gaaboard.com

Think this deserves it's own topic
Will the truth ever come out?
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/noahs-army-line-streets-of-belfast-calling-for-answers-over-schoolboys-disappearance-and-death-40248914.html

Noahs mother is an incredible woman. I hope she finds the truth.

Break it down

Was he killed?
Did he take his own life?
What are the cops hiding?
Where was he going?
Was he forced up this route?
Was this a complete misadventure?
Have the corners told lies?

Basically more people than you would think have this as a loyalist cover up, that he was murdered by loyalists and then dumped in the storm drain

Quote from: Kidder81 on March 28, 2021, 07:36:04 PM
Basically more people than you would think have this as a loyalist cover up, that he was murdered by loyalists and then dumped in the storm drain

More than me?

That is one determined woman.

The whole thing stinks tbh. All she wants is the truth and it was her wee boy so you could hardly blame her. Is it more than incompetence why this is the case? I don't know but there are a lot of unanswered questions and no reason they shouldn't be answered.

Something certainly stinks with it.

Politicians, the media and the police all keeping very quiet on it.

Quote from: imtommygunn on March 28, 2021, 08:02:50 PM
That is one determined woman.

The whole thing stinks tbh. All she wants is the truth and it was her wee boy so you could hardly blame her. Is it more than incompetence why this is the case? I don't know but there are a lot of unanswered questions and no reason they shouldn't be answered.

I hope she gets closure and the answers she needs

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 28, 2021, 07:45:47 PM

Quote from: Kidder81 on March 28, 2021, 07:36:04 PM
Basically more people than you would think have this as a loyalist cover up, that he was murdered by loyalists and then dumped in the storm drain

More than me?

I've actually wondered a lot what people actually thought happened. In my own mind I assumed a tragic freak accident, then the utter incompetence (& ass covering actions) of the PSNI has been so horrendous it appears like they're trying to cover something up more than their own awfulness.

There is no reason whatsoever the truth can't be brought to light here - this investigation stinks to high heavens.

Fiona is made of strong stuff to have this played out in the way it has done - but it's clear she will stop at nothing to get to the truth

https://krw-law.ie/noah-donohoe-preliminary-hearing/

We have reason to believe that there is a particular and specific knowledge of this assault in the homeless community and with those struggling with addiction issues, both in the city centre and also from people who were residents at Queens Quarter housing association in University Street, specifically people resident there in June. The court will be aware that Noah lived metres away from Queens Quarter on the day he went missing.

As I understand it, he was cycling across the city to see his school mate who lives off the North Circular Road. He fell of his bike and got a knock on his head. Then it gets weird. Could a knock on your head make you want to cycle off in the wrong direction? Would it make you want to take your clothes off and climb into a storm drain? He was a good kid, and very very unlikely that they would be into drugs as some suggest.

There must be some dashcam footage of Noah cycling from the point that he fell off.

There is speculation of him being assaulted at some point in the city centre as per sf post though. It seems to be reckoned that there should be cctv footage somewhere of this but it isn't forthcoming or has been overlooked.

I find it incomprehensible that a naked boy could cycle down Northwood Avenue in the early evening without being seen or raising suspicion - there are literally hundreds of houses for him to have passed - with what I would imagine would be some residents out in their front garden / kids playing.

Quote from: Will it ever end on March 28, 2021, 10:34:23 PM
I find it incomprehensible that a naked boy could cycle down Northwood Avenue in the early evening without being seen or raising suspicion - there are literally hundreds of houses for him to have passed - with what I would imagine would be some residents out in their front garden / kids playing.

So why wouldn't there be more reports on it?

It's completely bizarre

The whole thing is bonkers. Something isn't right.

I don't get it.

A friend works with community groups in the area & has been contacted by representatives from both sides of a van has taken a wrong turn down a street to find out what their doing in that area.

That's why I don't believe for one minute he wasn't seen on Northwood Avenue.

Quote from: imtommygunn on March 28, 2021, 10:40:30 PM
The whole thing is bonkers. Something isn't right.

Someone knows what happened

Everyone that I know in Belfast and from those close to the family seem pretty sure that there is more to this that what the police are saying. Where are the Political Parties on this? SF, SDLP and Alliance are they asking for answers?

Would the police, in this day and age, try to hide a serious incident that led to a death if the motive was related to sectarianism? 

There are politicians who are on this. I think it is cross party too so not specifically one.

nrico you would like to think not. It would seem a bit mad that something like this would happen to a kid this age due to sectarianism.(shouldn't happen at any age but so young) I would hope not.

Re the sectarianism angle.

Would he have had anything on him that would have identified him as Catholic? Would it not have been more likely that there could be racial element to this rather than sectarianism?

Quote from: Angelo on March 29, 2021, 10:39:12 AM
Re the sectarianism angle.

Would he have had anything on him that would have identified him as Catholic? Would it not have been more likely that there could be racial element to this rather than sectarianism?

Would have had the same thoughts on that but I read something before about him being identified as being associated with his school therefore that's where the sectarian angle comes in.

This is still a live investigation and surly this would be the reason why politicians etc have to be careful on what they say as it could do more harm than good in the long run.

Quote from: Hereiam on March 29, 2021, 11:45:20 AM
This is still a live investigation and surly this would be the reason why politicians etc have to be careful on what they say as it could do more harm than good in the long run.

Is it? I thought it was closed and the coroner recorded accidental death? Hence the publicity around the case to get the police to relaunch their investigation. No?

So was the homeless person that allegedly assaulted him sectarian or what ? I'm confused

Quote from: Saffrongael on March 29, 2021, 12:52:03 PM
So was the homeless person that allegedly assaulted him sectarian or what ? I'm confused

the homeless up there must be kicking the shite of quite a lot of teenage boys if recent news is anything to go by!

The PSNI have either been totally incompetent or in cover-up mode.

Told the family a pack of lies about doing leaflet drops in the area and they seem to have to put out requests for information on social media and through their solicitors rather than the PSNI putting any effort into it.

I am not sold on the sectarian element either.

Tbh the whole think is a real mystery. Any wonder the poor mother won't give up on it.

Quote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2021, 01:53:06 PM

Quote from: Saffrongael on March 29, 2021, 12:52:03 PM
So was the homeless person that allegedly assaulted him sectarian or what ? I'm confused

the homeless up there must be kicking the shite of quite a lot of teenage boys if recent news is anything to go by!

The PSNI have either been totally incompetent or in cover-up mode.

Told the family a pack of lies about doing leaflet drops in the area and they seem to have to put out requests for information on social media and through their solicitors rather than the PSNI putting any effort into it.

Have you seen the homeless ones up at Botonic? Drug/Alcoholics, in most cases homeless because the shelters they have been in have barred them for breaking the rules, so by a certain degree homeless by choice, there are loads of them in Belfast center, sitting on the benches along Royal Avenue drinking cider as soon as Lidli is opened.

The cops are tortured tbf, as for fighting, they generally fight with their own and couldn't bate Casey's drum, a good mint would blow them over. I did notice a couple of Sunday's ago a homeless guy begging for money off 4 young girls, wasn't too aggressive but the kids felt some pressure.

So what's has the homeless guy got to do with Botonic and a child ending up in in a storm drain on the Shore road?

This is a very peculiar case and I see that Paddy Barnes is now hounding Nolan daily on Twitter but getting no reply. I can't say I know much about it but something doesn't sound right with the lack of media coverage around it, seems bizarre.

Quote from: yellowcard on May 24, 2021, 10:55:39 PM
This is a very peculiar case and I see that Paddy Barnes is now hounding Nolan daily on Twitter but getting no reply. I can't say I know much about it but something doesn't sound right with the lack of media coverage around it, seems bizarre.

And something really bizarre about the University of Ulster threatening to get her pulled from twitter if she doesn't stop asking for them to release their CCT footage from their buildings in that area...

PSNI conspicuous by their absence

During the Derek Chauvin trial they had someone on the stand talking about 'excited delirium'. A condition that can manifest itself out of the blue, where the individual feels extreme heat and exhibits bizarre behaviour, including removal of their clothes

I did think of Noah as I was hearing the testimony. But of course so little actual facts about Noah in the public domain, it could be miles off.

The media have no new info because nobody is saying anything.
A number of Noah's possessions are still missing. Somebody knows about that.

Quote from: seafoid on May 27, 2021, 10:21:52 AM
The media have no new info because nobody is saying anything.
A number of Noah's possessions are still missing. Somebody knows about that.

Peelers never secured the bins in the location where his body was found.

Their efforts are beyond reprehensible.

Another lad attacked by a group of youths in that area the other night.

Is there sectarian gangs kicking lumps out of one another all the time with only the odd one making the news?

Quote from: johnnycool on May 27, 2021, 11:09:37 AM

Quote from: seafoid on May 27, 2021, 10:21:52 AM
The media have no new info because nobody is saying anything.
A number of Noah's possessions are still missing. Somebody knows about that.

Peelers never secured the bins in the location where his body was found.

Their efforts are beyond reprehensible.

Another lad attacked by a group of youths in that area the other night.

Is there sectarian gangs kicking lumps out of one another all the time with only the odd one making the news?

The lads mother on twitter now pretty much states who done it, it wasn't sectarianism.

https://twitter.com/FIONADONOHOE2/status/1395101663321600004

Quote from: GetOverTheBar on May 27, 2021, 11:26:30 AM

Quote from: johnnycool on May 27, 2021, 11:09:37 AM

Quote from: seafoid on May 27, 2021, 10:21:52 AM
The media have no new info because nobody is saying anything.
A number of Noah's possessions are still missing. Somebody knows about that.

Peelers never secured the bins in the location where his body was found.

Their efforts are beyond reprehensible.

Another lad attacked by a group of youths in that area the other night.

Is there sectarian gangs kicking lumps out of one another all the time with only the odd one making the news?

The lads mother on twitter now pretty much states who done it, it wasn't sectarianism.

https://twitter.com/FIONADONOHOE2/status/1395101663321600004

What did it say? Won't open for me!!

To paraphrase....a well known violent drug addicted criminal is able to walk the streets who may have possibly assaulted her son, she got a funny look from a fella on Botanic avenue with her friend, turns out it was him.

Quote from: GetOverTheBar on May 27, 2021, 12:11:13 PM
To paraphrase....a well known violent drug addicted criminal is able to walk the streets who may have possibly assaulted her son, she got a funny look from a fella on Botanic avenue with her friend, turns out it was him.

So the lad who tried to "fence" the laptop just so happens to be the son of a well connected loyalist and is purely a career petty criminal.

Don't think it's the same lad she walked passed in Botanic but you never know.

Sectarianism is a better story, in reality it was homeless drug addicts (of course....not proven) but they can't say that because they are considered extremely vulnerable and the last thing they want it a spate of revenge attacks on people / homeless facilities which are nearby the new Ulster University building (why she wants the CCTV).

Are all stories not simply speculation, or is there anything that points towards druggies or loyalists?

Those would be my thoughts. Something is definitely not right but tbh I would have my doubts on the loyalist thing. I just don't see why but it's like anything and is just opinion and speculation. It is beginning to look like that is all there will ever be is opinion and speculation. :(

Quote from: imtommygunn on May 27, 2021, 02:35:54 PM
Those would be my thoughts. Something is definitely not right but tbh I would have my doubts on the loyalist thing. I just don't see why but it's like anything and is just opinion and speculation. It is beginning to look like that is all there will ever be is opinion and speculation. :(

Probably a lot of truth in what you say but you always have doubts about the peelers for doing such a poor job of investigating and what motivated them to do such a half arsed job.

Loyalists at first because of where it occurred / the body was found / certain items of the lads belongings ending up with people in Loyalist areas / there had been previous type attacks on young lads.

Homeless also where it occurred / local knowledge / reluctance of PSNI to act / Refusal of UUJ to give the security footage of the new building / this was pretty much how the homeless paid for their drugs robbery & handy crime.

Everything is speculation but the Loyalist angle is more unbelievable than the homeless one. Loyalist involvement rumour is purely because the PSNI have not exactly handled this brilliantly and old habits, die hard.

Quote from: GetOverTheBar on May 27, 2021, 02:14:45 PM
Sectarianism is a better story, in reality it was homeless drug addicts (of course....not proven) but they can't say that because they are considered extremely vulnerable and the last thing they want it a spate of revenge attacks on people / homeless facilities which are nearby the new Ulster University building (why she wants the CCTV).

Who can't say that? Surely all that anybody wants is the truth with proper justice served regardless of the implications for any particular group of people. If there is a cover up going on then it deserves to be exposed but the whole story just seems bizarre.

If the mother claims that she walked past the man who she suspects of the murder of her son on the street this morning, then it just adds to the peculiarity, innuendo and speculation surrounding the case.   

I think as JC said that was the guy who had his laptop. The whole thing is just bizarre and it is sad seeing the woman go through what she is going through in full public view but what else does she do.

Quote from: yellowcard on May 27, 2021, 02:41:26 PM

Quote from: GetOverTheBar on May 27, 2021, 02:14:45 PM
Sectarianism is a better story, in reality it was homeless drug addicts (of course....not proven) but they can't say that because they are considered extremely vulnerable and the last thing they want it a spate of revenge attacks on people / homeless facilities which are nearby the new Ulster University building (why she wants the CCTV).

