamp on said evidence.

What do you think Science should do with new or emerging evidence?

And there you are mentioning this predicted death toll in the North. Who's prediction is that?

Are you asking me to do sciences job for them?

They are the ones tasked with this and the ones failing to provide answers and clarity which is what we require from them in an ever pressing manner, where time is of the utmost importance. You might have faith in science to solve this but its probably one of those things that will solve itself at enormous cost to the human race before science can.

[LCohen]

If you take Spain as an example.

Spain were hit very hard in the first wave.

At the end of July, they had 325,874 positive cases of Covid and 28,445 deaths - a 9% mortality rate.

From Aug - present, there have been an additional 592,349 positive cases of Covid and an additional 4,679 deaths - a 0.008 mortality rate.

So what does that tell us?

Is the virus losing its potency?
Were the positive cases in the period up to July not properly recorded due to not being prepared for it, testing and tracing systems not being developed enough?
Are we now better able to treat the virus?

That's the data available.

It tells us Spain are testing more.
More testing means more positives and way more asymptomatic Positives.

It tells us that a lot of the most vulnerable are already dead (though more will become vulnerable over time)
It tells us that understanding of the virus has improved in terms of treatment and not doing stupid things like releases into nursing homes and reuse of PPE

[Angelo]

What "experts" say masks don't work?

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/uk-52153145

That was six months ago. Does he still believe that?

How do you explain places like New York, where cases plummeted following the state mandating the wearing of masks in public in April and where most people are actually adhering to mask wearing?

No one is saying masks alone are the panacaea. However, they've been standard practice in health care for decades to reduce the chances of staff infecting patients through exhalation of infectious droplets. Even if they're only 10% effective in reducing COVID transmission, that's still something worth pursuing, along with the social distancing, hand hygiene and so on.

You asked me for an expert who said masks don't work. There;s an expert who said it.

Here's another one.

https://fortune.com/2020/07/29/no-point-in-wearing-mask-sweden-covid/

So rather than trying to move the goalposts now, why don't you just accept that is significant difference of opinion from the "experts" on whether face masks actually work or not.

[Angelo]

If you take Spain as an example.

Spain were hit very hard in the first wave.

At the end of July, they had 325,874 positive cases of Covid and 28,445 deaths - a 9% mortality rate.

From Aug - present, there have been an additional 592,349 positive cases of Covid and an additional 4,679 deaths - a 0.008 mortality rate.

So what does that tell us?

Is the virus losing its potency?
Were the positive cases in the period up to July not properly recorded due to not being prepared for it, testing and tracing systems not being developed enough?
Are we now better able to treat the virus?

That's the data available.

It tells us Spain are testing more.
More testing means more positives and way more asymptomatic Positives.

It tells us that a lot of the most vulnerable are already dead (though more will become vulnerable over time)
It tells us that understanding of the virus has improved in terms of treatment and not doing stupid things like releases into nursing homes and reuse of PPE

Can we live with a virus with a 0.008 mortality rate?

[restorepride]

I find that a good rule of thumb in any discussion about Covid is to ignore anybody who uses the word "scaremongering"

One word, but it says a whole lot about a person's mind

I think it's better to ignore people who speak with authority on something they're not qualified to.

Aye

A lot of them use the word "scaremongering"

I think you'll find "scaremongering" refers to the doom merchants who know nothing about the virus.

The virus has ran riot up North at the minute, the infection levels are rampant. The next 5/6 weeks are going to tell us all about those who dismiss the virus and those who are running around scaremongering. If the scaremongerers are right we are going to see mass deaths in the north overt he next 5/6 weeks in relation to the virus.

Do you think anybody who doesn't know everything about Covid knows nothing about Covid?

Also these death figures that you feel people have predicted in 5-6 weeks time. Where are you getting that from? Who has made those predictions?

I'm just going on the doom merchants beliefs. If this virus is as deadly and dangerous as they believe then surely there will be catastrophic numbers of fatalities in the north in the next 5/6 weeks when you look at how rampant infection rates have been of late.

I have no idea what way it will go but if you are on the scaremongering side then you would believe we are probably looking at death totals in line with the first wave which would point to 7-800 deaths in the next 5/6 weeks?

Do you think shutting down of the economy, loss of livelihoods, employment and all other negative knock on factors that lockdowns mean are neccessary for a virus that might just have a 0.008 mortality rate for confirmed positive cases - many of whom already might have terminal illnesses or underlying conditions?

If you had to hop into your car today to go on a 50 mile round trip and you were told there was a 0.008 chance you or someone will die as a result, would you take that chance?

