The Big Bailout of the Eurozone (Another crisis coming? - Seriously)

[Declan]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaZWyoOeA_o&sns=em


 

The debt explained again. Frightening

[Billys Boots]

Out of curiosity who were the protagonists in FF and the business/banking world who were involved in developing the policies that led to the Celtic tiger and its subsequent collapse?

Never forget the PDs role in this.
The Galway races tent probably played a big role.
The media cheerleaders, not least the Indo/Sindo.
Bertie and Social Partnership, which in other countries would be a good idea, but not here. It simply turned into Qango jobs for the boys.
The 'One man show' portrayed so heroically in the media, Sean Fitzpatrick, Michael Fingleton, Sean Quinn, Bertie etc. It always ends in disaster (as those calling for Michael O'Leary to be made Taoiseach need to bear in mind).
Parish Pump politicians - the list is endless.
Corrupt representatives - Ray Burke, George Redmond etc.

And far too much easy credit with no responsible adults around

http://www.forbes.com/sites/karlwhelan/2013/06/28/the-anglo-tapes-the-guarantee-and-irelands-economic-crisis/

But it is very hard to stop a boom once it gets going.

Good article seafóid, fair play!

[give her dixie]

100 things Ireland could have got for the price of one Anglo Irish Bank...


http://brianmlucey.wordpress.com/2013/06/30/100-things-ireland-could-have-got-for-the-price-of-one-anglo-irish-bank/

[armaghniac]

In that 100 things, Bertie doesn't seem great value

Hire Bertie to speak for 95 years

which doesn't seem as value as

Pay the salaries of TCD and UCD academics for 100 years. (i.e. pay several thousand people with a clue to speak)
Build 11,150 miles of dual carriageway
Build a shed 10k long by 4k wide and put it around Tullamore...

[johnneycool]

I suppose if the State removes the speed limits on the roads you can blame those car drivers for speeding and the resultant carnage.

Not only did they remove the speed limits, they made it easy for you to buy a ferrari and told you incessantly the road was going to be straight.

The crash was always going to be spectacular with those 'light touch regulations' in place.

Now you could argue that Joe Public was foolish in believing them, but anyone who wasn't on following this path was laughed at as being a scaremonger etc, etc. The lack of real true leadership in places of power and knowledge confounded this and they're going to walk into the sunset scot free, devoid of all blame and accountability.

[muppet]

Would it be better giving us all €100,000 each and let us decide what to do with it, instead of giving it all to the Banks and having them decide? (I know its a stupid idea but as the days go on it seems giving it to the banks is a worse one)

Wouldn't that be great - I'd give mine straight back to First Trust/AIB and get myself out of negative equity.  It's win-win.  Bank gets the cash, I feel a bit better and start spending money again.

It is a real pity all of the bailout money wasn't done from the bottom up, rather than from the top down.

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/anglo/if-we-got-the-four-billion-from-that-shower-of-clowns-on-dame-st-29401100.html

[omagh_gael]

I asked a couple of weeks ago who were the main players behind the Celtic Tiger policies, however, I have a few more questions:

1. So huge sums of money entered the Irish economy to kick start the boom. Did all this come from bond holders and the money markets? Or did the Irish government ask the mint to start printing away at the euros. I'm sure the 2nd option is very unlikely as it was a Europe wide currency and Ireland probably couldn't make those decisons.

2. Did anyone out there (politicians/academics/journalists etc.) put their hand up and say these policies were economic suicide either before or during the boom?

[muppet]

I asked a couple of weeks ago who were the main players behind the Celtic Tiger policies, however, I have a few more questions:

1. So huge sums of money entered the Irish economy to kick start the boom. Did all this come from bond holders and the money markets? Or did the Irish government ask the mint to start printing away at the euros. I'm sure the 2nd option is very unlikely as it was a Europe wide currency and Ireland probably couldn't make those decisons.

2. Did anyone out there (politicians/academics/journalists etc.) put their hand up and say these policies were economic suicide either before or during the boom?

1. Actually for the infamous Promissory Note, the Irish Central Bank 'created' the money out of nothing. But that was after the crash.

The money that drove the boom came in via bondholders who bought bonds (debt) from our banks. This built up to a frenzy of lending especially once a) Bank of Scotland entered the market and b) AIB & BOI decided to try to match the insane activities of Anglo, to match their profits. There were warnings issued to our Government in the early 2000s about an overheating economy but the arrogance of McCreevy and Harney in particular, and the political needs of Bertie, led to them being ignored. (1998:http://www.independent.ie/business/overheating-irish-economy-could-threaten-euro-waigel-26179615.html, 2000:http://www.rte.ie/news/2000/0221/5691-inflation/, 2009 Report: http://www.thejournal.ie/warning-on-economy-repeatedly-ignored-by-bertie-aherns-government-report-94679-Mar2011/)

2. Morgan Kelly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gd6ZwqLePC0 for one. McWilliams and others were predicting a property crash.

[omagh_gael]

Cheers Muppet. 7.8% growth in one quarter is scary in comparison to the quarterly econmic growth/shrinkage of today's economy! Hindsight is wonderful but surely these buck eejits should have known that a major catastrophe was going to happen sooner or later. Were their egos and shelfishness that extreme they allowed this continue to meet their own needs?

From Muppet's link:

The warning comes as growth figures from the central statistics office show that the economy grew at a rate of 7.8 per cent in the second quarter of last year. The Minister for Finance, Charlie McCreevy, yesterday predicted the current boom in the Irish economy would continue, despite the worst inflation figures in a decade.

[muppet]

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/conned-a-german-view-of-ireland-1.1454115?page=1

[Billys Boots]

Ah shure haven't we punished Fianna Fáil enough, the poor feckers!!

[muppet]

[magpie seanie]

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/conned-a-german-view-of-ireland-1.1454115?page=1

An encouraging article and a pretty clear roadmap as to what we MUST do as a nation for those who hadn't copped this already.

We really are a nation that personifies the theme of "The Emporer's New Clothes." "The EU has been great for Ireland - look at all the money they gave us"......."soft landing"......"go away and commit suicide"

Our politicians are largely scum and fools but the people of this country keep voting for them and expecting a different result.

It's time for something different. Take back our oil and start again. Never, ever vote for FF, FG or Labour - they have all repeatedly failed the people. The people have suffered enough - it's time we took control back.

[thejuice]

It's time for something different. Take back our oil and start again. Never, ever vote for FF, FG or Labour - they have all repeatedly failed the people. The people have suffered enough - it's time we took control back.

Damn right. It's high time we tried something else. Take a brave step and walk away from the civil war parties, just this once and see what happens. Start thinking nationally and forget the parish pump for once.

[Rossfan]

It's time for something different. Take back our oil and start again. Never, ever vote for FF, FG or Labour - they have all repeatedly failed the people. The people have suffered enough - it's time we took control back.

Damn right. It's high time we tried something else. Take a brave step and walk away from the civil war parties, just this once and see what happens. Start thinking nationally and forget the parish pump for once.

Well lads what practical realistic steps have ye in mind?
Remember in a democracy you can only vote for the candidates that stand for election in YOUR constituency.
Or are ye advocating another Egypt/Libya/Syria or what.
Or are ye just letting off frustrated steam ?