Who can't say that? Surely all that anybody wants is the truth with proper justice served regardless of the implications for any particular group of people. If there is a cover up going on then it deserves to be exposed but the whole story just seems bizarre.

If the mother claims that she walked past the man who she suspects of the murder of her son on the street this morning, then it just adds to the peculiarity, innuendo and speculation surrounding the case.

No real proof. Hence why it's been buried.

If there is no proof how is she sure that this person actually killed Noah.

Would not wish this on anyone ever, but how can she be putting accusations like this out, either she knows factually which means there is something badly wrong here or she is just speculating which is doing her and the cause for justice a mis service.

When I say no real proof, I mean as in would secure a court conviction. But that doesn't necessarily mean you don't know who did it.

Quote from: nrico2006 on May 27, 2021, 02:32:31 PM
Are all stories not simply speculation, or is there anything that points towards druggies or loyalists?

The person who was arrested and charged for stealing his belongings just happens to be both a homeless drug addict and from a family of sc**bag loyalists. If you look into the family history you'll find relatives who were drug dealers, shot in loyalists feuds and murdered in loyalist feuds. It might just be coincidental that he's from a loyalist background and there might not be a sectarian element at all. Then again it is loyalists so you can't exactly rule it out.

It was at the weekend, no school uniform on him, no attached sign saying taig, I'm struggling with the timeline and route he took to go where he was meant to go.

It's very bizarre and unanswered so I personally can't see how he was singled out as a catholic and murdered because of it.

If someone could put up a logical run of events that led to this horrible episode I'd be better informed, way to sketchy for me

You don't need to have a uniform on or a sign saying you're a fenian. Scumbags on both sides are happy to make assumptions and sometimes they "strike lucky". Another St Malachy's pupil on a bike took a heavy beating not far from where Noah was found.

The botched investigation by the PSNI has left too many questions and not enough answers

Quote from: general_lee on May 27, 2021, 11:53:13 PM
You don't need to have a uniform on or a sign saying you're a fenian. Scumbags on both sides are happy to make assumptions and sometimes they "strike lucky". Another St Malachy's pupil on a bike took a heavy beating not far from where Noah was found.

The botched investigation by the PSNI has left too many questions and not enough answers

You said it was 'lucky' for loyalists gangs to catch a catholic, then they caught another... is there a data base on catholic kids that enter loyalist areas? This is not the 70's, 80's 90's.

I don't know how this happened, but I've asked for a timeline of events, all I've got is druggy or homeless person loyalists.. none of it makes sense.

Things are bad about this, no denying that,  I'm just struggling to see a sectarian side of it, and this being a person who was personally chased for being a catholic and feared for my life at the time, 25 years ago! That only came about because they worked out where I was from!

I hope or believe we are in a better time.

Bit of a twitter storm last night it seems on this with the new detective alleged to have told the mum that a witness has told them that the UDA were called to dispose of the body..

Must be awful for that poor woman..

Quote from: johnnycool on July 07, 2021, 08:49:51 AM
Bit of a twitter storm last night it seems on this with the new detective alleged to have told the mum that a witness has told them that the UDA were called to dispose of the body..

Must be awful for that poor woman..

This is nuts, if police have knowledge of this how come the coroner report gave a different report?

Will this women get any truth?

I was convinced that this was a tragic accident, it's getting worse by the day

Quote from: johnnycool on July 07, 2021, 08:49:51 AM
Bit of a twitter storm last night it seems on this with the new detective alleged to have told the mum that a witness has told them that the UDA were called to dispose of the body..

Must be awful for that poor woman..

I don't know what is going on but what she was saying on Twitter last night was incredible. She's not going to let it go but the PSNI and for the most part politicians have been eerily silent on this for whatever reason.

Quote from: trailer on July 07, 2021, 09:18:13 AM

Quote from: johnnycool on July 07, 2021, 08:49:51 AM
Bit of a twitter storm last night it seems on this with the new detective alleged to have told the mum that a witness has told them that the UDA were called to dispose of the body..

Must be awful for that poor woman..

I don't know what is going on but what she was saying on Twitter last night was incredible. She's not going to let it go but the PSNI and for the most part politicians have been eerily silent on this for whatever reason.

you can add most journalists to that list as well although your one Trish Devlin does give them some press and I think Channel 4 did an interview with the mum a month or so ago..

Don't even mention that entertainment show "Nolan", he's stayed well away from it.

The show MacIntyre is putting together will reveal a lot of shortcomings.

Think the detective who helped solve the Stephen Lawrence murder is part of it.

Quote from: Taylor on July 07, 2021, 09:38:34 AM
The show MacIntyre is putting together will reveal a lot of shortcomings.

Think the detective who helped solve the Stephen Lawrence murder is part of it.

This will be interesting.

Mcintyre will have the Chelsea Headhunters and the UDA after him....tho id say theres a degree of overlap with these groups...

Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 07, 2021, 10:32:11 AM
Mcintyre will have the Chelsea Headhunters and the UDA after him....tho id say theres a degree of overlap with these groups...

The son or the da?

The thing I can't square is the alleged assault/murder and the coroner said there was no obvious signs of injury. Before anyone starts with the RUC collusion angle, I don't buy it.

So are people saying he was beat to a pulp yet not a mark on him ?

Quote from: Saffrongael on July 07, 2021, 11:41:59 AM
The thing I can't square is the alleged assault/murder and the coroner said there was no obvious signs of injury. Before anyone starts with the RUC collusion angle, I don't buy it.

So are people saying he was beat to a pulp yet not a mark on him ?

I'm stuck on this also, as that would mean that the coroner is in on it also?

Quote from: johnnycool on July 07, 2021, 08:49:51 AM
Bit of a twitter storm last night it seems on this with the new detective alleged to have told the mum that a witness has told them that the UDA were called to dispose of the body..

Must be awful for that poor woman..

Did FD actually say this?

Lads what's going on here? This whole thing is mental. Maybe some Belfast posters can shed some light on this. Is the rumours that loyalists killed Noah?? Or is it a botch job by the PSNI?? I just don't know why they want to bury information on it

Quote from: Walter Cronc on July 29, 2022, 12:54:50 PM
Lads what's going on here? This whole thing is mental. Maybe some Belfast posters can shed some light on this. Is the rumours that loyalists killed Noah?? Or is it a botch job by the PSNI?? I just don't know why they want to bury information on it

My assumption is that he was killed by a loyalist who already had police protection. I doubt if anyone outside a small circle of police handlers and the loyalist know the truth. Otherwise Noah's mother would have found out by now.

In this day and age do we still have informants what actually do they need protection for? have the PSNI not learned from from the past that these people will say and do whatever they can to get whatever they can..

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 29, 2022, 01:23:11 PM
In this day and age do we still have informants what actually do they need protection for? have the PSNI not learned from from the past that these people will say and do whatever they can to get whatever they can..

The request for and granting of the PII would cast doubt on the PSNI's own version of events.

What or who are they covering up for?

If Gerry Kelly is highlighting it it's unlikely to be republicans.

The poor mother needs closure.

Quote from: imtommygunn on July 29, 2022, 01:50:55 PM
If Gerry Kelly is highlighting it it's unlikely to be republicans.

The poor mother needs closure.

I'm still struggling with why we still have to use informants and if we are why are they being protected when they have been involved in a murder? So it begs the question why would the PSNI put themselves through this as it will be uncovered

PSNI have made a complete shit-show of this, they're protecting someone or covering something up. None of what happened Noah makes any sense (going by PSNI version of events). I hate to make assumptions but I think his body was put in the storm drain, only plausible reason for him being found there.

I would imagine in most countries you have informants. It wouldn't be specific to ours.

The worst thing is I don't know if this will be uncovered.

Quote from: imtommygunn on July 29, 2022, 01:58:35 PM
I would imagine in most countries you have informants. It wouldn't be specific to ours.

The worst thing is I don't know if this will be uncovered.

I understand that, but how many countries will allow them to commit murder (like that have done here for years) and cover up their actions?

How many people would be involved in this cover up?

How come it seems to have increased again in the last couple of days? I know it is an ongoing thing and rightly so but every so often it appears some momentum gathers, has something happened? P1ss poor english but hopefully yous know what i mean

Would the coroner not have picked up on any foul play when the autopsy was done ?

The new SOS has just signed a PII (Public Interest Immunity) certificate, one of her first acts

Really strange what is going on here

The whole thing seems strange and the PII just adds to it.  I can't imagine what the conspiracy is though - if it was informant related surely a grown man didn't just randomly attack/kill a young fella in broad day light for no reason.  Also, are informants completely immune from prosecution?  Surely there are processes in place to deal with informants who do serious crimes.

My assumption this whole time was that loyalists or their kids had chased/killed Noah and put him in the storm drain. However the other day (on twitter obv) I had a loyalist tell me that they're looking at it being someone from one of the local hostels that did it and that the family are even suspecting this. Never heard anything about this other than from this one twitter account and a few of their followers so it's obviously not reliable. A very strange case all in all though.

Needs a full public inquiry that's for sure.

There are a lot of unanswered questions.

God love Noah's mother.

Quote from: markl121 on July 29, 2022, 03:25:59 PM
My assumption this whole time was that loyalists or their kids had chased/killed Noah and put him in the storm drain. However the other day (on twitter obv) I had a loyalist tell me that they're looking at it being someone from one of the local hostels that did it and that the family are even suspecting this. Never heard anything about this other than from this one twitter account and a few of their followers so it's obviously not reliable. A very strange case all in all though.

It's been in the public domain for a while I think that a homeless person was seen attacking him at some stage, so that hit isn't new. I think some are creaming themselves hoping it's a loyalist though

Quote from: nrico2006 on July 29, 2022, 03:24:09 PM
The whole thing seems strange and the PII just adds to it.  I can't imagine what the conspiracy is though - if it was informant related surely a grown man didn't just randomly attack/kill a young fella in broad day light for no reason.  Also, are informants completely immune from prosecution?  Surely there are processes in place to deal with informants who do serious crimes.

you cant be too sure in this part of the world. 

If it was a homeless person then wth is the PII angle

I just don't get it

Quote from: smort on July 29, 2022, 04:31:36 PM
If it was a homeless person then wth is the PII angle

I just don't get it

This is what I was thinking. Its all so weird

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 29, 2022, 01:55:36 PM

Quote from: imtommygunn on July 29, 2022, 01:50:55 PM
If Gerry Kelly is highlighting it it's unlikely to be republicans.

The poor mother needs closure.

I'm still struggling with why we still have to use informants and if we are why are they being protected when they have been involved in a murder? So it begs the question why would the PSNI put themselves through this as it will be uncovered

Did you watch Starsky & Hutch (aka Car keys & Clutch)? They had Huggy Bear.

Informants have been used by the authoritys for a very long time, and I don't see it stopping soon. We all know that the UDA and UVF are very active with drug dealing etc etc and are prone to shooting each other. So I guess the police want to find out what is happening in the loyalist communities.

Quote from: Kidder81 on July 29, 2022, 02:52:43 PM
Would the coroner not have picked up on any foul play when the autopsy was done ?

Good point.  Surely if foul play was suspected, then the post-mortem would have confirmed that.  The young lad was found naked in a storm drain, I'd be pretty certain he did not go there on his own, or as someone said earlier, his body was placed there.  Public Enquiry needed, it is beyond weird at this stage.  God help the poor mother, horrific.

Quote from: balladmaker on July 29, 2022, 09:36:02 PM

Quote from: Kidder81 on July 29, 2022, 02:52:43 PM
Would the coroner not have picked up on any foul play when the autopsy was done ?

Good point.  Surely if foul play was suspected, then the post-mortem would have confirmed that.  The young lad was found naked in a storm drain, I'd be pretty certain he did not go there on his own, or as someone said earlier, his body was placed there.  Public Enquiry needed, it is beyond weird at this stage.  God help the poor mother, horrific.

Was he not seen by members of the public cycling naked through the streets? Or is that incorrect?

Quote from: imtommygunn on July 29, 2022, 01:58:35 PM
I would imagine in most countries you have informants. It wouldn't be specific to ours.

The worst thing is I don't know if this will be uncovered.

Policing in the north  is "special".
Someone is obviously more important than the child's poor mother.

Quote from: trileacman on July 29, 2022, 09:51:48 PM

Quote from: balladmaker on July 29, 2022, 09:36:02 PM

Quote from: Kidder81 on July 29, 2022, 02:52:43 PM
Would the coroner not have picked up on any foul play when the autopsy was done ?

Good point.  Surely if foul play was suspected, then the post-mortem would have confirmed that.  The young lad was found naked in a storm drain, I'd be pretty certain he did not go there on his own, or as someone said earlier, his body was placed there.  Public Enquiry needed, it is beyond weird at this stage.  God help the poor mother, horrific.

Was he not seen by members of the public cycling naked through the streets? Or is that incorrect?

Is this not true? As for him being attacked etc., did his post-mortem reveal injuries?

Quote from: nrico2006 on July 30, 2022, 11:14:58 AM

Quote from: trileacman on July 29, 2022, 09:51:48 PM

Quote from: balladmaker on July 29, 2022, 09:36:02 PM

Quote from: Kidder81 on July 29, 2022, 02:52:43 PM
Would the coroner not have picked up on any foul play when the autopsy was done ?

