Russia invades Ukraine Feb 2022

[LeoMc]

Going to sound like a crack pot here but I seriously think that either trump or Boris (or both) are Russian agents. Donald has lots of ties to Russia while i remember reading an article a few years ago on how Boris always seem to be protected and be at the right place at the right time. It gave a good few examples going back even before his supposed role as journalist.

Russian assets, not Russian agents. Russia looks for narcissistic gobshites with "larger than life" personalities who it can skilfully help to manipulate and amplify.

They will be presented as "outsiders".

Preferably they will have money problems.

Dominic Cummings, Mick Wallace and George Galloway are definitely Russian assets too.

I'd nearly go further than that with Nigel Farage and Arron Banks.

When the Putin puppet and mass murderer Viktor Yanukovych was president of Ukraine, his main "political technologist" (as they call them in Russia) was Paul Manafort, he of Black, Manafort and Stone, aka "the Torturers' Lobby." Stone is Roger Stone.

Yanukovych fled Ukraine for Russia in 2014 after he turned his firing squad on the peaceful protestors on the Maidan and was impeached 328-0 by the Ukrainian parliament.

Two years later Manafort pitched up as Trump's campaign manager.

Russia has hopelessly compromised the west.

This moment has to change everything. If it doesn't, there will no longer be a west as we understand it.

I would second that Aaron Banks nomination based on his tweets of recent days.  And let's not forget he has Sammy and Ian on a leash so it will be their opinions.
Sammy likely to link Ukraine and Sinn Fein.

[RadioGAAGAA]

So, realistically, what do the West do to stop what right now looks like only a matter of time?

If it were me, I think I'd give the Ukrainians a few nuclear bombs for their aircraft - and make sure the Russian knew they had them. Would certainly give the Russians pause before they push too hard.


[Not that I don't understand Putin's predicament. Parts of Ukraine are less than 450 km from Moscow - its not as if we haven't been here before with the US installing ballistic nuke missiles in Turkey then the Soviets responding by putting their own in Cuba. Cuban missile crisis was actually the Turkish missile crisis - and the Yanks tried very hard to start WW3 twice on the same day; 1962-10-27 - if the situation were reversed, I'd wager hot headed Americans would have started WW3! If Ukraine joins NATO, and the US installed IRBMs, there is no way the Russian forces would have a reaction time sufficient to protect Moscow - even with their Gorgon missiles.

If the 1972 ABM treaty was revisited then there might be scope for fears to be alleviated. But its unlikely the hawks in the US would be up for that.]

[sid waddell]

So, realistically, what do the West do to stop what right now looks like only a matter of time?

If it were me, I think I'd give the Ukrainians a few nuclear bombs for their aircraft - and make sure the Russian knew they had them. Would certainly give the Russians pause before they push too hard.


[Not that I don't understand Putin's predicament. Parts of Ukraine are less than 450 km from Moscow - its not as if we haven't been here before with the US installing ballistic nuke missiles in Turkey then the Soviets responding by putting their own in Cuba. Cuban missile crisis was actually the Turkish missile crisis - and the Yanks tried very hard to start WW3 twice on the same day; 1962-10-27 - if the situation were reversed, I'd wager hot headed Americans would have started WW3! If Ukraine joins NATO, and the US installed IRBMs, there is no way the Russian forces would have a reaction time sufficient to protect Moscow - even with their Gorgon missiles.

If the 1972 ABM treaty was revisited then there might be scope for fears to be alleviated. But its unlikely the hawks in the US would be up for that.]

Putin is not in a "predicament".

Russia has nukes in Kaliningrad - right in the heart of Europe - and from next Sunday, when Belarus has a fake "referendum", he'll be able to have them in Belarus too.

NATO is a defensive alliance and there is nothing in Norway, Poland, the Baltics, Romania, Hungary, Bulgaria etc. which is a remote threat to Russia.

Nor Finland or Ukraine.

Russia has zero case of any kind here.

All the talk of recent months has been pointless. Talking heads talking in "adult" voices, and the vast majority of it unadulterated shite.

If people would just get the following three words through their heads, they will understand this better than listening to a week of commentary.

Putin is Hitler.

Those three words are by far the most accurate summation of where we are. Let those words sink in.

[RadioGAAGAA]

Oh f**k up sid you clown.

Compare the combat doctrines of the USA to the Soviets and now Russians from 1950 to now and its plainly clear to see who is trying to project power across the world by any and all means and who is focussed on a defensive war with nuclear response as main offensive deterrent.


Not saying Putin isn't a c**t, 'cos he is.

But your so far up yer own arse you can't see beyond yer own sh!te.

[sid waddell]

Oh f**k up sid you clown.

Compare the combat doctrines of the USA to the Soviets and now Russians from 1950 to now and its plainly clear to see who is trying to project power across the world by any and all means and who is focussed on a defensive war with nuclear response as main offensive deterrent.


Not saying Putin isn't a c**t, 'cos he is.

But your so far up yer own arse you can't see beyond yer own sh!te.

Who is trying to project power here?

You are calling what Russia is doing "a defensive war"?

What?

[sid waddell]

Putin on NATO:

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1496289085224550404.html

To those arguing that NATO expansion has been a constant source of tension with Russia, a few facts. 1/ THREAD

November 2001, Putin said this: "we differ in the ways and means we perceive that are suitable for reaching the same objective... [But] one can rest assured that whatever final solution is found, it will not threaten ... the interests of both our countries and of the world."

