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good idea to get rid - personally i played for about 10-11 temas between the ages of 18-21 and ended up a physical wreck finished at 23. Managers don't give a rat's ass about players between these ages from my experience which would ahve involved county managers-club and sigerson. all they care about is themselves and their team- the welfare of the player is of the same concern as mud on my shoe. unless you've experienced this as aplayer it's very difficult for anyone to imagine what its like.

"Jeez, they're scraping the barrel a bit if Charlie is a Laochra Gael, n'est pa? "

stands up with anyone from that era - an excellent footballer and freetaker and a nice fella to boot

 

Against an almost full strength dublin team you forgot to add- we could win leinster next year and find out absolutely nothing before the all-ireland series- i don't subscribe to your idea that we're good enough to turn it on and off like the top 2. Kerry were on the same alleged 3 year conditioning programme we are on - ask yourself how well they did in the league.?
You could tell after 10 mins we going to lose- donegal lads were diving on the ball -our lads stood back. fine it's only aleague game but the stats don't lie those that do well in the league are there in september. I think Meath is a banana skin waiting to happen. It's about 5 years since our early season from was so bad. I can never understand Dublin's apathy towards the league - it's not as if we've won all-irelands in recent years by showing no interest in it.

 "think that the physical work being done at training (or the lack of it as the case may be) is causing these inconsistent results.
"

Yes but are all teams not doing that?-that's not an excuse in my view- it was the sheer lack of effort on sunday that pissed off many fans not thta we were beaten. When Caffrey said "winter football is winter football" he summed up their attitude to the league. It's  apity he didn't tell that to the dublin fans who travelled up to ballyshannon yesterday beforehand- then they could have stayed at home.

after our recent performances mate he'll be safe neough with cash i magine.

Dublin were absolutely diabolical- well done to donegal. I don't want to listen to dublin fans saying it's only the league- The reality is those who make the latterstages of the league do well in the All-ireland series. i can't remember when our early season performances were so poor before maybe since the tommy carr reign.
There was no urgency or hunger yesterday- it looked like they were training on the morning of the match. It was shocking stuff- donegal didn't have to play well to win easily. Yu'd wonder if the hunger is till there or has last year finished them off- we weren't missing a whole lot yesterday nd i'd seriously question whether we'll even win leinster this year. It was shocking stuff.

i'd give dublin a chance i don't know what to make of donegal- talented enough to win an al-ireland -mentally just don't seem to have it- seem to have bulked up so much to the detriment of their speed this year. When you look at the talent they have -they should be doing  hell of  al ot better than they are - and to be honest you'd wonder whether mc ivor is the man for the job. they will largely try to kick the shite out of dublin in ballyshannon and may succeed but dublin haven't a bad record up there- i think if donegal decide to apply themselves and pick the best team they have -could go close to the all-ireland -problem is that you never know what you're going to get on any given day from them- must drive their managers insane.

"The main reason I'd be hopeful for Dublin is because the standard isn't too hot out there at the minute (barring the 2 or 3 at the 'top table'). Dublin won't need to be that good to rise through the pecking order. Something has always happened to check their progress. Tom Brady playing football on saturday is a major worry and one hopes he'll snap out of that soon enough. It'd be hard to argue that Ger O'Meara's stint at the big ball game, when he saw fit to ditch his hurl, hasn't affected his form. He was an excellent player before that and still hasn't regained his form. For me the jury is still out on O'Reilly (Kevin). I always thought of him as a free-taker and not much else. I've seen little to convince me otherwise. He did flourish from play in the u21 semi against Offaly last year, but thats because he was unmarked for much of the game (he drifted to the opposite wing and wasn't followed). Dave Henry is also a huge loss from the hurlers - granted he wasn't setting the world alight when he was there, but I've seen him hurl for Raheny since and he would be an excellent addition. Dotsie and Keaney are a massive loss. Moreso than Connolly as they had been part of the team before they opted out. And I presume you never saw Shane Ryan hurl if you wouldn't hold him up in that company. For me he is the best hurler in the county over the past 10 years.

I agree that it will take more time. But the bigger point is that people in Dublin should keep their feet on the ground after a result like sunday's. Its happened before where people have pounced, saying how great such and such a performance was, only for them to go and fall flat the next time out.

It is a good start though. Dublin had very creditiable displays against Clare and Offaly last year in the qualifier series. Ironically it was the defense that didn't perform against Clare, while the forwards played very well.

On the other hand, let us not forget that it is less than a year since that pretty dire defeat by Westmeath in the swamps of PortLaoise.

Its good that theres a good minor and under-21 team but Dublin have shown themselves incapable of bringing players through . How many are still there from the 2001 minor team? Those guys should be in their prime now and should be driving the county side - where are they now though? Having a good minor and under-21 team is all well and good, but its nothing new for Dublin. What is needed, and is needed badly, is that 'in-between' - whatever it takes to get those players from those grades and enable them to flourish into good senior players. Lets face it, minor under-21 is boys stuff compared to the cauldron of senior hurling. Being good underage doesn't guarentee being a good senior."

