Sinn Fein? They have gone away, you know.

[armaghniac]

What indecipherable nonsensical babble you come out with.

This coming from someone who can't even think for themselves. The ultimate hypocrite!

Indeed. Rossfan is obviously not from the SF family, a noted centre of diverse opinion and independent thought.

[ashman]

It's like Christmas advertising.

People will say SF have gone too far this time. They'll never recover from this.

They always come out smelling of roses in terms of support.

You are spot on ,  the SF vote in next Southern election won't care a great deal about the current furore.

[Maguire01]

It's like Christmas advertising.

People will say SF have gone too far this time. They'll never recover from this.

They always come out smelling of roses in terms of support.

You are spot on ,  the SF vote in next Southern election won't care a great deal about the current furore.

But what is "the SF vote"? Is it the vote they have, or the vote they want?

[Maguire01]

My opinion and that of anyone I've spoken to about it this week.

We all have opinions. However if you want to look at the evidence, they got 10% in the last election in the south, 6% in the election before that and will probably get 15-16% in the next election. That decent growth is happening all around the country in area where SF have no real foundations or presence while constantly under attack from what passes as MSM in the south. Those aren't opinions they're the facts of SF progression in the south under Adams. They point to him doing a good job and there's no evidence that I can see of them doing better under anyone else. For example, how would Pearse or Mary Lou taking over affect the Party support in the north or have you factored that into your considerations?

SF will be fine in the next election and will double their seats I think.

They want to beat Ff and effectively lead the opposition.  That is fine and dandy.  Then what ?? More populist promises and maybe government . 

Then what   Then they will realise you will have to call in the promises .  This means the next election will be carnage .

Maybe they will enforce change. Maybe the first thing they will do if they got into power is to drastically reduce the salaries and expenses of TDs and cap what they can earn and claim.

Yes, because it's not like they accepted an increase in MLA pay in the current Assembly term, paid their Special Advisors more than a TD salary, or were exposed on expenses... oh, wait...

[Rossfan]

What indecipherable nonsensical babble you come out with.

This coming from someone who can't even think for themselves. The ultimate hypocrite!

Indeed. Rossfan is obviously not from the SF family, a noted centre of diverse opinion and independent thought.

So if you don't think SF is wonderful it's a sign you " can't even think for themselves"
What absolute bullshitty nonsense.

[Maguire01]

What indecipherable nonsensical babble you come out with.

This coming from someone who can't even think for themselves. The ultimate hypocrite!

Indeed. Rossfan is obviously not from the SF family, a noted centre of diverse opinion and independent thought.

So if you don't think SF is wonderful it's a sign you " can't even think for themselves"
What absolute bullshitty nonsense.

I think your sarcasm detector is turned off.

[ashman]

It's like Christmas advertising.

People will say SF have gone too far this time. They'll never recover from this.

They always come out smelling of roses in terms of support.

You are spot on ,  the SF vote in next Southern election won't care a great deal about the current furore.

But what is "the SF vote"? Is it the vote they have, or the vote they want?

As I see it enough people to believe in their policies .  Enough to make them the largest opposition party.

[Maguire01]

It's like Christmas advertising.

People will say SF have gone too far this time. They'll never recover from this.

They always come out smelling of roses in terms of support.

You are spot on ,  the SF vote in next Southern election won't care a great deal about the current furore.

But what is "the SF vote"? Is it the vote they have, or the vote they want?

As I see it enough people to believe in their policies .  Enough to make them the largest opposition party.

They'll get more seats than they have now, but I dont think they'll pass FF. Even with a smaller percentage of the vote, FF would return more seats.

[Rossfan]

What indecipherable nonsensical babble you come out with.

This coming from someone who can't even think for themselves. The ultimate hypocrite!

Indeed. Rossfan is obviously not from the SF family, a noted centre of diverse opinion and independent thought.

So if you don't think SF is wonderful it's a sign you " can't even think for themselves"
What absolute bullshitty nonsense.

I think your sarcasm detector is turned off.

I was responding to the think for themselves comment. Sarcasm of the intelligent poster noted.