Good point.  Surely if foul play was suspected, then the post-mortem would have confirmed that.  The young lad was found naked in a storm drain, I'd be pretty certain he did not go there on his own, or as someone said earlier, his body was placed there.  Public Enquiry needed, it is beyond weird at this stage.  God help the poor mother, horrific.

Was he not seen by members of the public cycling naked through the streets? Or is that incorrect?

Is this not true? As for him being attacked etc., did his post-mortem reveal injuries?

I think the coroner said "no obvious signs of foul play".

Having had occasion to be on Northwood Drive over the last year I just cannot fathom how that child cycled down there naked without hundreds of sightings in the early part of a summer evening.

There must be close to 300 houses on the Drive all leading to an end cul-de-sac where he'd have had to force his way past the side of a house to gain access to that storm drain.

Dozens of kids / parents etc out in the street with the weather - there's nothing about it makes sense.

Quote from: Will it ever end on July 31, 2022, 02:27:33 PM
Having had occasion to be on Northwood Drive over the last year I just cannot fathom how that child cycled down there naked without hundreds of sightings in the early part of a summer evening.

There must be close to 300 houses on the Drive all leading to an end cul-de-sac where he'd have had to force his way past the side of a house to gain access to that storm drain.

Dozens of kids / parents etc out in the street with the weather - there's nothing about it makes sense.

As bizarre as it is, I'm struggling to know why the coroner (who's roles is pasted below) would risk giving a decision like he did at the time.

"coroners are independent judicial officers who investigate deaths reported to them. They will make whatever inquiries are necessary to find out the cause of death, this includes ordering a post-mortem examination, obtaining witness statements and medical records, or holding an inquest"

The police have form in hiding the murders of informants in the past, I just can't fathom why they would do it now.

Also as you say if hundreds of people seen him, have they been also silenced?

It looks like a stitch up kept in place by fear and police weakness.

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2022, 02:46:06 PM

Quote from: Will it ever end on July 31, 2022, 02:27:33 PM
Having had occasion to be on Northwood Drive over the last year I just cannot fathom how that child cycled down there naked without hundreds of sightings in the early part of a summer evening.

There must be close to 300 houses on the Drive all leading to an end cul-de-sac where he'd have had to force his way past the side of a house to gain access to that storm drain.

Dozens of kids / parents etc out in the street with the weather - there's nothing about it makes sense.

As bizarre as it is, I'm struggling to know why the coroner (who's roles is pasted below) would risk giving a decision like he did at the time.

"coroners are independent judicial officers who investigate deaths reported to them. They will make whatever inquiries are necessary to find out the cause of death, this includes ordering a post-mortem examination, obtaining witness statements and medical records, or holding an inquest"

The police have form in hiding the murders of informants in the past, I just can't fathom why they would do it now.

Also as you say if hundreds of people seen him, have they been also silenced?

Truthfully, and I hate to speculate, but I think he was hiding in there because something had happened and got trapped or something. I am not convinced the coroner's report is wrong but it's the bit leading up to it.

Quote from: seafoid on July 31, 2022, 04:53:03 PM
It looks like a stitch up kept in place by fear and police weakness.

Is the coroner involved in the stitch up ?

Quote from: markl121 on July 29, 2022, 03:25:59 PM
My assumption this whole time was that loyalists or their kids had chased/killed Noah and put him in the storm drain. However the other day (on twitter obv) I had a loyalist tell me that they're looking at it being someone from one of the local hostels that did it and that the family are even suspecting this. Never heard anything about this other than from this one twitter account and a few of their followers so it's obviously not reliable. A very strange case all in all though.

not sure if it's been mentioned on here before but Fiona donohoe went on the James English podcast, worth a listen

Quote from: imtommygunn on July 31, 2022, 05:22:09 PM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2022, 02:46:06 PM

Quote from: Will it ever end on July 31, 2022, 02:27:33 PM
Having had occasion to be on Northwood Drive over the last year I just cannot fathom how that child cycled down there naked without hundreds of sightings in the early part of a summer evening.

There must be close to 300 houses on the Drive all leading to an end cul-de-sac where he'd have had to force his way past the side of a house to gain access to that storm drain.

Dozens of kids / parents etc out in the street with the weather - there's nothing about it makes sense.

As bizarre as it is, I'm struggling to know why the coroner (who's roles is pasted below) would risk giving a decision like he did at the time.

"coroners are independent judicial officers who investigate deaths reported to them. They will make whatever inquiries are necessary to find out the cause of death, this includes ordering a post-mortem examination, obtaining witness statements and medical records, or holding an inquest"

The police have form in hiding the murders of informants in the past, I just can't fathom why they would do it now.

Also as you say if hundreds of people seen him, have they been also silenced?

Truthfully, and I hate to speculate, but I think he was hiding in there because something had happened and got trapped or something. I am not convinced the coroner's report is wrong but it's the bit leading up to it.

That's what I thought too. Too large-scale for a cover-up and to what end really?

Quote from: Kidder81 on July 31, 2022, 06:01:13 PM

Quote from: seafoid on July 31, 2022, 04:53:03 PM
It looks like a stitch up kept in place by fear and police weakness.

Is the coroner involved in the stitch up ?

How come the family hasn't gotten any closure?

Quote from: seafoid on July 31, 2022, 09:14:07 PM

Quote from: Kidder81 on July 31, 2022, 06:01:13 PM

Quote from: seafoid on July 31, 2022, 04:53:03 PM
It looks like a stitch up kept in place by fear and police weakness.

Is the coroner involved in the stitch up ?

How come the family hasn't gotten any closure?

Unfortunately in the north there are hundreds that haven't got closure...

If they have covered something up I really hope they get the 'truth' I've no idea what happened and couldn't comment on it... there are some on here who have better inside knowledge on things.

Couldn't imagine the agony Noah's mum is going through, I just hope that when this PII happens that it will give whatever closure she needs

Quote from: Saffrongael on July 07, 2021, 11:41:59 AM
The thing I can't square is the alleged assault/murder and the coroner said there was no obvious signs of injury. Before anyone starts with the RUC collusion angle, I don't buy it.

So are people saying he was beat to a pulp yet not a mark on him ?

Maybe this is squared by reasoning that some of the things said/alleged are not true?

A young lad dies, chances are something wrong has happened. We might never know the truth.

As for conspiracies I see no evidence of that.

People seem to be taking the existence of a PII as a justification for making up any bullshit conspiracy theory. We have PIIs in NI and we all know the reason why we have to have them and why some "community representatives" don't like them. I do hope that those pushing against PIIs are not stringing the family along to suit their own political agenda.

Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 31, 2022, 10:22:09 PM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 31, 2022, 09:29:37 PM

Quote from: seafoid on July 31, 2022, 09:14:07 PM

Quote from: Kidder81 on July 31, 2022, 06:01:13 PM

Quote from: seafoid on July 31, 2022, 04:53:03 PM
It looks like a stitch up kept in place by fear and police weakness.

Is the coroner involved in the stitch up ?

How come the family hasn't gotten any closure?

Unfortunately in the north there are hundreds that haven't got closure...

If they have covered something up I really hope they get the 'truth' I've no idea what happened and couldn't comment on it... there are some on here who have better inside knowledge on things.

Couldn't imagine the agony Noah's mum is going through, I just hope that when this PII happens that it will give whatever closure she needs

??
What is it that you think PII stands for and what do you mean "when it happens"?

I assumed it was more information on things.. but an enquiry would, if it happens, be better snd possibly closure

PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

There ya go... I thought it was getting information out there...

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 01, 2022, 08:27:17 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

Agreed. The family deserve to know and now the public want to but the only people that deserve to know are that poor wee boy's family. I suspect there is a good bit of incompetence going on here from a PSNI perspective too though there is definitely something not right too.

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 08:39:06 AM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 01, 2022, 08:27:17 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

Agreed. The family deserve to know and now the public want to but the only people that deserve to know are that poor wee boy's family. I suspect there is a good bit of incompetence going on here from a PSNI perspective too though there is definitely something not right too.

Every victim's family deserve to know. But people seem to be jumping to the conclusion that something is known by the police about the the circumstances of the death and the identity of the perpetrator
/perpetrators. That is a big assumption.

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 09:44:07 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 08:39:06 AM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 01, 2022, 08:27:17 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

Agreed. The family deserve to know and now the public want to but the only people that deserve to know are that poor wee boy's family. I suspect there is a good bit of incompetence going on here from a PSNI perspective too though there is definitely something not right too.

Every victim's family deserve to know. But people seem to be jumping to the conclusion that something is known by the police about the the circumstances of the death and the identity of the perpetrator
/perpetrators. That is a big assumption.

Would there be a need for a PII if there wasn't something?

Quote from: Will it ever end on July 31, 2022, 02:27:33 PM
Having had occasion to be on Northwood Drive over the last year I just cannot fathom how that child cycled down there naked without hundreds of sightings in the early part of a summer evening.

There must be close to 300 houses on the Drive all leading to an end cul-de-sac where he'd have had to force his way past the side of a house to gain access to that storm drain.

Dozens of kids / parents etc out in the street with the weather - there's nothing about it makes sense.

There's a house at the end of that street blurred out on Google Maps ... I wonder why?

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 01, 2022, 08:27:17 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

It shouldn't be on twitter. It shouldn't be on the  gaaboard.
It should have been resolved. Why hasn't it ?

Quote from: WT4E on August 01, 2022, 11:13:36 AM

Quote from: Will it ever end on July 31, 2022, 02:27:33 PM
Having had occasion to be on Northwood Drive over the last year I just cannot fathom how that child cycled down there naked without hundreds of sightings in the early part of a summer evening.

There must be close to 300 houses on the Drive all leading to an end cul-de-sac where he'd have had to force his way past the side of a house to gain access to that storm drain.

Dozens of kids / parents etc out in the street with the weather - there's nothing about it makes sense.

There's a house at the end of that street blurred out on Google Maps ... I wonder why?

So there is!

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 11:06:31 AM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 09:44:07 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 08:39:06 AM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 01, 2022, 08:27:17 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

Agreed. The family deserve to know and now the public want to but the only people that deserve to know are that poor wee boy's family. I suspect there is a good bit of incompetence going on here from a PSNI perspective too though there is definitely something not right too.

Every victim's family deserve to know. But people seem to be jumping to the conclusion that something is known by the police about the the circumstances of the death and the identity of the perpetrator
/perpetrators. That is a big assumption.

Would there be a need for a PII if there wasn't something?

Very possibly.

Have you any evidence that it's the perpetrator ID that is being withheld?

There are any number of other things that could be the subject of the PII certificate. But it's likely (given the history of PIIs) that it's something to do with keeping the identity of informants/agents and their handlers secret. Withholding documents that disclose or heavily suggest their identity would be withheld on PII grounds. The same applies to the justification for redactions. The Noah case is not different in this respect.

Put it another way try finishing the following sentence

"Those who believe that the PII relates to the identity of the perpetrator but have no evidence to back that up are not conspiracy theorists because ......"

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 11:45:20 AM

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 11:06:31 AM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 09:44:07 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 08:39:06 AM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 01, 2022, 08:27:17 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

Agreed. The family deserve to know and now the public want to but the only people that deserve to know are that poor wee boy's family. I suspect there is a good bit of incompetence going on here from a PSNI perspective too though there is definitely something not right too.

Every victim's family deserve to know. But people seem to be jumping to the conclusion that something is known by the police about the the circumstances of the death and the identity of the perpetrator
/perpetrators. That is a big assumption.

Would there be a need for a PII if there wasn't something?

Very possibly.

Have you any evidence that it's the perpetrator ID that is being withheld?

There are any number of other things that could be the subject of the PII certificate. But it's likely (given the history of PIIs) that it's something to do with keeping the identity of informants/agents and their handlers secret. Withholding documents that disclose or heavily suggest their identity would be withheld on PII grounds. The same applies to the justification for redactions. The Noah case is not different in this respect.

Put it another way try finishing the following sentence

"Those who believe that the PII relates to the identity of the perpetrator but have no evidence to back that up are not conspiracy theorists because ......"

Ok so we think the most likely reason for the PII is to 
"something to do with keeping the identity of informants/agents and their handlers secret". So what other than this informant/agent being involved somewhere in this process would be a likely scenario other than being involved in the death directly? I can't think of any but very open to listening to any you have?

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 11:45:20 AM

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 11:06:31 AM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 09:44:07 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 08:39:06 AM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 01, 2022, 08:27:17 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

Agreed. The family deserve to know and now the public want to but the only people that deserve to know are that poor wee boy's family. I suspect there is a good bit of incompetence going on here from a PSNI perspective too though there is definitely something not right too.

Every victim's family deserve to know. But people seem to be jumping to the conclusion that something is known by the police about the the circumstances of the death and the identity of the perpetrator
/perpetrators. That is a big assumption.

Would there be a need for a PII if there wasn't something?

Very possibly.

Have you any evidence that it's the perpetrator ID that is being withheld?

There are any number of other things that could be the subject of the PII certificate. But it's likely (given the history of PIIs) that it's something to do with keeping the identity of informants/agents and their handlers secret. Withholding documents that disclose or heavily suggest their identity would be withheld on PII grounds. The same applies to the justification for redactions. The Noah case is not different in this respect.

Put it another way try finishing the following sentence

"Those who believe that the PII relates to the identity of the perpetrator but have no evidence to back that up are not conspiracy theorists because ......"

Or to put it another way

"What are the police protecting that is more important than the murder of a child?"

