The Big Bailout of the Eurozone (Another crisis coming? - Seriously)

[Main Street]

I didn't mean people who buy bank shares. I meant - what do you call people who put their money in the bank and expect to get it back, even with a little interest?

Of course those people are called depositors/savers, who now in the rampant cynical arrogance of the Troika, face being blatantly pillaged of their assets by direct debit.
First suck them into the Euro then pillage their assets. Cyprus was doing fine before they joined the Euro, it's been downhill all the way since. North Cyprus are doing alright with their semi-independent currency, the turkish Lira.
The defective architecture of the Euro monetary system ensured that the banking/economic sectors would collapse with the inevitability of a pyramid scheme collapse.
The ECB purchase of  bonds was always a rip off, it was not designed to repair the economic collapse, nor the monetary issues. It was designed to recover debts from those who had no responsiblity and hit the least well off the worst.

Shades of reminisces with Nazi Germany, first Hitler savaged the lower income groups, when that was exhausted he went for the middle incomes, as well as pillage and plunder of some reasonably well to do Germans - the Jews, followed by pillage and plunder of other countries' economic assets and turning mass populations into slave labour.

[Hardy]

Surely you couldn't design a scheme better calculated to torpedo confidence in the banking system than to steal people's money from their accounts? Who is going to invest in EU banks now?

Do you think it was right for the 26 country resident  posters on the board to bail out Anglo, Hardy?

Yeah - I thought it was a great idea. Wtf?

the thing about the whole cat melodoen mess is that there are no easy answers.

"Investors" will sell bank shares in a panic and pick them up again when the yield becomes irresistible. 
It's pathological.

I didn't mean people who buy bank shares. I meant - what do you call people who put their money in the bank and expect to get it back, even with a little interest?

I think there are little people and very wealthy people in that group and they should probably be treated differently.

I think there are little people, very wealthy people and criminals in that group. Neither the little people nor the very wealthy people should have their money stolen. Apart from the morality of it, there is a consequence of stealing people's money. For the banking system and, by extension, of course, the economy the consequences of stealing from wealthy people, unfortunately, are more severe than those of stealing from the weak.

The criminals, of course, should have their money confiscated.

[Declan]

http://www.businessinsider.com/gartman-cyprus-stealing-russian-money-2013-3

[magpie seanie]

Its a good job this wasn't suggested in Ireland because our political patsies would have doubtless agreed to it.

[Billys Boots]

Am I correct in thinking that the Cypriot 'authorities' thought that this would not be problematic as the majority of their countries deposits were 'funny' money from Russia? 

[seafoid]

Surely you couldn't design a scheme better calculated to torpedo confidence in the banking system than to steal people's money from their accounts? Who is going to invest in EU banks now?

Do you think it was right for the 26 country resident  posters on the board to bail out Anglo, Hardy?

Yeah - I thought it was a great idea. Wtf?

the thing about the whole cat melodoen mess is that there are no easy answers.

"Investors" will sell bank shares in a panic and pick them up again when the yield becomes irresistible. 
It's pathological.

I didn't mean people who buy bank shares. I meant - what do you call people who put their money in the bank and expect to get it back, even with a little interest?

I think there are little people and very wealthy people in that group and they should probably be treated differently.

I think there are little people, very wealthy people and criminals in that group. Neither the little people nor the very wealthy people should have their money stolen. Apart from the morality of it, there is a consequence of stealing people's money. For the banking system and, by extension, of course, the economy the consequences of stealing from wealthy people, unfortunately, are more severe than those of stealing from the weak.

The criminals, of course, should have their money confiscated.

Or maybe they could just convert bank debt into equity

[Declan]

Am I correct in thinking that the Cypriot 'authorities' thought that this would not be problematic as the majority of their countries deposits were 'funny' money from Russia?

That's my read of it

[Declan]

Continuing on the good news:
Bank of Ireland annual report reveals that CEO Richie Boucher was paid €910,000 last year.

[magpie seanie]

Continuing on the good news:
Bank of Ireland annual report reveals that CEO Richie Boucher was paid €910,000 last year.

Is that not illegal?

[magpie seanie]

What is the limit does anyone know?

I see he "waived" 67k of it. 67k 0 imagine being able to "waive" that much money. I assume by "waive" they mean - don't pay until I leave/the public anger dies down.

[Declan]

Yep -its hard to get really good people to run the banks don't you know

On the bigger picture -  BBC Breaking News ‏@BBCBreaking
Royal Air Force flight heading to Cyprus with 1m euros in emergency cash for British military staff and families, Ministry of Defence says.

