The Offical Glasgow Celtic thread

[Kilkevan]

That banner with the Volunteer is pathetic to be honest just a cheap effort at riling "the other side". What the f**k does Brendan Rodgers or a Football match have to do with the IRA.

I often agree with the expressions of a political opinion at Celtic Park, but only so far as there's a point and a cause behind it.

The banner with Rodgers was witty in the context. I think the Green Brigade shot themselves in the foot with the one of the Volunteer though. I don't disagree with them expressing a political opinion and I dispute that a drawing of a Volunteer is sectarian, Republicanism has never been anti-Protestant in the way Loyalism has been and is overtly anti-Catholic. A banner like that is only ever going to end in tears with the sanitised organisation of UEFA (actually horrendously corrupt but likes to think of itself as sanitised). They may, may, have gotten away with the Rodgers one without the Volunteer.

Now in terms of the singing, The Broad Black Brimmer is not a sectarian song. It's political but nowhere does it refer to Protestantism/Orangeism and putting it into the same bracket as "up to our necks in Fenian blood" is horsesh1t. Again with the sanitary towel that is UEFA it's likely to end up causing Celtic problems but personally I don't think it should; UEFA would want to look into it's own dark cupboards before it starts giving off about anyone else anyway but that's not how it works with them unfortunately.

Now if anyone engaged in overtly anti-sectarian singing, as some have stated, like "no Orange b*******" then Celtic should make an example of those people, find them and ban them for life. As a Republican, I find it abhorrent that there are those who hijack Republicanism for their own racist means. True Republicanism is not sectarian in nature and in fact the founder of modern Irish Republicanism, as well as many other of the greatest Irish Republicans, were Protestants themselves.

The Rodgers banner is grand as far as I'm concerned a bit tongue in cheek, its the fact they thought to put a Vol along side it that irks me, not that I deem it sectarian which on its own merit, it isn't, but disagree for the motives of using it to wind people up. Republicanism by its very nature cannot be Sectarian otherwise it is not Republicanism.

Broadly agree. However, if posters here are going by hearsay and were not actually at the match make sure you get your facts right as to what was sung or not sung. If whole stadium was singing add ons, fair enough but I've heard plenty who were at the match saying they heard no such thing. The banners were okay in my book and f**k off with calling certain songs sectarian when they clearly are not

I agree with the majority of what you said, I just think the Volunteer banner was prodding the bear (UEFA, not Linfield). On the songs issue, and I've only seen videos of the Merry Ploughboy and the Broad Black Brimmer which are not sectarian, if anti-Protestant songs were sung then those individual fans should be identified and punished. If they were just singing rebel songs, and there are scant few, if any, which are sectarian then there shouldn't be a problem.

[Main Street]

That banner with the Volunteer is pathetic to be honest just a cheap effort at riling "the other side". What the f**k does Brendan Rodgers or a Football match have to do with the IRA.

I often agree with the expressions of a political opinion at Celtic Park, but only so far as there's a point and a cause behind it.

The banner with Rodgers was witty in the context. I think the Green Brigade shot themselves in the foot with the one of the Volunteer though. I don't disagree with them expressing a political opinion and I dispute that a drawing of a Volunteer is sectarian, Republicanism has never been anti-Protestant in the way Loyalism has been and is overtly anti-Catholic. A banner like that is only ever going to end in tears with the sanitised organisation of UEFA (actually horrendously corrupt but likes to think of itself as sanitised). They may, may, have gotten away with the Rodgers one without the Volunteer.

Now in terms of the singing, The Broad Black Brimmer is not a sectarian song. It's political but nowhere does it refer to Protestantism/Orangeism and putting it into the same bracket as "up to our necks in Fenian blood" is horsesh1t. Again with the sanitary towel that is UEFA it's likely to end up causing Celtic problems but personally I don't think it should; UEFA would want to look into it's own dark cupboards before it starts giving off about anyone else anyway but that's not how it works with them unfortunately.

Now if anyone engaged in overtly anti-sectarian singing, as some have stated, like "no Orange b*******" then Celtic should make an example of those people, find them and ban them for life. As a Republican, I find it abhorrent that there are those who hijack Republicanism for their own racist means. True Republicanism is not sectarian in nature and in fact the founder of modern Irish Republicanism, as well as many other of the greatest Irish Republicans, were Protestants themselves.