I will await your suggestions

Quote from: WT4E on August 01, 2022, 11:13:36 AM

Quote from: Will it ever end on July 31, 2022, 02:27:33 PM
Having had occasion to be on Northwood Drive over the last year I just cannot fathom how that child cycled down there naked without hundreds of sightings in the early part of a summer evening.

There must be close to 300 houses on the Drive all leading to an end cul-de-sac where he'd have had to force his way past the side of a house to gain access to that storm drain.

Dozens of kids / parents etc out in the street with the weather - there's nothing about it makes sense.

There's a house at the end of that street blurred out on Google Maps ... I wonder why?

Because the owner requested it? Anyone can request their house to get blurred out.

Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on August 01, 2022, 12:18:27 PM

Quote from: WT4E on August 01, 2022, 11:13:36 AM

Quote from: Will it ever end on July 31, 2022, 02:27:33 PM
Having had occasion to be on Northwood Drive over the last year I just cannot fathom how that child cycled down there naked without hundreds of sightings in the early part of a summer evening.

There must be close to 300 houses on the Drive all leading to an end cul-de-sac where he'd have had to force his way past the side of a house to gain access to that storm drain.

Dozens of kids / parents etc out in the street with the weather - there's nothing about it makes sense.

There's a house at the end of that street blurred out on Google Maps ... I wonder why?

Because the owner requested it? Anyone can request their house to get blurred out.

Yeah I know that but why I wonder?

Whilst there are 100s of cases over the last 100 years. The Noah case could well be the straw that breaks the camels back in relation of policing practices of the wee state.

Quote from: WT4E on August 01, 2022, 12:29:52 PM

Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on August 01, 2022, 12:18:27 PM

Quote from: WT4E on August 01, 2022, 11:13:36 AM

Quote from: Will it ever end on July 31, 2022, 02:27:33 PM
Having had occasion to be on Northwood Drive over the last year I just cannot fathom how that child cycled down there naked without hundreds of sightings in the early part of a summer evening.

There must be close to 300 houses on the Drive all leading to an end cul-de-sac where he'd have had to force his way past the side of a house to gain access to that storm drain.

Dozens of kids / parents etc out in the street with the weather - there's nothing about it makes sense.

There's a house at the end of that street blurred out on Google Maps ... I wonder why?

Because the owner requested it? Anyone can request their house to get blurred out.

Yeah I know that but why I wonder?

there have been burglaries off the back of images on google (more earth than maps). Maybe some people are paranoid. Or maybe more to it haha. Who knows.

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 11:45:20 AM
"Those who believe that the PII relates to the identity of the perpetrator but have no evidence to back that up are not conspiracy theorists because ......"

So you'd sooner accuse people of being conspiracy theorists because they've no evidence to back up their claims but will happily accept the PSNI version of events despite them having also having zero evidence to back up theirs?

Quote from: general_lee on August 01, 2022, 02:35:19 PM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 11:45:20 AM
"Those who believe that the PII relates to the identity of the perpetrator but have no evidence to back that up are not conspiracy theorists because ......"

So you'd sooner accuse people of being conspiracy theorists because they've no evidence to back up their claims but will happily accept the PSNI version of events despite them having also having zero evidence to back up theirs?

I haven't accepted anyone's version.

I am not the one jumping to conclusions

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 12:09:58 PM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 11:45:20 AM

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 11:06:31 AM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 09:44:07 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 08:39:06 AM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 01, 2022, 08:27:17 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

Agreed. The family deserve to know and now the public want to but the only people that deserve to know are that poor wee boy's family. I suspect there is a good bit of incompetence going on here from a PSNI perspective too though there is definitely something not right too.

Every victim's family deserve to know. But people seem to be jumping to the conclusion that something is known by the police about the the circumstances of the death and the identity of the perpetrator
/perpetrators. That is a big assumption.

Would there be a need for a PII if there wasn't something?

Very possibly.

Have you any evidence that it's the perpetrator ID that is being withheld?

There are any number of other things that could be the subject of the PII certificate. But it's likely (given the history of PIIs) that it's something to do with keeping the identity of informants/agents and their handlers secret. Withholding documents that disclose or heavily suggest their identity would be withheld on PII grounds. The same applies to the justification for redactions. The Noah case is not different in this respect.

Put it another way try finishing the following sentence

"Those who believe that the PII relates to the identity of the perpetrator but have no evidence to back that up are not conspiracy theorists because ......"

Ok so we think the most likely reason for the PII is to 
"something to do with keeping the identity of informants/agents and their handlers secret". So what other than this informant/agent being involved somewhere in this process would be a likely scenario other than being involved in the death directly? I can't think of any but very open to listening to any you have?

At a guess the documents/details with a document relate to the feelers the cops put out to see if any informant knew anything. There is no way that would be released to the family. There is your PII right there.

To be absolutely clear PSNI use informants. Especially in areas of high crime. Several groups do not like this. My understanding is that the PSNI have very little to go on in the Noah case. If you look at where the crime occurred it is clear that there will be informants in the surrounding area. If it's true that the case flummoxed the cops it's very, very likely that they will have shaken down every street source they had. That info cannot be released.

So when I hear there is a PII cert my instinct is that there is bound to be. If you want to elevate it above that show me some evidence? Something other than a conspiracy theory

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 03:29:34 PM

Quote from: general_lee on August 01, 2022, 02:35:19 PM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 11:45:20 AM
"Those who believe that the PII relates to the identity of the perpetrator but have no evidence to back that up are not conspiracy theorists because ......"

So you'd sooner accuse people of being conspiracy theorists because they've no evidence to back up their claims but will happily accept the PSNI version of events despite them having also having zero evidence to back up theirs?

I haven't accepted anyone's version.

I am not the one jumping to conclusions

My take, foul play and coverup

Evidence, murder and PII

There is a very clear conspiracy to coverup via the PII

Also not jumping to conclusions

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 03:37:27 PM

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 12:09:58 PM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 11:45:20 AM

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 11:06:31 AM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 09:44:07 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 08:39:06 AM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 01, 2022, 08:27:17 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

Agreed. The family deserve to know and now the public want to but the only people that deserve to know are that poor wee boy's family. I suspect there is a good bit of incompetence going on here from a PSNI perspective too though there is definitely something not right too.

Every victim's family deserve to know. But people seem to be jumping to the conclusion that something is known by the police about the the circumstances of the death and the identity of the perpetrator
/perpetrators. That is a big assumption.

Would there be a need for a PII if there wasn't something?

Very possibly.

Have you any evidence that it's the perpetrator ID that is being withheld?

There are any number of other things that could be the subject of the PII certificate. But it's likely (given the history of PIIs) that it's something to do with keeping the identity of informants/agents and their handlers secret. Withholding documents that disclose or heavily suggest their identity would be withheld on PII grounds. The same applies to the justification for redactions. The Noah case is not different in this respect.

Put it another way try finishing the following sentence

"Those who believe that the PII relates to the identity of the perpetrator but have no evidence to back that up are not conspiracy theorists because ......"

Ok so we think the most likely reason for the PII is to 
"something to do with keeping the identity of informants/agents and their handlers secret". So what other than this informant/agent being involved somewhere in this process would be a likely scenario other than being involved in the death directly? I can't think of any but very open to listening to any you have?

At a guess the documents/details with a document relate to the feelers the cops put out to see if any informant knew anything. There is no way that would be released to the family. There is your PII right there.

To be absolutely clear PSNI use informants. Especially in areas of high crime. Several groups do not like this. My understanding is that the PSNI have very little to go on in the Noah case. If you look at where the crime occurred it is clear that there will be informants in the surrounding area. If it's true that the case flummoxed the cops it's very, very likely that they will have shaken down every street source they had. That info cannot be released.

So when I hear there is a PII cert my instinct is that there is bound to be. If you want to elevate it above that show me some evidence? Something other than a conspiracy theory

But that's the point. There is no evidence of your version either. Your version is as much a theory as any other. In fact it would be infinitely easier to redact certain documents/ or to use code names of informers on documents regarding interviews etc which they do, than to allow this whole media circus to gather pace to a stage where it is not going to disappear and has added to peoples feelings regarding cover ups. Provide me with evidence that your version is more likely and We'll talk. Leave out the condescending  conspiracy theory remarks though.

To me I just labour back to my original point - he's a black male cycling naked up Northwood Road which is effectively a dead end - he has to struggle past the side of a house in the broad daylight to make it to the storm drain - there is no way I can believe he wasn't spotted in this area dozens of times.

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 04:02:38 PM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 03:37:27 PM

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 12:09:58 PM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 11:45:20 AM

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 11:06:31 AM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 01, 2022, 09:44:07 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 08:39:06 AM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 01, 2022, 08:27:17 AM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 01, 2022, 07:56:27 AM
PII= no disclosure of information. (Public interest immunity)

It's the reversal of that they need. I am not sure they will ever get it >:(

You read on Twitter people saying "we deserve to know". We don't- the mother does. That poor woman.

The "movement" on Twitter has some loons in its ranks, which doesent help at times

Agreed. The family deserve to know and now the public want to but the only people that deserve to know are that poor wee boy's family. I suspect there is a good bit of incompetence going on here from a PSNI perspective too though there is definitely something not right too.

Every victim's family deserve to know. But people seem to be jumping to the conclusion that something is known by the police about the the circumstances of the death and the identity of the perpetrator
/perpetrators. That is a big assumption.

Would there be a need for a PII if there wasn't something?

Very possibly.

Have you any evidence that it's the perpetrator ID that is being withheld?

There are any number of other things that could be the subject of the PII certificate. But it's likely (given the history of PIIs) that it's something to do with keeping the identity of informants/agents and their handlers secret. Withholding documents that disclose or heavily suggest their identity would be withheld on PII grounds. The same applies to the justification for redactions. The Noah case is not different in this respect.

Put it another way try finishing the following sentence

"Those who believe that the PII relates to the identity of the perpetrator but have no evidence to back that up are not conspiracy theorists because ......"

Ok so we think the most likely reason for the PII is to 
"something to do with keeping the identity of informants/agents and their handlers secret". So what other than this informant/agent being involved somewhere in this process would be a likely scenario other than being involved in the death directly? I can't think of any but very open to listening to any you have?

At a guess the documents/details with a document relate to the feelers the cops put out to see if any informant knew anything. There is no way that would be released to the family. There is your PII right there.

To be absolutely clear PSNI use informants. Especially in areas of high crime. Several groups do not like this. My understanding is that the PSNI have very little to go on in the Noah case. If you look at where the crime occurred it is clear that there will be informants in the surrounding area. If it's true that the case flummoxed the cops it's very, very likely that they will have shaken down every street source they had. That info cannot be released.

So when I hear there is a PII cert my instinct is that there is bound to be. If you want to elevate it above that show me some evidence? Something other than a conspiracy theory

But that's the point. There is no evidence of your version either. Your version is as much a theory as any other. In fact it would be infinitely easier to redact certain documents/ or to use code names of informers on documents regarding interviews etc which they do, than to allow this whole media circus to gather pace to a stage where it is not going to disappear and has added to peoples feelings regarding cover ups. Provide me with evidence that your version is more likely and We'll talk. Leave out the condescending  conspiracy theory remarks though.

I think you have missed the point completely.

I put forward a version. An alternative version. I am not saying it is true or asking you to believe it. I merely point out that many are making claims here that that have nothing to back up.

As for redactions and code names again you miss the point. You can't just redact. You have to have a reason. One such reason being Public Interest Immunity.

What is it that the police claim happened to Noah?

I didn't miss the point. I haven't said anything about what  I think happened. I'm open minded. It was you that wanted to close down one possible scenario by labelling it conspiracy theory. When it's no more theory than your own.

Quote from: Caesar on August 01, 2022, 04:54:52 PM
What is it that the police claim happened to Noah?

He fell off his bike, knocked his head on the road which caused him to strip off and then ride his bike for another few miles before climbing in behind some houses and then way up inside a storm drain that's allegedly pretty narrow and the tide comes up it twice a day...

Quote from: johnnycool on August 01, 2022, 05:05:50 PM

Quote from: Caesar on August 01, 2022, 04:54:52 PM
What is it that the police claim happened to Noah?

He fell off his bike, knocked his head on the road which caused him to strip off and then ride his bike for another few miles before climbing in behind some houses and then way up inside a storm drain that's allegedly pretty narrow and the tide comes up it twice a day...

Which, while highly unusual and very rare, is not implausible. Similar has happened before.

However, the PII is a clear admission that something is being covered up.

Smelmoth's rationale is a load of nonsense imo. Police all over the world use informants, the investigation is not public record so a PII (or similar) is not required to keep the names of those informants a secret.
If it turns out an informant is a suspect, then you might need a PII.

Quote from: Hound on August 01, 2022, 06:27:44 PM

Quote from: johnnycool on August 01, 2022, 05:05:50 PM

Quote from: Caesar on August 01, 2022, 04:54:52 PM
What is it that the police claim happened to Noah?

He fell off his bike, knocked his head on the road which caused him to strip off and then ride his bike for another few miles before climbing in behind some houses and then way up inside a storm drain that's allegedly pretty narrow and the tide comes up it twice a day...

Which, while highly unusual and very rare, is not implausible. Similar has happened before.

However, the PII is a clear admission that something is being covered up.