I don't know this but the data with regards to this over the next 6 weeks will answer a lot.

I'm not getting in the car unless I am driving, on my own!  Otherwise not taking the chance.  The old chestnut (great seasonal pun!!) - Health v Wealth.  By the way, is the 50 mile trip really necessary?  People spread the disease not cars.

[LCohen]

I find that a good rule of thumb in any discussion about Covid is to ignore anybody who uses the word "scaremongering"

One word, but it says a whole lot about a person's mind

I think it's better to ignore people who speak with authority on something they're not qualified to.

Aye

A lot of them use the word "scaremongering"

I think you'll find "scaremongering" refers to the doom merchants who know nothing about the virus.

The virus has ran riot up North at the minute, the infection levels are rampant. The next 5/6 weeks are going to tell us all about those who dismiss the virus and those who are running around scaremongering. If the scaremongerers are right we are going to see mass deaths in the north overt he next 5/6 weeks in relation to the virus.

Do you think anybody who doesn't know everything about Covid knows nothing about Covid?

Also these death figures that you feel people have predicted in 5-6 weeks time. Where are you getting that from? Who has made those predictions?

I'm just going on the doom merchants beliefs. If this virus is as deadly and dangerous as they believe then surely there will be catastrophic numbers of fatalities in the north in the next 5/6 weeks when you look at how rampant infection rates have been of late.

I have no idea what way it will go but if you are on the scaremongering side then you would believe we are probably looking at death totals in line with the first wave which would point to 7-800 deaths in the next 5/6 weeks?

Do you think shutting down of the economy, loss of livelihoods, employment and all other negative knock on factors that lockdowns mean are neccessary for a virus that might just have a 0.008 mortality rate for confirmed positive cases - many of whom already might have terminal illnesses or underlying conditions?

If you had to hop into your car today to go on a 50 mile round trip and you were told there was a 0.008 chance you or someone will die as a result, would you take that chance?

I don't know this but the data with regards to this over the next 6 weeks will answer a lot.

You keep repeating over and over again these predictions. Post the link to them.

I strongly suspect you are a devious liar. You are attempting to repeat this lie enough times so that you grandstand when the prediction of precisely nobody doesn't come true.

[Angelo]

I find that a good rule of thumb in any discussion about Covid is to ignore anybody who uses the word "scaremongering"

One word, but it says a whole lot about a person's mind

I think it's better to ignore people who speak with authority on something they're not qualified to.

Aye

A lot of them use the word "scaremongering"

I think you'll find "scaremongering" refers to the doom merchants who know nothing about the virus.

The virus has ran riot up North at the minute, the infection levels are rampant. The next 5/6 weeks are going to tell us all about those who dismiss the virus and those who are running around scaremongering. If the scaremongerers are right we are going to see mass deaths in the north overt he next 5/6 weeks in relation to the virus.

Do you think anybody who doesn't know everything about Covid knows nothing about Covid?

Also these death figures that you feel people have predicted in 5-6 weeks time. Where are you getting that from? Who has made those predictions?

I'm just going on the doom merchants beliefs. If this virus is as deadly and dangerous as they believe then surely there will be catastrophic numbers of fatalities in the north in the next 5/6 weeks when you look at how rampant infection rates have been of late.

I have no idea what way it will go but if you are on the scaremongering side then you would believe we are probably looking at death totals in line with the first wave which would point to 7-800 deaths in the next 5/6 weeks?

Do you think shutting down of the economy, loss of livelihoods, employment and all other negative knock on factors that lockdowns mean are neccessary for a virus that might just have a 0.008 mortality rate for confirmed positive cases - many of whom already might have terminal illnesses or underlying conditions?

If you had to hop into your car today to go on a 50 mile round trip and you were told there was a 0.008 chance you or someone will die as a result, would you take that chance?

I don't know this but the data with regards to this over the next 6 weeks will answer a lot.

I'm not getting in the car unless I am driving, on my own!  Otherwise not taking the chance.  The old chestnut (great seasonal pun!!) - Health v Wealth.  By the way, is the 50 mile trip really necessary?  People spread the disease not cars.

Have you ever done a 50 mile car trip to go to town, to go to a match, to travel to an airport, to go shopping, to visit a friend/relative?

Were any of those trips necessary? Would you ever make one of those trips again if you knew it carried a 0.008% chance of killing someone?

[Angelo]

I find that a good rule of thumb in any discussion about Covid is to ignore anybody who uses the word "scaremongering"

One word, but it says a whole lot about a person's mind

I think it's better to ignore people who speak with authority on something they're not qualified to.