Well i don't agree with any of that- and i've been watching hurling in dublin for 25 years and i did see shane ryan playing- for me he was not in a dublin hurling jersey long enough to make an assessment- massive potential but that's all it became -potential. To suggest he was better than keaney is a laughable notion. Kenaey as far as i'm concerned was the best hurler in a dublin jersey since Des Foley bar none. If we we still had him we'd make the last 8 of the all-ireland series this year that's how good he was.
As regards o reilly maybe you didn't see the over the shoulder point on sunday from 45 yards with 2 kilkenny men up his arse.- or the penalty loaded with top spin (bearing in mind he's  only 20 but sure let's write him off anyway) in the dying minutes. Sure we''ll do what you say and play no14 o driscoll who by your reckoning made an impact. If he is playing ahead of the likes of O Reilly we can pack it up. I don't believe J Kelly is inter county but he was of more use than O Driscoll last weekend. I disagree about Henry -saw him playing the likes of vincents at intermediate level 3-4 times- made no impact - he's actually one of the few who is a much better footballer in my opinion.
The 2001 minor team didn't win anything- had some good players but ulltimately won nothing -there is a world of difference between the players who win at underage level and the ones who don't. I still maintain and i firmly believe it the guys coming through now have a different skill level to the likes of the 2001 team and a different belief bar keaney. Doesn't mean we're going to win leinster or the national league but if we can find 2 more forwards we may move ahead of wexford and offaly very soon. That at least would be a start. If we don't find a few forwards however we will probably remain behind them-even though i think wexford more than offaly are there for the taking.

its obv that dublin Hurling is on the up

"Standardwise, Dublin are no different than they've ever been. Arguably they may even be worse than, say 3 years back when Keaney and Dotsie were still playing. One thing they have now though (fingers crossed, but question marks would still hang over 1 or 2) is a panel of lads who are there for the long haul. Ability was never the real issue with Dublin. It was gaining any form of momentum with the team. Once they'd do something good, something would come along to undo that - such as those things mentioned already. Dublin have enjoyed wins over Kilkenny and Waterford (a couple of times) in the recent enough past. They weren't capitalised upon, partly (in my opinion) because people made a big hullaballoo about them, putting undue pressure on Dublin to go out and do the same again. "

Can't agree - with respect to keaney and dotsie- they never won anything playing for the county side - the likes of brady-mc caffrey- o reilly have been beating kilkenny at underage level- they don't have the same hang-ups- they don't play with fear. We never gained any momentum because we never had players who believed bar maybe keaney who's still sorely missed. The reality is deep down dublin hurlers never thought they were as good as the rest - the guys coming through now do- that's the difference and they have the techincal level of skill to back it up.
With a fancied minor team and u21 team this year- things are going ok - with repsect bottlethrower- the best 3 hurlers on that minor team 2 years ago were mc caffrey-brady and o reilly and we've brought them all through. If you examine the losses to the football team -(in my view only dotsy- keaney and connolly) are what i would regard as major losses to hurling - i never bought into the notion about the rest. It will take more time and we need to find a few more forwards but if we can get 2 more forwards like o reilly -we can talk about beating wexford and offaly.

well i was at the game today - and quite frankly would be insulted by you (probably a football fan) calling it a flash in the pan.

I didn't mean to insult anyone i just meant is this a false dawn (change original post ) or real progress .

As for Wexford , yes a few more victory's against the big names in the league and I think Wexford will be very worried

Fair enough - i suppose from dublin's point of view it will count for nothing if we don't beat antrim next day out  as well- we've a poor record in casement in recent years but a win would probably secure our status. I think galway will be a bridge too far this year - probably tipp too but we might have a chance against limerick - we've a decent record in terms of going close to beating them recently so we may have a chance there. but i think the key for us is trying to establish ourselves ahead of wexford and offaly- easier said than done but with another excellent u21 team this year and a fancied minor team we may be getting there. still our lads have to do it in the championship.

well i was at the game today - and quite frankly would be insulted by you (probably a football fan) calling it a flash in the pan. There are quality players coming through our system as good as anything in teh country - and i know the hulring snobs from kilkenny and cork may laugh at that- but it's true. They don't all go and play football and these lads have no fear of kilkenny because they've beaten them before.
It was a strong kilkenny team who were well up for it - it means a  100 times more than the walsh cup win a few years ago and it may help secure div 1 status. we have a few defiencies up front still - up over the next 2 years those should be rectified our defenders and midfield are as good as anything in the country - i doubt very much there are any 20 year olds in the country as good as Tomas Brady anD John Mc Caffrey.
It' a good start to the season and maybe beating wexford in rhe championship this year isn't the laughable notion that a lot of people on this board think it is.

that was the freshers -typical hoganstand

if queens can't beat them they have no business being in the sigerson weekend. UCD would be fairly average this year.

dublin 0-14 limerick 1-10 - blessed
would be starting to get concerned now

"As for Tyrone throwing their weight around, all that was missing was Whelan to throw his around, but of course he's still in the box David Brady put him in last august, Dublin whinging about teams getting stuck into them is a bit rich."

Question is which box are the entire Mayo team in - shipwrecked off Skellig Mhichil would be my guess or maybe just off Dingle. Brady is a big a shaper as anybody. Loves courting the media and coming on and throwing his weight around. - slightly hypocritical to compare him as a saint to say the least.