Smelmoth's rationale is a load of nonsense imo. Police all over the world use informants, the investigation is not public record so a PII (or similar) is not required to keep the names of those informants a secret.
If it turns out an informant is a suspect, then you might need a PII.

A suspect for what? foul play?

The fact that the PSNI felt the need to apply and get a PII casts major doubt on the story they're trying to peddle on this poor lads death.

I don't know if there's Loyalist paramilitaries involved or not, but there's definitely something not right about this and why go to these lengths to cover something up.

Quote from: Will it ever end on August 01, 2022, 04:20:06 PM
To me I just labour back to my original point - he's a black male cycling naked up Northwood Road which is effectively a dead end - he has to struggle past the side of a house in the broad daylight to make it to the storm drain - there is no way I can believe he wasn't spotted in this area dozens of times.

And travelled a kilometre up a narrow storm drain!!!

Quote from: johnnycool on August 02, 2022, 08:46:34 AM

Quote from: Hound on August 01, 2022, 06:27:44 PM

Quote from: johnnycool on August 01, 2022, 05:05:50 PM

Quote from: Caesar on August 01, 2022, 04:54:52 PM
What is it that the police claim happened to Noah?

He fell off his bike, knocked his head on the road which caused him to strip off and then ride his bike for another few miles before climbing in behind some houses and then way up inside a storm drain that's allegedly pretty narrow and the tide comes up it twice a day...

Which, while highly unusual and very rare, is not implausible. Similar has happened before.

However, the PII is a clear admission that something is being covered up.

Smelmoth's rationale is a load of nonsense imo. Police all over the world use informants, the investigation is not public record so a PII (or similar) is not required to keep the names of those informants a secret.
If it turns out an informant is a suspect, then you might need a PII.

A suspect for what? foul play?

The fact that the PSNI felt the need to apply and get a PII casts major doubt on the story they're trying to peddle on this poor lads death.

I don't know if there's Loyalist paramilitaries involved or not, but there's definitely something not right about this and why go to these lengths to cover something up.

Something isn't right here at all and now a poor woman doesn't know what happened to her son. I wouldn't rule out significant amounts of incompetence either tbh.

Quote from: WT4E on August 02, 2022, 08:46:41 AM

Quote from: Will it ever end on August 01, 2022, 04:20:06 PM
To me I just labour back to my original point - he's a black male cycling naked up Northwood Road which is effectively a dead end - he has to struggle past the side of a house in the broad daylight to make it to the storm drain - there is no way I can believe he wasn't spotted in this area dozens of times.

And travelled a kilometre up a narrow storm drain!!!

Was he a KM up the drain?  How wide was the drain?

Quote from: johnnycool on August 02, 2022, 08:46:34 AM

Quote from: Hound on August 01, 2022, 06:27:44 PM

Quote from: johnnycool on August 01, 2022, 05:05:50 PM

Quote from: Caesar on August 01, 2022, 04:54:52 PM
What is it that the police claim happened to Noah?

He fell off his bike, knocked his head on the road which caused him to strip off and then ride his bike for another few miles before climbing in behind some houses and then way up inside a storm drain that's allegedly pretty narrow and the tide comes up it twice a day...

Which, while highly unusual and very rare, is not implausible. Similar has happened before.

However, the PII is a clear admission that something is being covered up.

Smelmoth's rationale is a load of nonsense imo. Police all over the world use informants, the investigation is not public record so a PII (or similar) is not required to keep the names of those informants a secret.
If it turns out an informant is a suspect, then you might need a PII.

A suspect for what? foul play?

The fact that the PSNI felt the need to apply and get a PII casts major doubt on the story they're trying to peddle on this poor lads death.

I don't know if there's Loyalist paramilitaries involved or not, but there's definitely something not right about this and why go to these lengths to cover something up.

Which of his possessions are still missing ?

Quote from: nrico2006 on August 02, 2022, 03:03:10 PM

Quote from: WT4E on August 02, 2022, 08:46:41 AM

Quote from: Will it ever end on August 01, 2022, 04:20:06 PM
To me I just labour back to my original point - he's a black male cycling naked up Northwood Road which is effectively a dead end - he has to struggle past the side of a house in the broad daylight to make it to the storm drain - there is no way I can believe he wasn't spotted in this area dozens of times.

And travelled a kilometre up a narrow storm drain!!!

Was he a KM up the drain?  How wide was the drain?

Below is from Noah's aunt, this is on her Twitter page if anyone doubts the source. There is a lot of factual info on this case on social media through Fiona (who was mysteriously blocked on Twitter for a period of time) and her sister. I would encourage everyone to seek it out, this case stinks to high heaven. So many simple questions not answered by PSNI.

1. At this stage people are forgetting the elephant in the room being the stormdrain,the PSNI and Coroner claim Noah climbed into and crawled 950km over debris, manmade obstructions, around corners through a possible massive chamber to get to the place he was found.
2. Noah was naked, in pitch darkness. The tunnel is made of concrete and not even a metre in Diameter for most of it and slightly more than a metre in parts. His body, torso, knees, arms, elbows etc would have been badly cut due to the concrete and contents of the stormdrain.
3. Noah had no such damage on his body. No cuts other than two small lateral scrapes on each arm. Due to where he allegedly was for 6 days and the tidal water that fulled that tunnel twice a day, submerging Noahs whole body in water.  The strength of that spring tide would have
4. Pulled a body out of the tunnel but  also, the effect of being in water for 6days would have been catastrophic. The only water damage to Noahs body was his hands and feet⁉️⁉️⁉️⁉️⁉️
6 days in a stormdrain with no rodent damage or insect damage⁉️⁉️⁉️⁉️
5.6days in water with sewage, the bacteria in any water let alone water that contains sewage does awful things to a body, Noahs body was perfect apart from the water damage to his hands and feet and bruise to his head. Who hit him, who placed him in that terrible place⁉️⁉️⁉️⁉️⁉️
6.I will go into the damn storm drain myself if need be to prove that Noah could not have made it to the point his wee body was found.I apologise for the detail and realise people may find it difficult to read but please open your eyes and see what is going on here.

So she's saying he was placed there, did someone drag him 1 km or was he just placed in a place that had a manhole above him?

Did he drown or die of other injuries? If there is water in the lungs does that prove he drowned or not? I'm not sure what way it works..

Did the search team look there early on or not? Those guys are all volunteers who do great work independently from the police, have they ever had input the Noah group?

What was his timeline, as in did he die that day or later in the week?

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 02, 2022, 07:26:21 PM
So she's saying he was placed there, did someone drag him 1 km or was he just placed in a place that had a manhole above him?

Did he drown or die of other injuries? If there is water in the lungs does that prove he drowned or not? I'm not sure what way it works..

Did the search team look there early on or not? Those guys are all volunteers who do great work independently from the police, have they ever had input the Noah group?

What was his timeline, as in did he die that day or later in the week?

This is the problem. So many questions that the PSNI have not answered, even the family have been left in the dark.

There is a manhole cover at Fortwilliam train station 20 meters from where the body was found.

From memory, I believe Fiona stated once that Noah died officially from drowning. She publicly asked was the water in Noah's lungs the same water that was in the storm drain, as far as I'm aware she's never been told.

Search and rescue volunteers would have been a great tool in finding Noah, unfortunately they were sent to Cavehill by the PSNI to look for him, even though he was seen naked at Northwood.

As for the timeline of his death, I'm not sure as I don't think those details were released.

Fiona did an interview with James English on YouTube that goes into greater detail, it's heartbreaking but I suppose she feels she has been backed into a corner.

Where is fortwilliam train station? Is it called anything else? Or is it a historic station that no longer exists? On maps here trying to piece this together in my head

The PII thing is a big Red Flag. Previously I've thought a clusterfuck of incompetence is most likely in this case, the PII thing makes you think it could be a conspiracy but a lot of Governments would go to great lengths to cover up unbelievable incompetence. The family deserve answers either way.

There isn't a current train station for the public , but there is a Translink service yard approximately behind the Service station/McDonalds/Asda at the bottom of Fortwilliam Park. That might be what it means as it is close to the M2.

Highly advise people to take the time to listen to the podcast

https://youtu.be/wRWsr3giWH8

I wasn't sure about the whole thing but the amount of stuff goin on here is unbelievable.

The water sample that a coroner would usually get not being obtained is the biggest concern I would have. They looked like they wanted to close this case fast.

Quote from: markl121 on August 02, 2022, 08:00:24 PM
Where is fortwilliam train station? Is it called anything else? Or is it a historic station that no longer exists? On maps here trying to piece this together in my head

Apologies, I'm not from the area but here is a couple of tweets that may help.

https://twitter.com/fionadonohoe2/status/1413615330686115845?s=21&t=k8GIgXLz7MQYrXSzEkMp6g

https://twitter.com/dtm_mama/status/1417416080872689670?s=21&t=k8GIgXLz7MQYrXSzEkMp6g

Quote from: Ty4Sam on August 02, 2022, 07:43:34 PM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 02, 2022, 07:26:21 PM
So she's saying he was placed there, did someone drag him 1 km or was he just placed in a place that had a manhole above him?

Did he drown or die of other injuries? If there is water in the lungs does that prove he drowned or not? I'm not sure what way it works..

Did the search team look there early on or not? Those guys are all volunteers who do great work independently from the police, have they ever had input the Noah group?

What was his timeline, as in did he die that day or later in the week?

This is the problem. So many questions that the PSNI have not answered, even the family have been left in the dark.

There is a manhole cover at Fortwilliam train station 20 meters from where the body was found.

From memory, I believe Fiona stated once that Noah died officially from drowning. She publicly asked was the water in Noah's lungs the same water that was in the storm drain, as far as I'm aware she's never been told.

Search and rescue volunteers would have been a great tool in finding Noah, unfortunately they were sent to Cavehill by the PSNI to look for him, even though he was seen naked at Northwood.

As for the timeline of his death, I'm not sure as I don't think those details were released.

Fiona did an interview with James English on YouTube that goes into greater detail, it's heartbreaking but I suppose she feels she has been backed into a corner.

They ain't difficult questions that you'd expect a local beat cop could answer

Could he have entered at that manhole in an attempt to run from people?

If he was seen on a bike naked was he seen being chased?

Was he fully naked or partially clothed?

And as someone said earlier there must have been hundreds who seen him, how are they all staying quiet?

The only fact that I can give you from them questions is that he was seen naked and running looking exhausted on CCTV in Northwood. The PSNI showed that CCTV to the family but nothing else. His bike and some of his clothes where also found in that street. The family were also told that a witness seen 2 men standing outside a car at the top of the street watching him. I would encourage anyway with an interest to watch/listen to  the podcast. It seems a very complex case when you listen to it.

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 02, 2022, 08:26:45 PM
And as someone said earlier there must have been hundreds who seen him, how are they all staying quiet?

My sister's colleague (a teacher) reported seeing someone who matched Noah's description talking to a man in that park above Northwood, can't remember the name. The police never followed up on his information. Perhaps it is because they know it wasn't him, but this report was made before Noah's body was discovered.

Quote from: WT4E on August 02, 2022, 08:13:25 PM
Highly advise people to take the time to listen to the podcast

https://youtu.be/wRWsr3giWH8

I wasn't sure about the whole thing but the amount of stuff goin on here is unbelievable.

The water sample that a coroner would usually get not being obtained is the biggest concern I would have. They looked like they wanted to close this case fast.

Thanks for the link

Quote from: Rois on August 02, 2022, 09:01:46 PM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 02, 2022, 08:26:45 PM
And as someone said earlier there must have been hundreds who seen him, how are they all staying quiet?

My sister's colleague (a teacher) reported seeing someone who matched Noah's description talking to a man in that park above Northwood, can't remember the name. The police never followed up on his information. Perhaps it is because they know it wasn't him, but this report was made before Noah's body was discovered.

I take it it's the park to the right of the street looking up? It next to Seamout street which looks down on to Seaview pitch.. so the entrance the storm drain is in between those streets?

I've been down that seamount street before

I just checked map - think it was Grove Park (to the side of Skegoneil Av) that has the wee football club at the corner.

Quote from: Ty4Sam on August 02, 2022, 07:43:34 PM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 02, 2022, 07:26:21 PM
So she's saying he was placed there, did someone drag him 1 km or was he just placed in a place that had a manhole above him?

Did he drown or die of other injuries? If there is water in the lungs does that prove he drowned or not? I'm not sure what way it works..

Did the search team look there early on or not? Those guys are all volunteers who do great work independently from the police, have they ever had input the Noah group?

What was his timeline, as in did he die that day or later in the week?

In the podcast linked above the mother spoke about a conversation between 2 prisoners in which one claimed too have drowned Noah in a bath.

This is the problem. So many questions that the PSNI have not answered, even the family have been left in the dark.

There is a manhole cover at Fortwilliam train station 20 meters from where the body was found.

From memory, I believe Fiona stated once that Noah died officially from drowning. She publicly asked was the water in Noah's lungs the same water that was in the storm drain, as far as I'm aware she's never been told.

Search and rescue volunteers would have been a great tool in finding Noah, unfortunately they were sent to Cavehill by the PSNI to look for him, even though he was seen naked at Northwood.

As for the timeline of his death, I'm not sure as I don't think those details were released.

Fiona did an interview with James English on YouTube that goes into greater detail, it's heartbreaking but I suppose she feels she has been backed into a corner.

