Messages

Yes, we reserve that right for sure. The GAA need to be very careful though. The black card experience is a good example of this.

I've not heard one workable or sensible solution yet or even a clear definition of what the problem is. That's the place to start.

There are as many scores on average in games as there have ever been.

What exactly is the problem we are trying to solve? what are the outcomes we want?

Benny, using the black card as a stick to beat those who are proposing rule changes is unfair. The Black card was brought into deal with cynical fouling, not legal, defensive, strategies. The performance of the black card is debatable, but it's a separate debate in my view.

Not sure AZ. I think Benny has a very valid point. If you think about it logically the effect of defenders having to be more and more careful does translate into more players becoming defenders to simply fill space and channels on the pitch without having to really put in a tackle which could see them get a black card.

I agree they are separate debates but I do believe the black card has had an indirect effect on systems teams now employ.

Alot of this is us as a nation loving to whinge about something and a poor enough game on a bad night is a good excuse. TV and the egos and wallets of pundits and commentators throws petrol on the fire too.

We'll have some shit games this year and some brilliant ones too. It's always been that way.

I'm with Keyser. Nothing to see here.

[We brought players back as game went on but kept at least 3 forwards in Derry half at all times]

sure they only booed when derry were on the ball

As above, they were Dublin fans expecting the home team to win. Dublin played the same defensive tactics throughout. Did you see the game?

Did you see the game? We boo'd Derry for bringing that putrid shite to Croke Park as Donegal and Tyrone have done before them   It has fcuk all to do with winning or not winning.

And you are talking through your rear end if you think playing that way is our preferred approach. That was complete nonsense from McIvor afterwards to try and deflect some of the criticism that was coming his way

I did. So you aren't denying Dublin played the same defensive tactics as Derry played throughout the game? At least that makes one Dublin poster on here. The bit i'm confused with though is you admit to booing Derry for their tactics yet it's fine for Dublin to do it? Why so?

I never said that was Dublin's preferred way of playing. Where did you get that from? Derry played the most attacking football i seen last year out of anyone, it got them hammered in the league final and 0 championship wins. I wouldn't say it's Derry's preferred way of playing either but needs must.

I didn't say that we setup same as Derry. In fact i said that claim was patent nonsense from McIvor. We brought players back as game went on but kept at least 3 forwards in Derry half at all times. As Kerry showed last year in AIF the only ay to beat this shite is to close on copy it. Otherwise as happened us v Donegal you get caught on the break.

I like many others wont be paying good money to watch this crap. Nor will I keep going to our away games in Ulster as i have done in the past. This approach might be within the rules but will if not tackled do serious damage to Gaelic football as the most popular sport in the country.  20k in CP last Sat. You wouldn't get half that if they put that game on again any time soon.

Surely for the good of the game Dublin should have pushed all their men forward? Derry would have scored more and the game would have been better value for money. No?

This is like a teenager in the playground whose defence is 'sir, but he hit me first'.

McIver was 100% right. One team played one way, the other adapted and played the same. The funny thing is if Dublin hadn't played defensively they'd have lost to an understrength Derry team. They nearly did anyway.

I like Joe's style of writing and colour. However,  on examination, his articles are almost without exception whimsical horseshit. Of course, because he moulds his views so eloquently to appear logical,  the masses generally nod their heads at the wonder of Joe's wig and grammar.

After the emotion and everything else has passed, this is probably the most insightful and accurate critique I've seen to date. Nailed it. Up da masses.

Mayo whipped Monaghan and then escaped by the skin of their referee teeth out of Celtic Park last week.

Result is a foregone conclusion.

Boys saying "f**k" in every sentence all the time in front of kids. And worse, not knowing or caring. Very sad.

If you propose a motion to unilaterally change the terms of a legally-binding contract, it's a good bet it's going to be ruled out of order. Better that than have it pass only to be ruled illegal on a court of law.

2017. Do pay attention.

Still, they ruled it not either a rule or an enactment of a rule which is kinda hard to argue with.

Better luck next year!

I agree. We've already crossed that line or are dangerously close to it, AZ.

Also, what is the long term vision for this global GAA?

Do we envisage that we will build stadiums in other countries specifically for GAA?

G stands for Gaelic. Are we seeking to embed Gaelic culture and language in other areas of the world?

And you hit the nail on the head. Nevermind the games changing, at what point does the culture and 'brand GAA' itself change when it needs to be altered to further capture more revenue and more 'exposure'?

Coming back to the thread title, Sky will either walk away from the GAA or they'll take over completely like they have in english soccer. Their entire history shows evidence of that. This 'middle of the road' approach does not exist in their makeup.

not disagreeing with anyone here. Just making the point that there's a very weak correlation between televised games and participation in GAA.

we're told 'promotion and exposure of the games' is paramount and above all else. What this actually translates to is 'maximising revenue opportunies to pay for all seater stadia' is above all else.

I know AZ. I used to do the same when I was a kid. Pretended to play cricket with a hurl and tennis ball and american football and all sorts of stuff.

there's a big step to go to formally set up clubs and retain children's interest though and organise fixtures.

they're fads as you say.

The easy access to clubs has nothing (or very little) to do with sky sports though. It's about well run clubs and numbers of good volunteers. The people who really promote the GAA on the front line are the people in clubs, not sky sports and not croke park.

In my experience games on tv or otherwise have absolutely no impact on the levels of participation.

We seem to be wedded to the idea (or is that peddled the idea) that audience exposure = increased participation when it's total nonsense imo.

Alot of people watched the superbowl in this country but there's no rush to send kids to play american football.

What starts out as a discussion about persistent fouling goes off on a dozen tangents once the 'c' word is used.

The ability to move players en masse around a pitch is anything but cynical. It's smart football if the best of defensive play can be combined with the best of attacking play.

The problem is that in Gaelic football it still pays to foul. Many teams who are winning are committing between 30-40 fouls per game. The penalties applied by referees do not stack up against the rate of fouling. Referees simply need to implement their own directives and rules instead of the ad hoc, game by game method we usually encounter.

That's the issue here so let's stick to that.

It's part of the game now for most teams. The top teams all foul persistently as there is no real sanction applied against it. It's a no brainer really if you are a coach.

e.g. Kerry did it routinely on Sunday at Celtic Park.

It's up to the referees to implement their own directives. They have been told that persistent fouling = 2 fouls which equals a yellow card. Not counting the goalkeeper that means a maximum of 28 fouls per team without a red card. Kerry committed 32 fouls according to media reports and didn't have anyone red carded (three yellows, one black). Derry had 18 fouls resulting in two yellows, one black and one red card. Obviously subs can play a role here too in the total. Also fouls on the ball like over carrying don't obviously count. Not picking on Kerry as they play lovely football too but it's just the last game I saw. Derry did it systematically nine years ago against Tyrone to great effect so it's not new.

The black card was largely a waste of time in trying to combat cynical play because it failed to address the real cynical foul which was the small tug of the arm or the jersey to break up play. The bottom line is that it still pays to foul in football as some referees ignore their own directives once a game starts.

http://www.gaa.ie/fixtures-and-results/

Click on the national football league logo.

Click on fixtures and results.
Click on national football league.
Click view league table.

Seems ok to me.

The "league tables" link on the main fixtures page looks to be wrong. That's probably the confusion..

It's an automated system I think same as most counties.