(Spoilers)Making a Murderer - for those who have watched all 10

[J70]

Haven't watched this as this type of show just depresses and angers me, so I have no idea about his likely innocence as based on the evidence it presents, whether or not it is slanted.

But question for Stew - you talk about the local consensus at the time of the murder trial that this man was completely guilty. What was the attitude of the locals at the time this man was convicted for the rape or whatever it was he was later cleared of having done? Were they similarly confident in his guilt then?

[AZOffaly]

To what extent is it a case of everybody just 'knowing' he's a bad bastard, and assuming he did it because that would be like something he'd do?

[themac_23]

How was the ex boyfriend not a lead suspect??? the day the car was found on the yard, who were the only search crew given a camera by the ex bf leading the search? Yip the ones who found the car which was so badly hidden it was unreal. as stated in the documentary surely Avery who had a crusher on site would have disposed of the car and all evidence inside it? Also the ex BF was able to get her voicemails one day online by guessing her password??? Also Halbach had been getting pestering phonecalls for weeks leading up to the murder and by her colleagues admission 'from a number she seemed to recognise' SURELY the ex bf should have been no1 suspect.

[stew]

Haven't watched this as this type of show just depresses and angers me, so I have no idea about his likely innocence as based on the evidence it presents, whether or not it is slanted.

But question for Stew - you talk about the local consensus at the time of the murder trial that this man was completely guilty. What was the attitude of the locals at the time this man was convicted for the rape or whatever it was he was later cleared of having done? Were they similarly confident in his guilt then?

Yes, the problem is he is a hateful **** so people wanted to believe in his guilt to be honest.

[Syferus]

How was the ex boyfriend not a lead suspect??? the day the car was found on the yard, who were the only search crew given a camera by the ex bf leading the search? Yip the ones who found the car which was so badly hidden it was unreal. as stated in the documentary surely Avery who had a crusher on site would have disposed of the car and all evidence inside it? Also the ex BF was able to get her voicemails one day online by guessing her password??? Also Halbach had been getting pestering phonecalls for weeks leading up to the murder and by her colleagues admission 'from a number she seemed to recognise' SURELY the ex bf should have been no1 suspect.

This. Coupled with Officer Coburn's (who was a very naughty boy not filing a report in the mid-90s that might have got Avery released years earlier on the rape case) dispatch check of Halbach's car's reg days before the car was found makes it seem an awful lot like the cops found the car and then moved it onto the Avery lot themselves. Whether they believed Avery to be guilty or they wanted to ruin his civil case that was likely going to bankrupt the county it smacks of incredible malpractice.

[DownFanatic]

How was the ex boyfriend not a lead suspect??? the day the car was found on the yard, who were the only search crew given a camera by the ex bf leading the search? Yip the ones who found the car which was so badly hidden it was unreal. as stated in the documentary surely Avery who had a crusher on site would have disposed of the car and all evidence inside it? Also the ex BF was able to get her voicemails one day online by guessing her password??? Also Halbach had been getting pestering phonecalls for weeks leading up to the murder and by her colleagues admission 'from a number she seemed to recognise' SURELY the ex bf should have been no1 suspect.

This. Coupled with Officer Coburn's (who was a very naughty boy not filing a report in the mid-90s that might have got Avery released years earlier on the rape case) dispatch check of Halbach's car's reg days before the car was found makes it seem an awful lot like the cops found the car and then moved it onto the Avery lot themselves. Whether they believed Avery to be guilty or they wanted to ruin his civil case that was likely going to bankrupt the county it smacks of incredible malpractice.

During the time of the disappearance didn't Avery and the brother say that one night they saw lights and two trucks at the far end of their yard?

[Declan]

Interesting link in this blog to a lecture on saying why people should never speak to the police
https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/07/why_you_should.html

[themac_23]

How was the ex boyfriend not a lead suspect??? the day the car was found on the yard, who were the only search crew given a camera by the ex bf leading the search? Yip the ones who found the car which was so badly hidden it was unreal. as stated in the documentary surely Avery who had a crusher on site would have disposed of the car and all evidence inside it? Also the ex BF was able to get her voicemails one day online by guessing her password??? Also Halbach had been getting pestering phonecalls for weeks leading up to the murder and by her colleagues admission 'from a number she seemed to recognise' SURELY the ex bf should have been no1 suspect.

This. Coupled with Officer Coburn's (who was a very naughty boy not filing a report in the mid-90s that might have got Avery released years earlier on the rape case) dispatch check of Halbach's car's reg days before the car was found makes it seem an awful lot like the cops found the car and then moved it onto the Avery lot themselves. Whether they believed Avery to be guilty or they wanted to ruin his civil case that was likely going to bankrupt the county it smacks of incredible malpractice.

During the time of the disappearance didn't Avery and the brother say that one night they saw lights and two trucks at the far end of their yard?