The Rodgers banner is grand as far as I'm concerned a bit tongue in cheek, its the fact they thought to put a Vol along side it that irks me, not that I deem it sectarian which on its own merit, it isn't, but disagree for the motives of using it to wind people up. Republicanism by its very nature cannot be Sectarian otherwise it is not Republicanism.

A long banner was unfurled on top of the flag "Rodgers At Work", saying "Brendan's Undefeated Army"
Don't the IFA mob call themselves GAWA? 
Taken all together, the Green Brigade might have (cheekily) calculated that the whole display just came under the radar.

Overall the two games have provided plenty of overtime for the Uefa disciplinary committee.
For Celtic's part, the singing of the  BOTOB and the BBB songs will surely attract fines.

The Soldiers Song and TFOA are regarded as Celtic ethnic,  Celtic are Irish ethnic, always have been since inception, the tricolor has always been there since the foundation. The Palestinian flag is not 'Celtic ethnic', so flying it is illegal. The Poppy WW2 commemoration displays are illegal because it's not part of a club's  or country identity, it's a non football political display when acted out in international competitions.

[themac_23]

If you look at the banners, the 'volunteer' has 'ULTRA' on his name badge, this dispels that it was an IRA volunteer but an ULTRA which the GB claim to be. can't see it being called out as sectarian, I'm sure you've seen the pics of GB members with faces covered and glasses on, not saying i approve but they seem to have covered themselves.

[tonto1888]

That banner with the Volunteer is pathetic to be honest just a cheap effort at riling "the other side". What the f**k does Brendan Rodgers or a Football match have to do with the IRA.

I often agree with the expressions of a political opinion at Celtic Park, but only so far as there's a point and a cause behind it.

The banner with Rodgers was witty in the context. I think the Green Brigade shot themselves in the foot with the one of the Volunteer though. I don't disagree with them expressing a political opinion and I dispute that a drawing of a Volunteer is sectarian, Republicanism has never been anti-Protestant in the way Loyalism has been and is overtly anti-Catholic. A banner like that is only ever going to end in tears with the sanitised organisation of UEFA (actually horrendously corrupt but likes to think of itself as sanitised). They may, may, have gotten away with the Rodgers one without the Volunteer.

Now in terms of the singing, The Broad Black Brimmer is not a sectarian song. It's political but nowhere does it refer to Protestantism/Orangeism and putting it into the same bracket as "up to our necks in Fenian blood" is horsesh1t. Again with the sanitary towel that is UEFA it's likely to end up causing Celtic problems but personally I don't think it should; UEFA would want to look into it's own dark cupboards before it starts giving off about anyone else anyway but that's not how it works with them unfortunately.

Now if anyone engaged in overtly anti-sectarian singing, as some have stated, like "no Orange b*******" then Celtic should make an example of those people, find them and ban them for life. As a Republican, I find it abhorrent that there are those who hijack Republicanism for their own racist means. True Republicanism is not sectarian in nature and in fact the founder of modern Irish Republicanism, as well as many other of the greatest Irish Republicans, were Protestants themselves.

The Rodgers banner is grand as far as I'm concerned a bit tongue in cheek, its the fact they thought to put a Vol along side it that irks me, not that I deem it sectarian which on its own merit, it isn't, but disagree for the motives of using it to wind people up. Republicanism by its very nature cannot be Sectarian otherwise it is not Republicanism.

Broadly agree. However, if posters here are going by hearsay and were not actually at the match make sure you get your facts right as to what was sung or not sung. If whole stadium was singing add ons, fair enough but I've heard plenty who were at the match saying they heard no such thing. The banners were okay in my book and f**k off with calling certain songs sectarian when they clearly are not

I don't think anyone is calling BBB or BOTOB sectarian. If they are then they're very wrong. I'm guessing the sectarian reference  is in regard to the 'soon there will be no protestants at all' or 'orange bastards' lines. Both of which are reported to have been sung and both of which are disputed

[tonto1888]

That banner with the Volunteer is pathetic to be honest just a cheap effort at riling "the other side". What the f**k does Brendan Rodgers or a Football match have to do with the IRA.

I often agree with the expressions of a political opinion at Celtic Park, but only so far as there's a point and a cause behind it.