Aye

A lot of them use the word "scaremongering"

I think you'll find "scaremongering" refers to the doom merchants who know nothing about the virus.

The virus has ran riot up North at the minute, the infection levels are rampant. The next 5/6 weeks are going to tell us all about those who dismiss the virus and those who are running around scaremongering. If the scaremongerers are right we are going to see mass deaths in the north overt he next 5/6 weeks in relation to the virus.

Do you think anybody who doesn't know everything about Covid knows nothing about Covid?

Also these death figures that you feel people have predicted in 5-6 weeks time. Where are you getting that from? Who has made those predictions?

I'm just going on the doom merchants beliefs. If this virus is as deadly and dangerous as they believe then surely there will be catastrophic numbers of fatalities in the north in the next 5/6 weeks when you look at how rampant infection rates have been of late.

I have no idea what way it will go but if you are on the scaremongering side then you would believe we are probably looking at death totals in line with the first wave which would point to 7-800 deaths in the next 5/6 weeks?

Do you think shutting down of the economy, loss of livelihoods, employment and all other negative knock on factors that lockdowns mean are neccessary for a virus that might just have a 0.008 mortality rate for confirmed positive cases - many of whom already might have terminal illnesses or underlying conditions?

If you had to hop into your car today to go on a 50 mile round trip and you were told there was a 0.008 chance you or someone will die as a result, would you take that chance?

I don't know this but the data with regards to this over the next 6 weeks will answer a lot.

You keep repeating over and over again these predictions. Post the link to them.

I strongly suspect you are a devious liar. You are attempting to repeat this lie enough times so that you grandstand when the prediction of precisely nobody doesn't come true.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/spain/

You strongly expect I am a devious liar. Go look at the data in the link then numbnuts.

[LCohen]

If you take Spain as an example.

Spain were hit very hard in the first wave.

At the end of July, they had 325,874 positive cases of Covid and 28,445 deaths - a 9% mortality rate.

From Aug - present, there have been an additional 592,349 positive cases of Covid and an additional 4,679 deaths - a 0.008 mortality rate.

So what does that tell us?

Is the virus losing its potency?
Were the positive cases in the period up to July not properly recorded due to not being prepared for it, testing and tracing systems not being developed enough?
Are we now better able to treat the virus?

That's the data available.

It tells us Spain are testing more.
More testing means more positives and way more asymptomatic Positives.

It tells us that a lot of the most vulnerable are already dead (though more will become vulnerable over time)
It tells us that understanding of the virus has improved in terms of treatment and not doing stupid things like releases into nursing homes and reuse of PPE

Can we live with a virus with a 0.008 mortality rate?

Depends.

Depends on the rate of infection.
Depends on the morbidity rates
Depends on what steps could get the mortality rate and rates of infection lower


And it obviously also depend on the accuracy of the figure

[restorepride]

I find that a good rule of thumb in any discussion about Covid is to ignore anybody who uses the word "scaremongering"

One word, but it says a whole lot about a person's mind

I think it's better to ignore people who speak with authority on something they're not qualified to.

Aye

A lot of them use the word "scaremongering"

I think you'll find "scaremongering" refers to the doom merchants who know nothing about the virus.

The virus has ran riot up North at the minute, the infection levels are rampant. The next 5/6 weeks are going to tell us all about those who dismiss the virus and those who are running around scaremongering. If the scaremongerers are right we are going to see mass deaths in the north overt he next 5/6 weeks in relation to the virus.

Do you think anybody who doesn't know everything about Covid knows nothing about Covid?

Also these death figures that you feel people have predicted in 5-6 weeks time. Where are you getting that from? Who has made those predictions?

I'm just going on the doom merchants beliefs. If this virus is as deadly and dangerous as they believe then surely there will be catastrophic numbers of fatalities in the north in the next 5/6 weeks when you look at how rampant infection rates have been of late.

I have no idea what way it will go but if you are on the scaremongering side then you would believe we are probably looking at death totals in line with the first wave which would point to 7-800 deaths in the next 5/6 weeks?

Do you think shutting down of the economy, loss of livelihoods, employment and all other negative knock on factors that lockdowns mean are neccessary for a virus that might just have a 0.008 mortality rate for confirmed positive cases - many of whom already might have terminal illnesses or underlying conditions?

If you had to hop into your car today to go on a 50 mile round trip and you were told there was a 0.008 chance you or someone will die as a result, would you take that chance?

I don't know this but the data with regards to this over the next 6 weeks will answer a lot.

I'm not getting in the car unless I am driving, on my own!  Otherwise not taking the chance.  The old chestnut (great seasonal pun!!) - Health v Wealth.  By the way, is the 50 mile trip really necessary?  People spread the disease not cars.

