The Big Bailout of the Eurozone (Another crisis coming? - Seriously)

[ludermor]

Very sad to see this
Of course if his name had been Anglo Irish he would still be going strong.
irishtimes.com - Last Updated: Monday, November 7, 2011, 17:30
Radio presenter declared bankrupt


Last year, three judgements were made against the presenter in the High Court, totalling €770,044.09. The interest accrued on these judgments to date has increased that figure to €879,695.87.

Of course if he was a builder he would be hung drawn and quatered. No word on how he managed to run up such a massive tax bill?

[Billys Boots]

Of course if he was a builder he would be hung drawn and quatered.

I'm sorry, I must have missed all these executions of builders - when did this happen?

[ludermor]

Of course if he was a builder he would be hung drawn and quatered.

I'm sorry, I must have missed all these executions of builders - when did this happen?

Plenty of virtual executions of builders on the gaaboard, there is very little sympathy for their plight ( deservedly so in a lot of cases) but when a well known likaeable radio presenter gets in trouble over property deal it is sad.

[muppet]

Very good article.

(An unqualified layman's view)
The biggest problem though is that the powerful part of the financial sector, for all its money, doesn't create any real wealth. It merely creates bubbles and/or transfers money from the foolish to the smart. When it goes horribly wrong it holds governments to ransom.

Look at Goldman Sachs. Less than 10 years ago it created the market for Credit Default Swaps for CDOs containing subprime mortgages. This was insurance without the burden of insurance regulation or the reserve funding behind normal insurance. After a couple of very successful years selling these Swaps, Goldman then moved, as it does, to the middle of the market and offloaded the risk on others, AIG in particular. When the market turned it was the US taxpayer who got hit for $100bn for AIG and had to put around $20bn into Goldman. Once Goldman had repaid the $20bn the massive gravy train resumed as normal for its executives. They win on the upside while the taxpayer loses on the downside.

In Ireland we really got on board with this type of crazy capitalism. Except our then Government, who weren't sophisticated enough to create bubbles in things like CDO or CDS market, went for what they knew best. They inadvertently or deliberately inflated a huge property bubble. Smart people made a lot of money and got out. Less smart (or unlucky or whatever) got nailed. Ultimately though the taxpayer has to foot the bill.

Even if the austerity works, and the taxpayers manage to re-capitalise the banking system (pump money into the holes in the Swiss cheese that we were told was solid brickwork) what will be done to make sure it doesn't happen again?

Personally I think the banking sector should be split into two main parts: a viciously regulated and fire-walled systemic part and a sink or swim on its own investment part.

[Declan]

That's about right muppet  - And guess where the new head of the ECB Mr Draghi worked  previously - You guessed it Goldman Sachs!

[Billys Boots]

It's like the scene where most of the receivers now being appointed to ailing businesses hail from the self-same financial-houses that advised the companies to get arse-over-heel into 'business-development' debt in the first-place. 

[Rossfan]

Of course if he was a builder he would be hung drawn and quatered.

I'm sorry, I must have missed all these executions of builders - when did this happen?

Around the same time as  those F***ers - Fitz, Fingers, Fianna Fáil , etc ..... never 

[Declan]

More good news for the Euro!
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2011/1108/breaking9.html

[Rossfan]

One company moves it's something oe other .
The end of the world as we know it eh? 

[muppet]

Italian bonds 6.78%

IMF will 'visit' in the next few days.

Wine tasting no doubt.

[Hardy]

Bring a little water, Silvie.

[Lone Shark]

Can anybody explain something to me?

Existing Italian bonds in the marketplace drop to a price that equates to a 7% yield. The market panics, so the ECB steps in and buys existing Italian debt.

From what I can tell, all this does is bail out those who made the mistake of buying the debt?

Now we have the Italians panicking because they need to issue debt tomorrow - surely it would have made more sense for the ECB to hold fire and step in now? Why spend money bailing out already issued debt when you could just buy some of the new stuff?

I suspect trickery going on here, but can anyone enlighten me otherwise as to why this would be policy?

[muppet]

Can anybody explain something to me?

Existing Italian bonds in the marketplace drop to a price that equates to a 7% yield. The market panics, so the ECB steps in and buys existing Italian debt.

From what I can tell, all this does is bail out those who made the mistake of buying the debt?

Now we have the Italians panicking because they need to issue debt tomorrow - surely it would have made more sense for the ECB to hold fire and step in now? Why spend money bailing out already issued debt when you could just buy some of the new stuff?

I suspect trickery going on here, but can anyone enlighten me otherwise as to why this would be policy?

You think they were looking that far ahead?

[Christmas Lights]

As someone who knows really nothing about all of this, could anyone with a grasp of what is happening explain to me what would happen if the whole Eurozone basically went bang?  Would all countiries using the Euro have to revert back to their own currencies?

I see some theroists say that the Eurozone was just one big experiment from the start and that it wasnt sustainable.
Also, there was a rumour going around that the Irish Government where printing Punts a while back just in case 

[Lone Shark]

Can anybody explain something to me?

Existing Italian bonds in the marketplace drop to a price that equates to a 7% yield. The market panics, so the ECB steps in and buys existing Italian debt.

From what I can tell, all this does is bail out those who made the mistake of buying the debt?

Now we have the Italians panicking because they need to issue debt tomorrow - surely it would have made more sense for the ECB to hold fire and step in now? Why spend money bailing out already issued debt when you could just buy some of the new stuff?

I suspect trickery going on here, but can anyone enlighten me otherwise as to why this would be policy?

You think they were looking that far ahead?

Not at all. But why spend money buying existing debt when it doesn't matter if the private sector absorb losses?