The banner with Rodgers was witty in the context. I think the Green Brigade shot themselves in the foot with the one of the Volunteer though. I don't disagree with them expressing a political opinion and I dispute that a drawing of a Volunteer is sectarian, Republicanism has never been anti-Protestant in the way Loyalism has been and is overtly anti-Catholic. A banner like that is only ever going to end in tears with the sanitised organisation of UEFA (actually horrendously corrupt but likes to think of itself as sanitised). They may, may, have gotten away with the Rodgers one without the Volunteer.

Now in terms of the singing, The Broad Black Brimmer is not a sectarian song. It's political but nowhere does it refer to Protestantism/Orangeism and putting it into the same bracket as "up to our necks in Fenian blood" is horsesh1t. Again with the sanitary towel that is UEFA it's likely to end up causing Celtic problems but personally I don't think it should; UEFA would want to look into it's own dark cupboards before it starts giving off about anyone else anyway but that's not how it works with them unfortunately.

Now if anyone engaged in overtly anti-sectarian singing, as some have stated, like "no Orange b*******" then Celtic should make an example of those people, find them and ban them for life. As a Republican, I find it abhorrent that there are those who hijack Republicanism for their own racist means. True Republicanism is not sectarian in nature and in fact the founder of modern Irish Republicanism, as well as many other of the greatest Irish Republicans, were Protestants themselves.

The Rodgers banner is grand as far as I'm concerned a bit tongue in cheek, its the fact they thought to put a Vol along side it that irks me, not that I deem it sectarian which on its own merit, it isn't, but disagree for the motives of using it to wind people up. Republicanism by its very nature cannot be Sectarian otherwise it is not Republicanism.

A long banner was unfurled on top of the flag "Rodgers At Work", saying "Brendan's Undefeated Army"
Don't the IFA mob call themselves GAWA? 
Taken all together, the Green Brigade might have (cheekily) calculated that the whole display just came under the radar.

Overall the two games have provided plenty of overtime for the Uefa disciplinary committee.
For Celtic's part, the singing of the  BOTOB and the BBB songs will surely attract fines.

The Soldiers Song and TFOA are regarded as Celtic ethnic,  Celtic are Irish ethnic, always have been since inception, the tricolor has always been there since the foundation. The Palestinian flag is not 'Celtic ethnic', so flying it is illegal. The Poppy WW2 commemoration displays are illegal because it's not part of a club's  or country identity, it's a non football political display when acted out in international competitions.

This annoys me. Not you but what you have said is correct. However, UEFA can disregard their own rules as and when it suits them. That is unfair. Either ban political things completely or not at all

[Main Street]

That banner with the Volunteer is pathetic to be honest just a cheap effort at riling "the other side". What the f**k does Brendan Rodgers or a Football match have to do with the IRA.

I often agree with the expressions of a political opinion at Celtic Park, but only so far as there's a point and a cause behind it.

The banner with Rodgers was witty in the context. I think the Green Brigade shot themselves in the foot with the one of the Volunteer though. I don't disagree with them expressing a political opinion and I dispute that a drawing of a Volunteer is sectarian, Republicanism has never been anti-Protestant in the way Loyalism has been and is overtly anti-Catholic. A banner like that is only ever going to end in tears with the sanitised organisation of UEFA (actually horrendously corrupt but likes to think of itself as sanitised). They may, may, have gotten away with the Rodgers one without the Volunteer.

Now in terms of the singing, The Broad Black Brimmer is not a sectarian song. It's political but nowhere does it refer to Protestantism/Orangeism and putting it into the same bracket as "up to our necks in Fenian blood" is horsesh1t. Again with the sanitary towel that is UEFA it's likely to end up causing Celtic problems but personally I don't think it should; UEFA would want to look into it's own dark cupboards before it starts giving off about anyone else anyway but that's not how it works with them unfortunately.

Now if anyone engaged in overtly anti-sectarian singing, as some have stated, like "no Orange b*******" then Celtic should make an example of those people, find them and ban them for life. As a Republican, I find it abhorrent that there are those who hijack Republicanism for their own racist means. True Republicanism is not sectarian in nature and in fact the founder of modern Irish Republicanism, as well as many other of the greatest Irish Republicans, were Protestants themselves.