Sorry seafoid I'm interested in your take on this but I think the quote function has muddled up your post. Can u repost

Listened to that whole interview there. f**k me it's wile. Two totally separate occurrences whereby he seems to have been attacked on great Victoria street and then tried to escape and ended up on the shore road where's he's then set upon by others. Hence the PII certificate. Is the PII to stop anything harming investment in belfast city centre? Or is it to protect the characters in the second aspect of the story in Northwood drive. The laptop in the hostel like f**k me. Whereabouts in the holylands did they live? I'd know the area well and am trying to picture the area of the hostel.
The initial attack by the homeless drug addicts seems plausibile as a revenge if Fiona had issues with them in the past. Noah would likely stand out even in belfast city centre if they were familiar with him.
A couple of things that didn't totally add up on Noah's end would be the timescale to get to cave hill, getting there by half six and then needing to be home by 8 doesn't seem totally possible, although probably not relevant here. Also why did he have his laptop and book? Again probsbly not relevant.

Quote from: WT4E on August 02, 2022, 11:17:56 PM
Sorry seafoid I'm interested in your take on this but I think the quote function has muddled up your post. Can u repost

In the podcast linked above the mother spoke about a conversation between 2 prisoners in which one claimed to have drowned Noah in a bath.

It looks like the only thing that will work is going above the PSNI to a higher level such as the UK Govt.

The SOS signed that PII thing so that doesn't look like it will work.

Quote from: seafoid on August 03, 2022, 09:08:43 AM
It looks like the only thing that will work is going above the PSNI to a higher level such as the UK Govt.

Absolutely. The entire thing stinks.

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 03, 2022, 09:15:24 AM
The SOS signed that PII thing so that doesn't look like it will work.

Maybe a Labour/LD  Govt would help. There is no equilibrium until the truth is revealed.

I think I read somewhere that the legal team had a high police officer from outside the north reviewing it but then SOS put in PII??? SOunds bad.

Another point which doesn't get enough attention the police say this lad who I believe was very tall for his age? Crawled naked through this tight concrete storm drain which has all sorts of debris in there and his body was in near perfect condition when they found him.

Quote from: WT4E on August 03, 2022, 10:09:41 AM
Another point which doesn't get enough attention the police say this lad who I believe was very tall for his age? Crawled naked through this tight concrete storm drain which has all sorts of debris in there and his body was in near perfect condition when they found him.

This is what I don't understand. How did Noah know this storm drain existed? Why would he have voluntarily entered it? If he did do so voluntarily, why would he travel as far as 950m into it? And if we are to believe he was in this storm drain for 6 days and died by drowning; why were only his hands and feet water damaged?

Quote from: WT4E on August 03, 2022, 10:09:41 AM
I think I read somewhere that the legal team had a high police officer from outside the north reviewing it but then SOS put in PII??? SOunds bad.

Another point which doesn't get enough attention the police say this lad who I believe was very tall for his age? Crawled naked through this tight concrete storm drain which has all sorts of debris in there and his body was in near perfect condition when they found him.

It sounds as though the body was put in the storm drain by someone.

Quote from: seafoid on August 03, 2022, 10:36:52 AM

Quote from: WT4E on August 03, 2022, 10:09:41 AM
I think I read somewhere that the legal team had a high police officer from outside the north reviewing it but then SOS put in PII??? SOunds bad.

Another point which doesn't get enough attention the police say this lad who I believe was very tall for his age? Crawled naked through this tight concrete storm drain which has all sorts of debris in there and his body was in near perfect condition when they found him.

It sounds as though the body was put in the storm drain by someone.

Ye reckon?

I won't put it up what I have been told but it stinks to high heaven. I will never forget the days after he went missing and the door to door stuff round north Belfast. The whole community gathered together but one part of it closed itself off and rallied the troops, both in their illegal and legal ranks. From memory there were a number of assaults on butch sides round that time. Young 'nationalist' lad attacked by a gang on the Limestone and a few 'loyalist' lads beaten up round the Water Works. The fear in the community that this was another Thomas Devlin was palpable, particularly given the proximity of it to where he was murdered.

The timing of when it happened too was important as it was at the height of the 'Black Lives Matter' movement and there was potentially racial elements to this given the colour of his skin. I don't necessarily believe it was racial but the optics can sometimes be different to the reality.

This will only ever come out in fullness when a proper enquiry is carried out, which will not happen while the PII is in existence. Another dirty act from this dirty place.

I cant understand why ever Journalists is running a mile from this case?

Journalists and a lot of politicians too. Not sure Long covering herself in glory here.

Quote from: pbat on August 03, 2022, 11:01:42 AM
I cant understand why ever Journalists is running a mile from this case?

The biggest show in the "country" is the main one.

Normally he'd be all over this type of thing, but for whatever reason he's not touched it with a barge pole.

Its absolutely gut-wrenching, I can't bring myself to listen to the podcast, there's an establishment coverup in play, the 'state' is rotten to the core

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 03, 2022, 11:02:37 AM
Journalists and a lot of politicians too. Not sure Long covering herself in glory here.

Compromise ongoing criminal case allegedly....it's rotten and stuff is being covered. Will come out in years to come when the poor mother has gone off her rocker

Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on August 03, 2022, 12:49:23 PM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 03, 2022, 11:02:37 AM
Journalists and a lot of politicians too. Not sure Long covering herself in glory here.

Compromise ongoing criminal case allegedly....it's rotten and stuff is being covered. Will come out in years to come when the poor mother has gone off her rocker

I think she is probably approaching that state, and that isn't a criticism. It would probably be the same for most of us

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 03, 2022, 12:56:25 PM

Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on August 03, 2022, 12:49:23 PM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 03, 2022, 11:02:37 AM
Journalists and a lot of politicians too. Not sure Long covering herself in glory here.

Compromise ongoing criminal case allegedly....it's rotten and stuff is being covered. Will come out in years to come when the poor mother has gone off her rocker

I think she is probably approaching that state, and that isn't a criticism. It would probably be the same for most of us

Absolutely. My comment was not criticism of the poor woman, just an observation of the inevitable

Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on August 03, 2022, 01:04:02 PM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 03, 2022, 12:56:25 PM

Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on August 03, 2022, 12:49:23 PM

Quote from: imtommygunn on August 03, 2022, 11:02:37 AM
Journalists and a lot of politicians too. Not sure Long covering herself in glory here.

Compromise ongoing criminal case allegedly....it's rotten and stuff is being covered. Will come out in years to come when the poor mother has gone off her rocker

I think she is probably approaching that state, and that isn't a criticism. It would probably be the same for most of us

Absolutely. My comment was not criticism of the poor woman, just an observation of the inevitable

fcukin awful when you think about it like that.

It doesn't make sense to cover this up in a country run on the rule of law. When something changes in the UK, something will probably change.

For that cover up to be in place the whole community along the Shore Road has to be silenced - again I can't fathom there isn't some good hearts there who would have spoken up to the police.

It absolutely stinks.

Quote from: Will it ever end on August 03, 2022, 02:41:07 PM
For that cover up to be in place the whole community along the Shore Road has to be silenced - again I can't fathom there isn't some good hearts there who would have spoken up to the police.

It absolutely stinks.

Was there some speculation that the woman who reported having Noah's Bike didn't tell anyone for a couple of days - Why Not?. These type of areas seem to be very heavily controlled.

Drugs and drug lords rule that community

I appreciate that but even with that level of control there will be someone and only takes one who would have a conscience / let some information go to the police.

The Rhys Williams murder keeps coming up in my mind - the names of those involved kept going to the police from anonymous calls to their helpline - surely someone has known something

Your talking about two different completely different police forces

There are names of mount Vernon uvf members being circulated on tiktok. Is mount Vernon near there? Terribly sad for his mum. It would be nigh on impossible to get over the death of a child but this is beyond.

Quote from: charlieTully on August 03, 2022, 09:24:21 PM
There are names of mount Vernon uvf members being circulated on tiktok. Is mount Vernon near there? Terribly sad for his mum. It would be nigh on impossible to get over the death of a child but this is beyond.

Mount Vernon is across the road from where he was found. I suspect the names you are referring to are the names I've been told. Won't make it public here but it's kinda 'dogs on the street' but the net can't tighten for whatever reason.

In the vacuum of information, other than the perception that a serious criminal act is being covered up, it is not difficult to come to the conclusion that Noah was abducted and murdered just because he was Catholic, and possibly black, although given the area I think the sectarian element is more likely.  To think that such a deed is possible in any society, never mind in the NI of 2020 is beyond belief.

So why the cover up ... because those involved are prize assets of the intelligence community and know too much to have them compromised ... or is it because the full details of what happened to an innocent catholic boy is enough to destabilise the whole community?

Do you remember the cop who kept giving daily updates?

Was he lying through his teeth, or didn't have a clue?

Noah's aunt Niamh was the year above me in school - it is very surreal still to see her and her family fighting against the might of the police and judiciary. Even more so when I was living about 500m from where he was found. Heartbreaking, and Niamh seems to be the shoulder of strength for Fiona, who is understandably frequently distraught on social media.

I think I'll join the rally next Saturday at Belfast City Hall.

I've also seen names on Twitter.

I'd be wary of believing any WhatsApp chain messages claiming to know who it was done it. I remember similar messages claiming the laptop was in Rathcoole (loyalist area) when it was nowhere of the sort.

Quote from: ONeill on August 03, 2022, 10:36:48 PM
Do you remember the cop who kept giving daily updates?

Was he lying through his teeth, or didn't have a clue?

No idea how a PSNI press conference works, but I'd assume the fella reading it out is just reading what he has been briefed on by investigating officers.  From what we've seen so far, I'd say not having a clue was more likely for much of it in the early days ... but who knows what their intelligence people knew from day one, this isn't a normal missing person opened and closed case, there's too many unanswered questions ... and your normal missing person investigation doesn't result in a PII I'd have thought.

Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on August 03, 2022, 09:28:16 PM

Quote from: charlieTully on August 03, 2022, 09:24:21 PM
There are names of mount Vernon uvf members being circulated on tiktok. Is mount Vernon near there? Terribly sad for his mum. It would be nigh on impossible to get over the death of a child but this is beyond.

Mount Vernon is across the road from where he was found. I suspect the names you are referring to are the names I've been told. Won't make it public here but it's kinda 'dogs on the street' but the net can't tighten for whatever reason.

Was there not also a "suicide" of a suspect who is alleged to have all but confessed to being a part if it?

There's some amount of pish on the internet but this bit ties in with the Mount Vernon connection as well.

Quote from: johnnycool on August 04, 2022, 11:29:16 AM

Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on August 03, 2022, 09:28:16 PM

Quote from: charlieTully on August 03, 2022, 09:24:21 PM
There are names of mount Vernon uvf members being circulated on tiktok. Is mount Vernon near there? Terribly sad for his mum. It would be nigh on impossible to get over the death of a child but this is beyond.

Mount Vernon is across the road from where he was found. I suspect the names you are referring to are the names I've been told. Won't make it public here but it's kinda 'dogs on the street' but the net can't tighten for whatever reason.

Was there not also a "suicide" of a suspect who is alleged to have all but confessed to being a part if it?

There's some amount of pish on the internet but this bit ties in with the Mount Vernon connection as well.

When my wife tells me a story that she heard from tictioc or whatever its called, I tune out, I would put my wife down as intelligent but I think this is how social media makes you brain mush

How's it any different to some of the crap posted on here?

Quote from: general_lee on August 04, 2022, 03:10:25 PM
How's it any different to some of the crap posted on here?

Probably not, but there is the odd link to stuff that can be fact checked...

At the minute regarding this topic, emotions can sometimes cloud the facts, its pretty grim and will open up a can of worms if half the stuff you read is true

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 04, 2022, 03:25:46 PM

Quote from: general_lee on August 04, 2022, 03:10:25 PM
How's it any different to some of the crap posted on here?

Probably not, but there is the odd link to stuff that can be fact checked...

At the minute regarding this topic, emotions can sometimes cloud the facts, its pretty grim and will open up a can of worms if half the stuff you read is true

As grim as it is you kind of hope it's some awful accident because any of the other stuff hinted at is going to create a major shit storm.

One thing I still can't get my head round is that all the things that are said to have happened including quite a long bike ride all take place within 18mins.

I read this a while back but it's probably already out of date

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vice.com/amp/en/article/v7dkgy/he-was-seen-cycling-naked-through-a-housing-estate-and-then-he-vanished

As said before you can't fart in public without it being on tik tok or WhatsApp 5 minutes later yet no footage of this young kid supposedly riding a bike naked?

Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on August 04, 2022, 06:08:57 PM
As said before you can't fart in public without it being on tik tok or WhatsApp 5 minutes later yet no footage of this young kid supposedly riding a bike naked?

That timeline is a bit short too, he'd lost his bag or was robbed near the house you'd  have went back home and told your mum? Rather than heading across town.

It's full of different stories and accounts and littered with gaps

Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on August 04, 2022, 06:08:57 PM
As said before you can't fart in public without it being on tik tok or WhatsApp 5 minutes later yet no footage of this young kid supposedly riding a bike naked?

As far as I'm aware Fiona has seen footage from CCTV (unsure if it was CCTV, doorbell or car camera) of Noah running naked up the side of the house so there is confirmation that he was naked. I take your point though regarding no footage on social media. There's a llot of strange occurrences in this case, allowing a public enquiry or indeed even letting the family know in detail how and why they believe they know what happened would clear a lot up.