Putin also in 2001, "Russia acknowledges the role of NATO in the world of today, Russia is prepared to expand its cooperation with this organization. " 3/

"And if we change the quality of the relationship, if we change the format of the relationship between Russia and NATO, then I think NATO enlargement will cease to be an issue—will no longer be a relevant issue." 4/

In 2001, on whether he opposed the Baltic states' membership in NATO, Putin stated, "We of course are not in a position to tell people what to do. We cannot forbid people to make certain choices if they want to increase the security of their nations in a particular way." 5/

Putin, May 2002, "I am absolutely convinced that Ukraine will not shy away from the processes of expanding interaction with NATO and the Western allies as a whole." 6/

Putin on Ukraine in NATO: "Ukraine has its own relations with NATO; there is the Ukraine-NATO Council. At the end of the day, the decision is to be taken by NATO and Ukraine. It is a matter for those two partners." 7/

So what changed? Democratic expansion, or what Putin calls US-supported coups in the post-communist world. Kremlin concerns about NATO expansion have been a variable, not a constant, over the last 30 years. They spike AFTER democratic breakthroughs. 8/

[Sportacus]

The bombing has begun.  I honestly didn't think Putin was this mad. Horrendous act of aggression with horrendous consequences.

[sid waddell]

https://twitter.com/Nat_Vasilyeva/status/1496718103367016449

Nataliya Vasilyeva
@Nat_Vasilyeva

To wake up in a Nazi Germany. I'm ashamed and can't breathe.

[RadioGAAGAA]

Who is trying to project power here?

You are calling what Russia is doing "a defensive war"?

What?

As usual, your incapable of reading in context.

Context to your notion of NATO being a defensive organisation and that being enough to placate Russia (or USSR before them). Clearly, the main member of NATO is not defensive nor has engaged in defensive actions on a time frame across decades.



Anyway, shit's really hit the fan now. The West will have to come up with something else, cos a few sanctions aren't gonna cut it if China do their own thing.

[sid waddell]

Who is trying to project power here?

You are calling what Russia is doing "a defensive war"?

What?

As usual, your incapable of reading in context.

Context to your notion of NATO being a defensive organisation and that being enough to placate Russia (or USSR before them). Clearly, the main member of NATO is not defensive nor has engaged in defensive actions on a time frame across decades.



Anyway, shit's really hit the fan now. The West will have to come up with something else, cos a few sanctions aren't gonna cut it if China do their own thing.

That's shite.

You talked about "projecting power in the world" and a "defensive war".

The US and NATO aren't projecting power here and Russia is NOT waging a defensive war.

If you cannot come out and state what is happening here, we can draw more than reasonable conclusions about your worldview.

[Armagh18]

Ah the morally correct westers warmongers, starting countless wars all over the world in the last 70+ years, outraged over Russia sorting out it's doorstep. The only tragic thing here is innocent people dying, Slavic brothers killing each other, while the US makes a buck.

Stole that from another site but pretty accurate.

[JPGJOHNNYG]

Ah the morally correct westers warmongers, starting countless wars all over the world in the last 70+ years, outraged over Russia sorting out it's doorstep. The only tragic thing here is innocent people dying, Slavic brothers killing each other, while the US makes a buck.

Stole that from another site but pretty accurate.

Aye its all Americas fault . Today has shown us that Putin knew fine well that the West would do nothing. Boris and his sanctions was a bit like in Team America - the we will have to write to you an angry letter. Joke. Ukraine should already be planning for a massive guerilla campaign as they have no hope with convetional warfare.

[Farrandeelin]

Ah the morally correct westers warmongers, starting countless wars all over the world in the last 70+ years, outraged over Russia sorting out it's doorstep. The only tragic thing here is innocent people dying, Slavic brothers killing each other, while the US makes a buck.

Stole that from another site but pretty accurate.

Aye its all Americas fault . Today has shown us that Putin knew fine well that the West would do nothing. Boris and his sanctions was a bit like in Team America - the we will have to write to you an angry letter. Joke. Ukraine should already be planning for a massive guerilla campaign as they have no hope with convetional warfare.

Totally agree with regards sanctions. I don't know how many are imposed already, but it's not working. Russia will probably hit back with their own sanctions anyways. I wonder is Putin calling America's bluff when he mentions the most 'catastrophic thing in history' bit? Or has he the arsenal to actually wage war in all directions. China agreeing with Russia going by early reports too.

When I say agreeing - I mean blaming the US.

[Rossfan]

Ah the morally correct westers warmongers, starting countless wars all over the world in the last 70+ years, outraged over Russia sorting out it's doorstep. The only tragic thing here is innocent people dying, Slavic brothers killing each other, while the US makes a buck.

Stole that from another site but pretty accurate.

Aye its all Americas fault . Today has shown us that Putin knew fine well that the West would do nothing. Boris and his sanctions was a bit like in Team America - the we will have to write to you an angry letter. Joke. Ukraine should already be planning for a massive guerilla campaign as they have no hope with convetional warfare.

A place the size of Russia would be self sufficient and won't give a damn about US or EU or others' sanctions.
The "west" will hardly invade or come to military aid of Ukraine for fear of triggering WW3.

[seafoid]

Ah the morally correct westers warmongers, starting countless wars all over the world in the last 70+ years, outraged over Russia sorting out it's doorstep. The only tragic thing here is innocent people dying, Slavic brothers killing each other, while the US makes a buck.

Stole that from another site but pretty accurate.

Aye its all Americas fault . Today has shown us that Putin knew fine well that the West would do nothing. Boris and his sanctions was a bit like in Team America - the we will have to write to you an angry letter. Joke. Ukraine should already be planning for a massive guerilla campaign as they have no hope with convetional warfare.

A place the size of Russia would be self sufficient and won't give a damn about US or EU or others' sanctions.
The "west" will hardly invade or come to military aid of Ukraine for fear of triggering WW3.

The West is focusing  on sanctions with more expected this afternoon.