The Rodgers banner is grand as far as I'm concerned a bit tongue in cheek, its the fact they thought to put a Vol along side it that irks me, not that I deem it sectarian which on its own merit, it isn't, but disagree for the motives of using it to wind people up. Republicanism by its very nature cannot be Sectarian otherwise it is not Republicanism.

A long banner was unfurled on top of the flag "Rodgers At Work", saying "Brendan's Undefeated Army"
Don't the IFA mob call themselves GAWA? 
Taken all together, the Green Brigade might have (cheekily) calculated that the whole display just came under the radar.

Overall the two games have provided plenty of overtime for the Uefa disciplinary committee.
For Celtic's part, the singing of the  BOTOB and the BBB songs will surely attract fines.

The Soldiers Song and TFOA are regarded as Celtic ethnic,  Celtic are Irish ethnic, always have been since inception, the tricolor has always been there since the foundation. The Palestinian flag is not 'Celtic ethnic', so flying it is illegal. The Poppy WW2 commemoration displays are illegal because it's not part of a club's  or country identity, it's a non football political display when acted out in international competitions.

This annoys me. Not you but what you have said is correct. However, UEFA can disregard their own rules as and when it suits them. That is unfair. Either ban political things completely or not at all

I think it works. The criteria is, if it's part of the club's identity then it's okay.
But there's a limit to what content you can shove in under the banner of  the club's tradition.

But just because the lines of discrimination (between political and non political)  are sometimes vague and contradictory,
I wouldn't like that the  socio/cultural symbols of Celtic's identity be suppressed just because a load of Linfield w'ankers want to fly overtly political and racist banners or some Croat footballer grabs a PA microphone and shouts fascist political slogans to the crowd.
I think it's in order that Uefa respect genuine symbols and expressions of a club's identity and discriminate against others.
It's not perfect but life is not linear.

[tonto1888]

My point was UEFA say you can't make political displays or bring politics into the stadium. Ok. That's the rules. But then they disregard their own rules when it suits them. Minutes silence for Nelson Mandela for example. A political figure.

[Main Street]

My point was UEFA say you can't make political displays or bring politics into the stadium. Ok. That's the rules. But then they disregard their own rules when it suits them. Minutes silence for Nelson Mandela for example. A political figure.

You want everything allowed or you want nothing allowed?
That doesn't work.That's just being reactionary, rigid and very foolish.
Read the rules carefully, there's plenty of leeway for Uefa to interpret situations and decide on merits, for better or for worse.

[Kilkevan]

If you look at the banners, the 'volunteer' has 'ULTRA' on his name badge, this dispels that it was an IRA volunteer but an ULTRA which the GB claim to be. can't see it being called out as sectarian, I'm sure you've seen the pics of GB members with faces covered and glasses on, not saying i approve but they seem to have covered themselves.

I'll have to have a look when I get to a bigger screen. It would surprise me if they haven't done something to cover themselves because they've cleverly gotten their point across with undefeated army and Rodgers at work by it being patently obvious what they meant but it being cloaked enough for them to claim otherwise.

That banner with the Volunteer is pathetic to be honest just a cheap effort at riling "the other side". What the f**k does Brendan Rodgers or a Football match have to do with the IRA.

I often agree with the expressions of a political opinion at Celtic Park, but only so far as there's a point and a cause behind it.

The banner with Rodgers was witty in the context. I think the Green Brigade shot themselves in the foot with the one of the Volunteer though. I don't disagree with them expressing a political opinion and I dispute that a drawing of a Volunteer is sectarian, Republicanism has never been anti-Protestant in the way Loyalism has been and is overtly anti-Catholic. A banner like that is only ever going to end in tears with the sanitised organisation of UEFA (actually horrendously corrupt but likes to think of itself as sanitised). They may, may, have gotten away with the Rodgers one without the Volunteer.

Now in terms of the singing, The Broad Black Brimmer is not a sectarian song. It's political but nowhere does it refer to Protestantism/Orangeism and putting it into the same bracket as "up to our necks in Fenian blood" is horsesh1t. Again with the sanitary towel that is UEFA it's likely to end up causing Celtic problems but personally I don't think it should; UEFA would want to look into it's own dark cupboards before it starts giving off about anyone else anyway but that's not how it works with them unfortunately.