[ashman]

It's like Christmas advertising.

People will say SF have gone too far this time. They'll never recover from this.

They always come out smelling of roses in terms of support.

You are spot on ,  the SF vote in next Southern election won't care a great deal about the current furore.

But what is "the SF vote"? Is it the vote they have, or the vote they want?

As I see it enough people to believe in their policies .  Enough to make them the largest opposition party.

They'll get more seats than they have now, but I dont think they'll pass FF. Even with a smaller percentage of the vote, FF would return more seats.

Will be close and I think you may be right but FF will still do poorly in Dublin. This will be a dirty battle and I think the current government could strangely be the beneficiaries.

[smelmoth]

The decent people would either get better public services or have to pay less tax if the border scumbags were put out of business.

If you'd ever set foot anywhere near the border you'd know that it's economically desolate on both sides. And that isn't anything to do with a few cowboys selling dodgy diesel either.

There is an undenialable truth in what Rossfan says.

The only motivation for these illegal activities is personal greed and we all pay for it. It has to end. On the Armagh/Louth/Monaghan border and everywhere else. There is no logical argument for tolerating it.

The cowboys in these areas are involved in a lot more that diesel and it very definitely they harm economic activity in the area.  Could you set up and run a legit pub, off licence, filling station, convenience store and pay normal wholesale prices and duties for your stock, pay proper wages to your staff, pay your taxes and charge normal retail prices anc compete with the cowboys for trade?

[smelmoth]

It's hard to know where to start answering some of the points made, but in no particular order:
Slab Murphy has been found guilty of tax evasion and must pay the price imo. Adams and McGuinness are entitled to laude his contribution to the peace process but that does not take away from his illegal activity. They would be best to say nothing again imo.
I never fail to be taken aback by the hypocrisy of some posters who view the IRA campaign of the '70's and '80's as some how different from the activities of the old IRA in the early years of the last century. There is no difference. Catholics were discriminated against in the North, left in poverty denied houses and jobs some took up protest and were brutalised by the Unionist Government and the RUC some took up arms. Now you can debate the rights and wrongs of this situation but if you do so you must apply some balance. Rossfan's arguments are lost in the vehemence of his totally anti SF agenda and whitewashing of history. As with all conflicts bad things were done and not just by the Provos and not just in the '70's and '80's. I recommend you read Bonfires on the Hillsides by the late James Kelly, it will open some eyes here that are welded shut. If Slab rightly goes down so to must the assorted bankers and charlatans who collapsed the Irish economy with there brown bags and gombeenism.

Anybody want to outline Slab's contribution to the peace process?

[smelmoth]

The best thing that could happen Sinn Fein is for Gerry to retire.

Politics on this island will not progress until all politicians who lived through and "participated" in the troubles retire. Too much bitterness and resentment is harboured on all sides.

Get rid of Gerry and the Independent and their ilk will just move onto the next move onto attacking the next leader. No SF leader will be acceptable to the southern establishment much less a northerner.

Maybe no SF leader will be acceptable to the greater part of the southern electorate?

[smelmoth]

My opinion and that of anyone I've spoken to about it this week.

We all have opinions. However if you want to look at the evidence, they got 10% in the last election in the south, 6% in the election before that and will probably get 15-16% in the next election. That decent growth is happening all around the country in area where SF have no real foundations or presence while constantly under attack from what passes as MSM in the south. Those aren't opinions they're the facts of SF progression in the south under Adams. They point to him doing a good job and there's no evidence that I can see of them doing better under anyone else. For example, how would Pearse or Mary Lou taking over affect the Party support in the north or have you factored that into your considerations?

If you want to judge Adams in electoral terms then you need to SF results in 2016 north and south against the swings to the left secured by parties with similar ecomonic policies in similarly fcuked up european economies. If they under achieive against this benchmark then it would be fair to call him an under achiever as a democratic leader

[Rossfan]

"Independent " newspapers excelling themselves today
Telling us that SF election workers include "convicted criminals".
What next? Christmas fell on 25th Dec this year!?