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 04:56:10 PM
I didn't miss the point. I haven't said anything about what  I think happened. I'm open minded. It was you that wanted to close down one possible scenario by labelling it conspiracy theory. When it's no more theory than your own.

I'm not closing anything down. Just labelling things for what they are. A conspiracy theory with no evidence to back it up is precisely that.

And those who don't want to be labelled conspiracy theorists have an open forum to post their supporting evidence.

As for my own "theory" I only put it out there to highlight there are more than one explanation available here. I'm not saying it's true. I'm just saying that those punting a conspiracy theory don't even have the excuse that there are no other available explanations other than the theory they are punting.

I watched that Alex Jones debacle yesterday. His Sandy Hook BS doesn't have any less evidence to support it than the Deep State cover-up theory being pushed here.

A very disturbing murder with several bizarre features has occurred. We all hope it gets solved so at least that small crumb of comfort is there for the distraught family. Regrettably too many serious crimes go unsolved. In addition to the misery that levies on the families it also leaves a void that can get occupied with BS.

Quote from: smelmoth on August 05, 2022, 02:03:33 PM

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 04:56:10 PM
I didn't miss the point. I haven't said anything about what  I think happened. I'm open minded. It was you that wanted to close down one possible scenario by labelling it conspiracy theory. When it's no more theory than your own.

I'm not closing anything down. Just labelling things for what they are. A conspiracy theory with no evidence to back it up is precisely that.

And those who don't want to be labelled conspiracy theorists have an open forum to post their supporting evidence.

As for my own "theory" I only put it out there to highlight there are more than one explanation available here. I'm not saying it's true. I'm just saying that those punting a conspiracy theory don't even have the excuse that there are no other available explanations other than the theory they are punting.

I watched that Alex Jones debacle yesterday. His Sandy Hook BS doesn't have any less evidence to support it than the Deep State cover-up theory being pushed here.

A very disturbing murder with several bizarre features has occurred. We all hope it gets solved so at least that small crumb of comfort is there for the distraught family. Regrettably too many serious crimes go unsolved. In addition to the misery that levies on the families it also leaves a void that can get occupied with BS.

There's a podcast earlier that runs through most of the inconsistencies and lack of information. At a certain point you make a judgement call if it looks like there are holes everywhere and potential incompetence. Then wrap this up with a PII it becomes a case, in the lack of evidence to prove otherwise, that something is being covered up. I might be wrong on that, but to me and seemingly a lot of others, that's the most likely explanation.

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 05, 2022, 02:46:42 PM

Quote from: smelmoth on August 05, 2022, 02:03:33 PM

Quote from: trueblue1234 on August 01, 2022, 04:56:10 PM
I didn't miss the point. I haven't said anything about what  I think happened. I'm open minded. It was you that wanted to close down one possible scenario by labelling it conspiracy theory. When it's no more theory than your own.

I'm not closing anything down. Just labelling things for what they are. A conspiracy theory with no evidence to back it up is precisely that.

And those who don't want to be labelled conspiracy theorists have an open forum to post their supporting evidence.

As for my own "theory" I only put it out there to highlight there are more than one explanation available here. I'm not saying it's true. I'm just saying that those punting a conspiracy theory don't even have the excuse that there are no other available explanations other than the theory they are punting.

I watched that Alex Jones debacle yesterday. His Sandy Hook BS doesn't have any less evidence to support it than the Deep State cover-up theory being pushed here.

A very disturbing murder with several bizarre features has occurred. We all hope it gets solved so at least that small crumb of comfort is there for the distraught family. Regrettably too many serious crimes go unsolved. In addition to the misery that levies on the families it also leaves a void that can get occupied with BS.

There's a podcast earlier that runs through most of the inconsistencies and lack of information. At a certain point you make a judgement call if it looks like there are holes everywhere and potential incompetence. Then wrap this up with a PII it becomes a case, in the lack of evidence to prove otherwise, that something is being covered up. I might be wrong on that, but to me and seemingly a lot of others, that's the most likely explanation.

I watched the show last night and tried to be as objective as possible without being influenced by the bias of a grieving mother.  There are some interesting points made but not sure if there is a conspiracy or not.  The police's actions are shocking if they are true and the biggest issue from me was the water in Noah's lungs being tested - is that something that can no longer be done now?

There are too many things that haven't been explained.

Copied this, a good summary of this case.

Noah Donohoe left home on his bike Father's Day Sunday June 21st 2020, a warm sunny evening, approximately 5.30pm to make the journey across the city to meet with friends, to work on his Duke of Edinburgh award at Cavehill Country Park. It was a route he knew well, having taken it many times to and from his school at St Malachy's College on the Antrim Rd. Something would occur however, along Royal Avenue in the City Centre, which would cause Noah to change that well known route and instead of turning left @ Donegal St, cause him to continue on past Ulster University towards the Shore Rd, a part of the city unknown to him. Despite Royal Ave having over 180 CCTV cameras, only 22 would later be checked by PSNI to try to piece together his final journey and even more bizarre, none would pick up Noah . A witness statement would later be made claiming an attack on Noah with photographic evidence, on Royal Ave by 4 men, 1 of whom knew of Noah as his girlfriend resided in a hostel yards away from his home in South Belfast and is furthermore seen on CCTV watching him leave his home a short time earlier. This same man would also claim to 'find' Noah's backpack containing his laptop & books(clearly labelled with Noah's name) at the Ulster University ( though no CCTVfootage has ever shown either Noah drop his belongings here or indeed said man finding them here). An anonymous tip off would claim to see these possessions, along with Noah's North Face coat, still missing to this day, being paraded for sale at a house party in Skegoneil just off the Shore Rd by the same man, whilst the search for Noah took place just metres away. Despite a member of staff at Cash Converters calling police the following day to report a male & female entering the premises and attempt to sell a laptop, it would be days before the PSNI would visit their addresses. Noah's laptop would be found at the woman's hostel, claiming she was looking after it for the male. Neither their properties would be searched, forensics carried out or neither taken in for questioning. Noah is picked up on CCTV cycling along North Queen St/ York Rd at 6.01pm Sunday evening. A witness would see Noah fall from his bike moments before, dispose of his North face coat before quickly getting back on his bike and cycling on. The last sighting of Noah was minutes later on Northwood Rd. He can be  seen on CCTV naked and visibly in distress, running behind 2 houses. He then disappears, never to be seen alive again. Residents who claimed to have seen Noah all said they assumed it was a "Father's Day prank" and not one would go to assist a naked, distressed Noah. His naked body would be found 6 days later 950m deep inside an obscure storm drain, very few from the area knew existed behind houses on Northwood Rd. Before Noah's body was examined at autopsy, PSNI put out that they suspected "No Foul Play" and so the narrative was born that Noah died of misadventure and that he acted willingly and completely alone, the whole part of his journey. This theory was quickly questioned by his mother Fiona, who raised serious concerns about the PSNI's handling of her son's investigation. After the cause of death was recorded as drowning, it emerged that no water samples were preserved from the drain Noah apparently died, to compare with that in his lungs. This would either prove or disprove that he had indeed died in the drain. The drain area would never be forensically checked, and his family have queried why the only visible marks on Noah's body when found was a 16cm in diameter bump on his forehead. One would imagine that Noah having climbed his way the equivalent of 4 football pitches in pitch dark through a dirty storm drain, he would acquired significant scratches. Furthermore only his hands & feet would have water damage despite apparently laying in a drain which fills & empties twice daily, for 6 days. Why were bin lorries allowed up the street Noah was last seen, while a major search continued? Why were various witness statements discounted? Why was Community Search & Rescue sent up Cavehill when Noah was last seen in Northwood? Why did time stamps on the last CCTV footage of Noah change 3 times and most worrying of all, why has a Public Interest Immunity Certificate just been signed off concealing hundreds of pages of information relating to his death? It has only just been disclosed to Fiona that police after receiving intelligence on 27th June, had planned to search houses on Premier Drive & Northwood Rd. That very same day however, his body coincidentally would be found in the drain. PII's have been used here historically to protect identities of informants and strategies of police investigations, however the only other one ever used in a case involving a child was in that of  15yr old Arlene Arkinson. Robert Howard, a police informant, pedophile & child serial killer would be protected and cleared of her murder through the granting of PII. Howard would then go on to murder another child in England, before being brought to justice there. So the big question is, if Noah is the only one involved in Noah's death, why the need to conceal information? That information belongs to Fiona. To this day she still hasn't been told exactly when Noah died. It is her right as Noah's mother to know of his final days/hours, no matter what that was and those involved in his death to be brought to justice. Noah represents all of our children
and quite easily could have been. Which is why we all must stand in solidarity with her against PII on Saturday 13th August. If you can make it, please do. If we tolerate this, any of our children could be next!
#JusticeForNoahDonohoe
#Belfast #FeetOnTheStreet #Saturday13thAugust#Cityhall #1PM
#NoToPII

This whole case has been a shambles of incompetence from the police from start to finish,This pII also is very suspicious and makes me think of a cover up of some description behind the scenes,Fiona deserves the truth which is being blocked continuously.

Has the Noah case never been mentioned, even in passing, on the Nolan show either on the radio or TV?

Quote from: Ty4Sam on August 08, 2022, 01:30:34 PM
Copied this, a good summary of this case.

Noah Donohoe left home on his bike Father's Day Sunday June 21st 2020, a warm sunny evening, approximately 5.30pm to make the journey across the city to meet with friends, to work on his Duke of Edinburgh award at Cavehill Country Park. It was a route he knew well, having taken it many times to and from his school at St Malachy's College on the Antrim Rd. Something would occur however, along Royal Avenue in the City Centre, which would cause Noah to change that well known route and instead of turning left @ Donegal St, cause him to continue on past Ulster University towards the Shore Rd, a part of the city unknown to him. Despite Royal Ave having over 180 CCTV cameras, only 22 would later be checked by PSNI to try to piece together his final journey and even more bizarre, none would pick up Noah . A witness statement would later be made claiming an attack on Noah with photographic evidence, on Royal Ave by 4 men, 1 of whom knew of Noah as his girlfriend resided in a hostel yards away from his home in South Belfast and is furthermore seen on CCTV watching him leave his home a short time earlier. This same man would also claim to 'find' Noah's backpack containing his laptop & books(clearly labelled with Noah's name) at the Ulster University ( though no CCTVfootage has ever shown either Noah drop his belongings here or indeed said man finding them here). An anonymous tip off would claim to see these possessions, along with Noah's North Face coat, still missing to this day, being paraded for sale at a house party in Skegoneil just off the Shore Rd by the same man, whilst the search for Noah took place just metres away. Despite a member of staff at Cash Converters calling police the following day to report a male & female entering the premises and attempt to sell a laptop, it would be days before the PSNI would visit their addresses. Noah's laptop would be found at the woman's hostel, claiming she was looking after it for the male. Neither their properties would be searched, forensics carried out or neither taken in for questioning. Noah is picked up on CCTV cycling along North Queen St/ York Rd at 6.01pm Sunday evening. A witness would see Noah fall from his bike moments before, dispose of his North face coat before quickly getting back on his bike and cycling on. The last sighting of Noah was minutes later on Northwood Rd. He can be  seen on CCTV naked and visibly in distress, running behind 2 houses. He then disappears, never to be seen alive again. Residents who claimed to have seen Noah all said they assumed it was a "Father's Day prank" and not one would go to assist a naked, distressed Noah. His naked body would be found 6 days later 950m deep inside an obscure storm drain, very few from the area knew existed behind houses on Northwood Rd. Before Noah's body was examined at autopsy, PSNI put out that they suspected "No Foul Play" and so the narrative was born that Noah died of misadventure and that he acted willingly and completely alone, the whole part of his journey. This theory was quickly questioned by his mother Fiona, who raised serious concerns about the PSNI's handling of her son's investigation. After the cause of death was recorded as drowning, it emerged that no water samples were preserved from the drain Noah apparently died, to compare with that in his lungs. This would either prove or disprove that he had indeed died in the drain. The drain area would never be forensically checked, and his family have queried why the only visible marks on Noah's body when found was a 16cm in diameter bump on his forehead. One would imagine that Noah having climbed his way the equivalent of 4 football pitches in pitch dark through a dirty storm drain, he would acquired significant scratches. Furthermore only his hands & feet would have water damage despite apparently laying in a drain which fills & empties twice daily, for 6 days. Why were bin lorries allowed up the street Noah was last seen, while a major search continued? Why were various witness statements discounted? Why was Community Search & Rescue sent up Cavehill when Noah was last seen in Northwood? Why did time stamps on the last CCTV footage of Noah change 3 times and most worrying of all, why has a Public Interest Immunity Certificate just been signed off concealing hundreds of pages of information relating to his death? It has only just been disclosed to Fiona that police after receiving intelligence on 27th June, had planned to search houses on Premier Drive & Northwood Rd. That very same day however, his body coincidentally would be found in the drain. PII's have been used here historically to protect identities of informants and strategies of police investigations, however the only other one ever used in a case involving a child was in that of  15yr old Arlene Arkinson. Robert Howard, a police informant, pedophile & child serial killer would be protected and cleared of her murder through the granting of PII. Howard would then go on to murder another child in England, before being brought to justice there. So the big question is, if Noah is the only one involved in Noah's death, why the need to conceal information? That information belongs to Fiona. To this day she still hasn't been told exactly when Noah died. It is her right as Noah's mother to know of his final days/hours, no matter what that was and those involved in his death to be brought to justice. Noah represents all of our children
and quite easily could have been. Which is why we all must stand in solidarity with her against PII on Saturday 13th August. If you can make it, please do. If we tolerate this, any of our children could be next!
#JusticeForNoahDonohoe
#Belfast #FeetOnTheStreet #Saturday13thAugust#Cityhall #1PM
#NoToPII

that doesnt make for good reading

Quote from: nrico2006 on August 18, 2022, 11:23:34 AM
Has the Noah case never been mentioned, even in passing, on the Nolan show either on the radio or TV?