Have you ever done a 50 mile car trip to go to town, to go to a match, to travel to an airport, to go shopping, to visit a friend/relative?

Were any of those trips necessary? Would you ever make one of those trips again if you knew it carried a 0.008% chance of killing someone?

I haven't done any of those since March.  If I thought there was any chance I would kill someone - no.  Although if I could just gently bump into Mr Brolly, then ....

[LCohen]

I find that a good rule of thumb in any discussion about Covid is to ignore anybody who uses the word "scaremongering"

One word, but it says a whole lot about a person's mind

I think it's better to ignore people who speak with authority on something they're not qualified to.

Aye

A lot of them use the word "scaremongering"

I've posted this before but it sums up the modern age where anyone can read a post from Facebook and suddenly they a leading expert in that field:

https://medium.com/discourse/the-dunning-kruger-effect-explains-why-society-is-so-screwed-up-1432aca90aa8

Put simply, the Dunning-Kruger Effect is the tendency for people to misjudge their abilities. People with less than average abilities tend to overestimate their true abilities, while those with higher than average abilities tend to not realize how much better they are. That is, some people are too stupid to know how stupid they are, while smart people assume most can do what they can.

The mask argument is a point in case. The amount of "experts" that masks don't work, they affect your breathing and so on is frightening. How hard is it to stick on a mask when in a shop? These so called experts will be in the first in line to call out everybody and anybody for not acting in a timely fashion if the death rate does start to shoot up. I've seen people I know and know well on Facebook sharing content from various right leaning commentators around the world about how this is all a scam, it's big pharma and Bill Gates planning a mega payday and the like. Then without any irony at all they'll share a post from a medical professional asking us to respect social distancing, wear masks and be responsible. The past 6 months months have shown us the best of humanity and the absolute worst. 

If people would simply listen and do the right thing we wouldn't be in the position we are in now. Hearing stories constantly about people going to other family members houses when they have received positive test results or are awaiting test results, school children having sleepovers in each other houses, house parties (which adults who should know better), packed wake houses and so on. It is these things that is dragging this out and unfortunately it is a significant minority engaged in this behaviour. The argument that "sure the children are in a bubble anyway" doesn't wash. That is fine when they are at school where they are at least in a reasonably controlled environment, therefore the spread has not been prolific in schools. Plenty of schools have had to close due to isolated cases but I don't think there has been any major spread of COVID in a school environment.

Listen to who?

The "experts" who say masks work or the "experts" who don't.

This is science in a nutshell, they don't know, none of us do. I've no issue with wearing a mask, sanitising, social distancing, closure of pubs/restaurants, etc, etc.

The north has not acted to enter a second lockdown despite its rampant spread, the Free State more or less has. In many ways the assembly had their hands tied as they did not have the financial means to support a lockdown as Westminister controls the purse strings. I think the FS is scared shitless of their dysfunctional health service and that is what is influencing their every decision down there. Most European countries are taking a much more relaxed approach to a surge in cases.

There are two factors here, the doom merchants who think we are all going to die from the virus and the ones who claim the whole thing is a scam - none of these hysterical two sides know anything more than the others. The rise in cases in the north at present is through the roof - we will see in the next 5/6 weeks how that translates to deaths and that will give us a better idea on who is closer to the truth, the doom merchants or the scam sceptics.

Where these experts involved in public health and concerned about the supply of face masks and the general public buying them up leaving insufficient for medical, care and key workers?

Definitely if you are looking at evidence you would be wise to check the date stamp on said evidence.

What do you think Science should do with new or emerging evidence?

And there you are mentioning this predicted death toll in the North. Who's prediction is that?

Are you asking me to do sciences job for them?

They are the ones tasked with this and the ones failing to provide answers and clarity which is what we require from them in an ever pressing manner, where time is of the utmost importance. You might have faith in science to solve this but its probably one of those things that will solve itself at enormous cost to the human race before science can.

Talk me through this solving itself idea?

Also Public Officials have to have an eye on what is possible. Not just utopia

[Itchy]

I think Angelo does have a point.

I was in many meetings with experts back in March/April when this was at its worst and the advice to my company was no point wearing masks. Plenty of experts on TV and in the WHO said the same. So things change and the experts changed their opinion which is fine and normal. But it does show that experts can be wrong and are not infallible. So the point is this, we do need to trust the opinion of the experts once they indulge us in answering our questions, providing the data on which they based their opinions. I don't think it is right to simply say - I am an expert dont question me. I think it was perfectly fine the GAA for example asked for the data which showed their games were contributing. The minute you start treating Tony Holohan as a god who owes us no explanation is the minute you are in trouble. Even good science needs to be critiqued.