Yeah, from the top of my head i think it was after the murder but before the car was discovered, said they seen lights on one of the old less frequently used roads into the site

[Jeepers Creepers]

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/making-a-murderer-steven-avery-jurors-feared-for-their-personal-safety-if-they-didnt-convict-subject-of-netflix-series-filmmakers-say-34341335.html

[screenexile]

Nearly finished so reckoned I would chime in with my 2 cents worth.

No. 1 Young Dassey shouldn't be anywhere near this and the fact he lies in prison is shameful! He should be released immediately and the 2 investigators who coerced the statements from him should pay for it... At no point did any of his statements make sense!

Avery I'm not so sure. It's clear to see he's on the lower end of the scale and Stew may be right that he's the scum of the earth but he's still entitled to a fair trial which he didn't get from what I can see. There is no way she was killed in his garage. There is no way he stabbed her and tried to kill her in his trailer there would just have been too much blood around for either of these two things to happen and not one drop was found.

Along with that why wouldn't he have used the crusher for her car to remove all evidence from the yard? It doesn't make sense. Having said that to the best of everyone's knowledge he was the last one to see her so must remain the prime suspect but the evidence is too circumstantial, where was the motive? Where was the murder weapon?

Also the Manitowoc Sheriff's department's role in all this is despicable. Why say they are giving the case to Calumet County and then lead the investigation? Lenk and Colborn are clearly lying bastards and would do anything to sink Avery so how can they be in charge of finding key evidence against a man which they are patently biased against. That Sheriff's department should be cleaned out!!

To my mind there needs to be another trial away to f**k from Manitowoc where facts and arguments can be made to people not prejudiced either way by the case. The bias in the jury from the beginning, given the Prosecutor's grandstanding to the media before the trial, had to be there and it was always an uphill battle!! Avery needs a retrial!!

This case shows how mad some hick towns in America are you just can't question Law Enforcement at all and that's wrong!!

[DownFanatic]

Nearly finished so reckoned I would chime in with my 2 cents worth.

No. 1 Young Dassey shouldn't be anywhere near this and the fact he lies in prison is shameful! He should be released immediately and the 2 investigators who coerced the statements from him should pay for it... At no point did any of his statements make sense!

Avery I'm not so sure. It's clear to see he's on the lower end of the scale and Stew may be right that he's the scum of the earth but he's still entitled to a fair trial which he didn't get from what I can see. There is no way she was killed in his garage. There is no way he stabbed her and tried to kill her in his trailer there would just have been too much blood around for either of these two things to happen and not one drop was found.

Along with that why wouldn't he have used the crusher for her car to remove all evidence from the yard? It doesn't make sense. Having said that to the best of everyone's knowledge he was the last one to see her so must remain the prime suspect but the evidence is too circumstantial, where was the motive? Where was the murder weapon?

Also the Manitowoc Sheriff's department's role in all this is despicable. Why say they are giving the case to Calumet County and then lead the investigation? Lenk and Colborn are clearly lying b**tards and would do anything to sink Avery so how can they be in charge of finding key evidence against a man which they are patently biased against. That Sheriff's department should be cleaned out!!

To my mind there needs to be another trial away to f**k from Manitowoc where facts and arguments can be made to people not prejudiced either way by the case. The bias in the jury from the beginning, given the Prosecutor's grandstanding to the media before the trial, had to be there and it was always an uphill battle!! Avery needs a retrial!!

This case shows how mad some hick towns in America are you just can't question Law Enforcement at all and that's wrong!!

A retrial is the obvious outcome.

[gallsman]

The obvious *desired* outcome perhaps. Not necessarily the obvious outcome.

[screenexile]

The obvious *desired* outcome perhaps. Not necessarily the obvious outcome.

I think it is the obvious logical outcome but will it be the actual outcome?!! I can't see that it will be there's too much at stake for too many people if this thing is done properly.

Anyone signing the petition for Obama should think again as he legally can't pardon any of the lads as it was a state crime not a Federal Crime!

[gallsman]

The obvious *desired* outcome perhaps. Not necessarily the obvious outcome.

I think it is the obvious logical outcome but will it be the actual outcome?!! I can't see that it will be there's too much at stake for too many people if this thing is done properly.

Anyone signing the petition for Obama should think again as he legally can't pardon any of the lads as it was a state crime not a Federal Crime!

Why is it the logical outcome? The documentary suggests he was framed and wrongfully convicted - under the criminal justice sytem, that is not additional evidence that will overturn the conviction. It's not as if some judges in Wisconsin can sit there and watch the show thinking "jaysus, this lad really got it rough. Let's give him a new trial".

[Clov]

His defence attorney was on the radio this morning suggesting that they may be able to initiate a retrial in due course. Basically he said as a result of the series they had been contacted by numerous experts who were developing various tests which may bring new evidence to light.