Nolan will not mention it as he "does not wish to distress a grieving mother or interfere with an ongoing investigation"
Believe as much of that as you chose.

Quote from: keep her low this half on August 18, 2022, 04:27:33 PM

Quote from: nrico2006 on August 18, 2022, 11:23:34 AM
Has the Noah case never been mentioned, even in passing, on the Nolan show either on the radio or TV?

Nolan will not mention it as he "does not wish to distress a grieving mother or interfere with an ongoing investigation"
Believe as much of that as you chose.

Yes far be it from Stephen Nolan to want to distress a grieving family. That's why he only devoted 2 years of coverage to Bobby Storey's funeral.

Quote from: Snapchap on August 18, 2022, 07:23:40 PM

Quote from: keep her low this half on August 18, 2022, 04:27:33 PM

Quote from: nrico2006 on August 18, 2022, 11:23:34 AM
Has the Noah case never been mentioned, even in passing, on the Nolan show either on the radio or TV?

Nolan will not mention it as he "does not wish to distress a grieving mother or interfere with an ongoing investigation"
Believe as much of that as you chose.

Yes far be it from Stephen Nolan to want to distress a grieving family. That's why he only devoted 2 years of coverage to Bobby Storey's funeral.

Loyalists have him over a barrel.

Quote from: Snapchap on August 18, 2022, 07:23:40 PM

Quote from: keep her low this half on August 18, 2022, 04:27:33 PM

Quote from: nrico2006 on August 18, 2022, 11:23:34 AM
Has the Noah case never been mentioned, even in passing, on the Nolan show either on the radio or TV?

Nolan will not mention it as he "does not wish to distress a grieving mother or interfere with an ongoing investigation"
Believe as much of that as you chose.

Yes far be it from Stephen Nolan to want to distress a grieving family. That's why he only devoted 2 years of coverage to Bobby Storey's funeral.

Sure was the Storey case not under investigation for months while he focused in it through his shows?

Quote from: Ty4Sam on August 08, 2022, 01:30:34 PM
Copied this, a good summary of this case.

Noah Donohoe left home on his bike Father's Day Sunday June 21st 2020, a warm sunny evening, approximately 5.30pm to make the journey across the city to meet with friends, to work on his Duke of Edinburgh award at Cavehill Country Park. It was a route he knew well, having taken it many times to and from his school at St Malachy's College on the Antrim Rd. Something would occur however, along Royal Avenue in the City Centre, which would cause Noah to change that well known route and instead of turning left @ Donegal St, cause him to continue on past Ulster University towards the Shore Rd, a part of the city unknown to him. Despite Royal Ave having over 180 CCTV cameras, only 22 would later be checked by PSNI to try to piece together his final journey and even more bizarre, none would pick up Noah . A witness statement would later be made claiming an attack on Noah with photographic evidence, on Royal Ave by 4 men, 1 of whom knew of Noah as his girlfriend resided in a hostel yards away from his home in South Belfast and is furthermore seen on CCTV watching him leave his home a short time earlier. This same man would also claim to 'find' Noah's backpack containing his laptop & books(clearly labelled with Noah's name) at the Ulster University ( though no CCTVfootage has ever shown either Noah drop his belongings here or indeed said man finding them here). An anonymous tip off would claim to see these possessions, along with Noah's North Face coat, still missing to this day, being paraded for sale at a house party in Skegoneil just off the Shore Rd by the same man, whilst the search for Noah took place just metres away. Despite a member of staff at Cash Converters calling police the following day to report a male & female entering the premises and attempt to sell a laptop, it would be days before the PSNI would visit their addresses. Noah's laptop would be found at the woman's hostel, claiming she was looking after it for the male. Neither their properties would be searched, forensics carried out or neither taken in for questioning. Noah is picked up on CCTV cycling along North Queen St/ York Rd at 6.01pm Sunday evening. A witness would see Noah fall from his bike moments before, dispose of his North face coat before quickly getting back on his bike and cycling on. The last sighting of Noah was minutes later on Northwood Rd. He can be  seen on CCTV naked and visibly in distress, running behind 2 houses. He then disappears, never to be seen alive again. Residents who claimed to have seen Noah all said they assumed it was a "Father's Day prank" and not one would go to assist a naked, distressed Noah. His naked body would be found 6 days later 950m deep inside an obscure storm drain, very few from the area knew existed behind houses on Northwood Rd. Before Noah's body was examined at autopsy, PSNI put out that they suspected "No Foul Play" and so the narrative was born that Noah died of misadventure and that he acted willingly and completely alone, the whole part of his journey. This theory was quickly questioned by his mother Fiona, who raised serious concerns about the PSNI's handling of her son's investigation. After the cause of death was recorded as drowning, it emerged that no water samples were preserved from the drain Noah apparently died, to compare with that in his lungs. This would either prove or disprove that he had indeed died in the drain. The drain area would never be forensically checked, and his family have queried why the only visible marks on Noah's body when found was a 16cm in diameter bump on his forehead. One would imagine that Noah having climbed his way the equivalent of 4 football pitches in pitch dark through a dirty storm drain, he would acquired significant scratches. Furthermore only his hands & feet would have water damage despite apparently laying in a drain which fills & empties twice daily, for 6 days. Why were bin lorries allowed up the street Noah was last seen, while a major search continued? Why were various witness statements discounted? Why was Community Search & Rescue sent up Cavehill when Noah was last seen in Northwood? Why did time stamps on the last CCTV footage of Noah change 3 times and most worrying of all, why has a Public Interest Immunity Certificate just been signed off concealing hundreds of pages of information relating to his death? It has only just been disclosed to Fiona that police after receiving intelligence on 27th June, had planned to search houses on Premier Drive & Northwood Rd. That very same day however, his body coincidentally would be found in the drain. PII's have been used here historically to protect identities of informants and strategies of police investigations, however the only other one ever used in a case involving a child was in that of  15yr old Arlene Arkinson. Robert Howard, a police informant, pedophile & child serial killer would be protected and cleared of her murder through the granting of PII. Howard would then go on to murder another child in England, before being brought to justice there. So the big question is, if Noah is the only one involved in Noah's death, why the need to conceal information? That information belongs to Fiona. To this day she still hasn't been told exactly when Noah died. It is her right as Noah's mother to know of his final days/hours, no matter what that was and those involved in his death to be brought to justice. Noah represents all of our children
and quite easily could have been. Which is why we all must stand in solidarity with her against PII on Saturday 13th August. If you can make it, please do. If we tolerate this, any of our children could be next!
#JusticeForNoahDonohoe
#Belfast #FeetOnTheStreet #Saturday13thAugust#Cityhall #1PM
#NoToPII

How much of that is fact, how much is conjecture, how much of it is distorted or hyperbole?

When does the coroner rule on the PII and whats the likelihood he overturns it

Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on August 18, 2022, 07:46:33 PM

Quote from: Snapchap on August 18, 2022, 07:23:40 PM

Quote from: keep her low this half on August 18, 2022, 04:27:33 PM

Quote from: nrico2006 on August 18, 2022, 11:23:34 AM
Has the Noah case never been mentioned, even in passing, on the Nolan show either on the radio or TV?

Nolan will not mention it as he "does not wish to distress a grieving mother or interfere with an ongoing investigation"
Believe as much of that as you chose.

Yes far be it from Stephen Nolan to want to distress a grieving family. That's why he only devoted 2 years of coverage to Bobby Storey's funeral.

Loyalists have him over a barrel.

He is a loyalist FFS...

Was Nolan not very heavy in on the RHI scandal at the time ?

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 19, 2022, 10:55:15 AM
Was Nolan not very heavy in on the RHI scandal at the time ?

He was and went to town on the DUP and rightly so.

you can still be a loyalist at heart and criticise incompetence/dishonesty when it arises.

I see Fiona Donohoe has asked that people stop speculating online that Noah was murdered and it is causing the family great anguish

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 22, 2022, 12:54:28 PM
I see Fiona Donohoe has asked that people stop speculating online that Noah was murdered and it is causing the family great anguish

What does that mean, he was murdered so there is no speculating?

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 22, 2022, 01:03:00 PM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 22, 2022, 12:54:28 PM
I see Fiona Donohoe has asked that people stop speculating online that Noah was murdered and it is causing the family great anguish

What does that mean, he was murdered so there is no speculating?

No she said never once has she said he was murdered, just that there obviously unexplained circumstances around his death

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 22, 2022, 01:05:58 PM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 22, 2022, 01:03:00 PM

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 22, 2022, 12:54:28 PM
I see Fiona Donohoe has asked that people stop speculating online that Noah was murdered and it is causing the family great anguish

What does that mean, he was murdered so there is no speculating?

No she said never once has she said he was murdered, just that there obviously unexplained circumstances around his death

Ah, I've not followed the whole media thing with it, for some reason I thought they had believed he was murdered and put somewhere afterwards

Quote from: Kidder81 on August 22, 2022, 12:54:28 PM
I see Fiona Donohoe has asked that people stop speculating online that Noah was murdered and it is causing the family great anguish

It may be for legal reasons

Quote from: Fionntamhnach on August 22, 2022, 03:27:48 PM
All I'll say is that as someone whom had a family member killed in a road crash, rumours and speculation concerning the incident as open gossip or worse from those that have nothing to do with it almost always do nothing at best to help with the mental anguish of those whom they were close to that are living.

I acn only imagine how difficult a situation it is to be in without having to read/hear everybody's opinion on what happened, however well intentioned they are.

Quote from: Fionntamhnach on August 22, 2022, 03:27:48 PM
All I'll say is that as someone whom had a family member killed in a road crash, rumours and speculation concerning the incident as open gossip or worse from those that have nothing to do with it almost always do nothing at best to help with the mental anguish of those whom they were close to that are living.

Is Fiona not fuelling a lot of this herself? That's the impression I get. Might be wrong. She is constantly on twitter.

She wants to keep the story in the public eye. Others want it swept under the carpet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRWsr3giWH8

Quote from: seafoid on August 22, 2022, 04:17:51 PM
She wants to keep the story in the public eye. Others want it swept under the carpet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRWsr3giWH8

"Others"

has a lot  irish qanon types not attached themselves to this.

Noah out on his bicycle at 3am.

Quote from: Orior on June 19, 2023, 10:17:50 PM
Noah out on his bicycle at 3am.

Drug mule or what ?

Quote from: Orior on June 19, 2023, 10:17:50 PM
Noah out on his bicycle at 3am.

Donal McIntyre via the  Sunday world states that Noah Donohoe left the house at 3am on the day that he would go missing.  Its pouring with rain with just shorts, T-shirt and flip flops on carrying headphones. Returns home an hour later soaked (cctv) with no flip flops on and missing the headphones.
This was never disclosed to the family for 2 years by the PSNI?

Shocking stuff, never read the piece on Sunday other than the headline.  I assume it didn't give any idea as to where Noah was going at 3am on a Sunday morning?  To say this is weird in the extreme is an understatement.

Quote from: general_lee on July 31, 2022, 07:07:34 PM

Quote from: markl121 on July 29, 2022, 03:25:59 PM
My assumption this whole time was that loyalists or their kids had chased/killed Noah and put him in the storm drain. However the other day (on twitter obv) I had a loyalist tell me that they're looking at it being someone from one of the local hostels that did it and that the family are even suspecting this. Never heard anything about this other than from this one twitter account and a few of their followers so it's obviously not reliable. A very strange case all in all though.

not sure if it's been mentioned on here before but Fiona donohoe went on the James English podcast, worth a listen

This, for the first time, has provided me with a clear perspective on this case. I'd heard so much conspiracy and speculation that I'd switched off. My opinion has turned full circle having heard Fiona lay down the facts through this podcast.

Still clear as mud, can someone put out what they think happened based on whatever facts are known and not what is on twitter please

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 20, 2023, 10:08:58 AM
Still clear as mud, can someone put out what they think happened based on whatever facts are known and not what is on twitter please

Twitter can be a curse. That Podcast sets the known events out in a manner I can finally get my head around. It's reasonably old at this stage too given recent developments.

Did I read the mum and sister are fell out ?

https://belfastmedia.com/noah-s-mum-fiona-urges-psni-to-thoroughly-investigate-sinister-lenadoon-graffiti

You'd hope that maybe there's some substance to this lead and that the PSNI redeem themselves.

Quote from: general_lee on October 18, 2023, 02:50:10 PMhttps://belfastmedia.com/noah-s-mum-fiona-urges-psni-to-thoroughly-investigate-sinister-lenadoon-graffiti

You'd hope that maybe there's some substance to this lead and that the PSNI redeem themselves.

Didnt actually realise the Mount Vernon flats where so close to where he was found til I saw some stuff on Twitter about this