[LCohen]

I find that a good rule of thumb in any discussion about Covid is to ignore anybody who uses the word "scaremongering"

One word, but it says a whole lot about a person's mind

I think it's better to ignore people who speak with authority on something they're not qualified to.

Aye

A lot of them use the word "scaremongering"

I think you'll find "scaremongering" refers to the doom merchants who know nothing about the virus.

The virus has ran riot up North at the minute, the infection levels are rampant. The next 5/6 weeks are going to tell us all about those who dismiss the virus and those who are running around scaremongering. If the scaremongerers are right we are going to see mass deaths in the north overt he next 5/6 weeks in relation to the virus.

Do you think anybody who doesn't know everything about Covid knows nothing about Covid?

Also these death figures that you feel people have predicted in 5-6 weeks time. Where are you getting that from? Who has made those predictions?

I'm just going on the doom merchants beliefs. If this virus is as deadly and dangerous as they believe then surely there will be catastrophic numbers of fatalities in the north in the next 5/6 weeks when you look at how rampant infection rates have been of late.

I have no idea what way it will go but if you are on the scaremongering side then you would believe we are probably looking at death totals in line with the first wave which would point to 7-800 deaths in the next 5/6 weeks?

Do you think shutting down of the economy, loss of livelihoods, employment and all other negative knock on factors that lockdowns mean are neccessary for a virus that might just have a 0.008 mortality rate for confirmed positive cases - many of whom already might have terminal illnesses or underlying conditions?

If you had to hop into your car today to go on a 50 mile round trip and you were told there was a 0.008 chance you or someone will die as a result, would you take that chance?

I don't know this but the data with regards to this over the next 6 weeks will answer a lot.

You keep repeating over and over again these predictions. Post the link to them.

I strongly suspect you are a devious liar. You are attempting to repeat this lie enough times so that you grandstand when the prediction of precisely nobody doesn't come true.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/spain/

You strongly expect I am a devious liar. Go look at the data in the link then numbnuts.

Couldn't get the Northern Ireland prediction there. Post it again please

[Angelo]

I find that a good rule of thumb in any discussion about Covid is to ignore anybody who uses the word "scaremongering"

One word, but it says a whole lot about a person's mind

I think it's better to ignore people who speak with authority on something they're not qualified to.

Aye

A lot of them use the word "scaremongering"

I think you'll find "scaremongering" refers to the doom merchants who know nothing about the virus.

The virus has ran riot up North at the minute, the infection levels are rampant. The next 5/6 weeks are going to tell us all about those who dismiss the virus and those who are running around scaremongering. If the scaremongerers are right we are going to see mass deaths in the north overt he next 5/6 weeks in relation to the virus.

Do you think anybody who doesn't know everything about Covid knows nothing about Covid?

Also these death figures that you feel people have predicted in 5-6 weeks time. Where are you getting that from? Who has made those predictions?

I'm just going on the doom merchants beliefs. If this virus is as deadly and dangerous as they believe then surely there will be catastrophic numbers of fatalities in the north in the next 5/6 weeks when you look at how rampant infection rates have been of late.

I have no idea what way it will go but if you are on the scaremongering side then you would believe we are probably looking at death totals in line with the first wave which would point to 7-800 deaths in the next 5/6 weeks?

Do you think shutting down of the economy, loss of livelihoods, employment and all other negative knock on factors that lockdowns mean are neccessary for a virus that might just have a 0.008 mortality rate for confirmed positive cases - many of whom already might have terminal illnesses or underlying conditions?

If you had to hop into your car today to go on a 50 mile round trip and you were told there was a 0.008 chance you or someone will die as a result, would you take that chance?

I don't know this but the data with regards to this over the next 6 weeks will answer a lot.

I'm not getting in the car unless I am driving, on my own!  Otherwise not taking the chance.  The old chestnut (great seasonal pun!!) - Health v Wealth.  By the way, is the 50 mile trip really necessary?  People spread the disease not cars.

Have you ever done a 50 mile car trip to go to town, to go to a match, to travel to an airport, to go shopping, to visit a friend/relative?

Were any of those trips necessary? Would you ever make one of those trips again if you knew it carried a 0.008% chance of killing someone?

I haven't done any of those since March.  If I thought there was any chance I would kill someone - no.  Although if I could just gently bump into Mr Brolly, then ....

So you're never going to get behind the wheel of a car again or get in a car to go to a football match, or visit a friend of relative or go to town?

You do realise how ridiculous that sounds?