Now this Cyprus thing could really be the beginning of the end

[magpie seanie]

Yep -its hard to get really good people to run the banks don't you know

On the bigger picture -  BBC Breaking News ‏@BBCBreaking
Royal Air Force flight heading to Cyprus with 1m euros in emergency cash for British military staff and families, Ministry of Defence says.

Now this Cyprus thing could really be the beginning of the end

You said it.

[Declan]

Listen to this - Athanasios Orphanides, former governor of the Central Bank of Cyprus, talks about a proposed unprecedented levy on Cyprus's bank deposits and the potential impact on Europe's financial system. Orphanides speaks with Tom Keene and Sara Eisen on Bloomberg Television's "Surveillance." Megan Greene, chief economist at Maverick Intelligence, also speaks.

http://www.bloomberg.com/video/orphanides-on-cyprus-bailout-europe-s-banks-Aw79nWd1QH~jz5tVDF7cRA.html

Cuts straight to the chase - We're witnessing the slow death of the European project. We have decisions taken by strongest government in Europe that have been spreading misery sequentially to citizens

[muppet]

Listen to this - Athanasios Orphanides, former governor of the Central Bank of Cyprus, talks about a proposed unprecedented levy on Cyprus's bank deposits and the potential impact on Europe's financial system. Orphanides speaks with Tom Keene and Sara Eisen on Bloomberg Television's "Surveillance." Megan Greene, chief economist at Maverick Intelligence, also speaks.

http://www.bloomberg.com/video/orphanides-on-cyprus-bailout-europe-s-banks-Aw79nWd1QH~jz5tVDF7cRA.html

Cuts straight to the chase - We're witnessing the slow death of the European project. We have decisions taken by strongest government in Europe that have been spreading misery sequentially to citizens

I think this started right at the beginning. When the Euro started, our cost and standard of living along with most of the eurozone's were well below Germany's. The cost of living rose quickly, putting pressure on wages to match which artificially improved the standard of living. This had the effect of making Germany's economy more productive while having the opposite effect on most of the rest, purely by the introduction of the Euro.

The increase in wages (thank you Bertie) was mismanaged in different ways in each country (€50,000 annual pensions for hairdressers in Greece, property boom here and in Spain etc.). Germany's 'prudent' behaviour meant low yields there, so their banks lent to the high yielding lunatics here (free movement of Capital is a priority). High yields usually means high risk, but not in the Eurozone it doesn't. Thus free movement of capital isn't matched by an equivalent movement of risk.

So in conclusion for us the Euro, made us unproductive, allowed Germany and others to take high yields while fuelling a disastrous property boom, forced the pillaging of for example private pensions and finally the Euro heads have ordered us all to pay back the speculators.

Meanwhile for Germany the Euro artificially made them more productive, gave them high yields in the good times and got the PIIGS to pay off their risky investments in the bad times.

[seafoid]

Listen to this - Athanasios Orphanides, former governor of the Central Bank of Cyprus, talks about a proposed unprecedented levy on Cyprus's bank deposits and the potential impact on Europe's financial system. Orphanides speaks with Tom Keene and Sara Eisen on Bloomberg Television's "Surveillance." Megan Greene, chief economist at Maverick Intelligence, also speaks.

http://www.bloomberg.com/video/orphanides-on-cyprus-bailout-europe-s-banks-Aw79nWd1QH~jz5tVDF7cRA.html

Cuts straight to the chase - We're witnessing the slow death of the European project. We have decisions taken by strongest government in Europe that have been spreading misery sequentially to citizens

I think this started right at the beginning. When the Euro started, our cost and standard of living along with most of the eurozone's were well below Germany's. The cost of living rose quickly, putting pressure on wages to match which artificially improved the standard of living. This had the effect of making Germany's economy more productive while having the opposite effect on most of the rest, purely by the introduction of the Euro.

The increase in wages (thank you Bertie) was mismanaged in different ways in each country (€50,000 annual pensions for hairdressers in Greece, property boom here and in Spain etc.). Germany's 'prudent' behaviour meant low yields there, so their banks lent to the high yielding lunatics here (free movement of Capital is a priority). High yields usually means high risk, but not in the Eurozone it doesn't. Thus free movement of capital isn't matched by an equivalent movement of risk.

So in conclusion for us the Euro, made us unproductive, allowed Germany and others to take high yields while fuelling a disastrous property boom, forced the pillaging of for example private pensions and finally the Euro heads have ordered us all to pay back the speculators.

Meanwhile for Germany the Euro artificially made them more productive, gave them high yields in the good times and got the PIIGS to pay off their risky investments in the bad times.

This article by George Soros is worth a read

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/2012/sep/27/tragedy-european-union-and-how-resolve-it/