Now if anyone engaged in overtly anti-sectarian singing, as some have stated, like "no Orange b*******" then Celtic should make an example of those people, find them and ban them for life. As a Republican, I find it abhorrent that there are those who hijack Republicanism for their own racist means. True Republicanism is not sectarian in nature and in fact the founder of modern Irish Republicanism, as well as many other of the greatest Irish Republicans, were Protestants themselves.

The Rodgers banner is grand as far as I'm concerned a bit tongue in cheek, its the fact they thought to put a Vol along side it that irks me, not that I deem it sectarian which on its own merit, it isn't, but disagree for the motives of using it to wind people up. Republicanism by its very nature cannot be Sectarian otherwise it is not Republicanism.

Broadly agree. However, if posters here are going by hearsay and were not actually at the match make sure you get your facts right as to what was sung or not sung. If whole stadium was singing add ons, fair enough but I've heard plenty who were at the match saying they heard no such thing. The banners were okay in my book and f**k off with calling certain songs sectarian when they clearly are not

I don't think anyone is calling BBB or BOTOB sectarian. If they are then they're very wrong. I'm guessing the sectarian reference  is in regard to the 'soon there will be no protestants at all' or 'orange b**tards' lines. Both of which are reported to have been sung and both of which are disputed

As I said, if those were sung then the individuals should be identified and punished. If they weren't then I have no issue with what the GB did yesterday. Plenty of people say the BBB and the MP are sectarian, though as you and others, including myself, have said that's completely wrong.

[tonto1888]

My point was UEFA say you can't make political displays or bring politics into the stadium. Ok. That's the rules. But then they disregard their own rules when it suits them. Minutes silence for Nelson Mandela for example. A political figure.

You want everything allowed or you want nothing allowed?
That doesn't work.That's just being reactionary, rigid and very foolish.
Read the rules carefully, there's plenty of leeway for Uefa to interpret situations and decide on merits, for better or for worse.

I will acknowledge that it's maybe a simplistic way of looking at things but the way UEFA operates smacks of 'do as we say, not as we do' to me

[T Fearon]

WTF has the IRA got to do with Celtic, as it says in its mission statement (printed in every match programme) "a Scottish (ie British) Club proud of its Irish roots,and without any political agenda" That means people are using the club,without its approval and contrary to its desire,to promote political views.

As one who attended both Linfield fixtures I now believe it would have been better if away fans had been excluded from both fixtures.

[tonto1888]

From its earliest moments celtic had some form of connections to Irish republicanism. John glass the first president helped organise many political rallies which were attended by Michael Davitt for example.
I'm not saying the singing of IRA songs is right. Or wrong. But for some fans there will always be that connection

[screenexile]

Just curious when you say the broad black brimmer of the IRA can't be seen as sectarian? If you speak to any Protestant I'm fairly sure they would see that as sectarian and why should football supporters be singing songs about the IRA?!

Also if you think the picture of the 'volunteer' is ambiguous because the GB made it that way you're patently wrong. It looks like a paramilitary soldier and in that case why is it at a football match?!

[ned]

Just curious when you say the broad black brimmer of the IRA can't be seen as sectarian? If you speak to any Protestant I'm fairly sure they would see that as sectarian and why should football supporters be singing songs about the IRA?!

Also if you think the picture of the 'volunteer' is ambiguous because the GB made it that way you're patently wrong. It looks like a paramilitary soldier and in that case why is it at a football match?!

Who the f**k cares what somebody or other THINKS is sectarian. The BBB is not sectarian.

[Tony Baloney]

Just curious when you say the broad black brimmer of the IRA can't be seen as sectarian? If you speak to any Protestant I'm fairly sure they would see that as sectarian and why should football supporters be singing songs about the IRA?!

Also if you think the picture of the 'volunteer' is ambiguous because the GB made it that way you're patently wrong. It looks like a paramilitary soldier and in that case why is it at a football match?!

Who the f**k cares what somebody or other THINKS is sectarian. The BBB is not sectarian.

It is within the context in which it was used. This is the same argument you get from themmuns about the Famine Song/Sloop John B etc. "Sure it's just a traditional folk tune". Which it is. When it is played to get a rise out of the other side it is sectarian.