The Palestine thread

Started by give her dixie, October 17, 2012, 01:29:42 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

give her dixie

Britain ready to back Palestinian bid for statehood at UN

Britain is prepared to back a key vote recognising Palestinian statehood at the United Nations if Mahmoud Abbas pledges not to pursue Israel for war crimes and to resume peace talks.

Abbas, president of the Palestinian Authority, has called for Britain's backing in part because of its historic responsibility for Palestine. The government has previously refused, citing strong US and Israeli objections and fears of long-term damage to prospects for negotiations.

On Monday night, the government signalled it would change tack and vote yes if the Palestinians modified their application, which is to be debated by the UN general assembly in New York later this week. As a "non-member state", Palestine would have the same status as the Vatican.


Whitehall officials said the Palestinians were now being asked to refrain from applying for membership of the international criminal court or the international court of justice, which could both be used to pursue war crimes charges or other legal claims against Israel.

Abbas is also being asked to commit to an immediate resumption of peace talks "without preconditions" with Israel. The third condition is that the general assembly's resolution does not require the UN security council to follow suit.

The US and Israel have both hinted at possible retaliation if the vote goes ahead. Congress could block payments to the Palestinian Authority and Israel might freeze tax revenues it transfers under the 1993 Oslo agreement or, worse, withdraw from the agreement altogether. It could also annex West Bank settlements. Britain's position is that it wants to reduce the risk that such threats might be implemented and bolster Palestinian moderates.

France has already signalled that it will vote yes on Thursday, and the long-awaited vote is certain to pass as 132 UN members have recognised the state of Palestine. Decisions by Germany, Spain and Britain are still pending and Palestinians would clearly prefer a united EU position as counterweight to the US.

Willian Hague, the foreign secretary, discussed the issue on Monday with Abbas and the French foreign minister, Laurent Fabius, offiicals said.

Palestinian sources said Hillary Clinton, the US secretary of state, raised the issue with Abbas at his Ramallah headquarters last week, shortly before a ceasefire was agreed in the Gaza Strip, as had Tony Blair, the Quartet envoy.


Abbas has been widely seen to have been sidelined by his rivals in the Islamist movement Hamas, as well by his failure to win any concessions from Israel. Abbas, whose remit does not extend beyond the West Bank, hopes a strong yes vote will persuade Israel to return to talks after more than two years.

Officals in Ramallah have opposed surrendering on the ICC issue so it can be used as a bargaining chip in future, but views are thought to be divided. Abbas said at the weekend: "We are going to the UN fully confident in our steps. We will have our rights because you are with us."

Leila Shaid, Palestine's representative to the EU, said: "After everything that has happened in the Arab spring, Britain can't pretend it is in favour of democracy in Libya, Syria and Egypt but accept the Palestinians continuing to live under occupation. As the former colonial power, Britain has a historic responsibility to Palestine. Britain is a very important country in the Middle East, it has extensive trade relations, and David Cameron should know he risks a popular backlash from Arab public opinion if he does not support us."

Palestinians have rejected the claim that they are acting unilaterally, calling the UN path "the ultimate expression of multilateralism". Israel's apparent opposition to unilateralism has not stopped it acting without agreement to build and expand settlements, they say.

guardian.co.uk © Guardian News and Media 2012
next stop, September 10, for number 4......

Denn Forever

I have more respect for a man
that says what he means and
means what he says...

Rossfan

So there are now only 3 "rogue states" left in the World- U.S, Israel and North Korea.
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

seafoid

Quote from: give her dixie on November 27, 2012, 08:15:32 AM
Britain ready to back Palestinian bid for statehood at UN

Britain is prepared to back a key vote recognising Palestinian statehood at the United Nations if Mahmoud Abbas pledges not to pursue Israel for war crimes and to resume peace talks.

Abbas, president of the Palestinian Authority, has called for Britain's backing in part because of its historic responsibility for Palestine. The government has previously refused, citing strong US and Israeli objections and fears of long-term damage to prospects for negotiations.

On Monday night, the government signalled it would change tack and vote yes if the Palestinians modified their application, which is to be debated by the UN general assembly in New York later this week. As a "non-member state", Palestine would have the same status as the Vatican.


Whitehall officials said the Palestinians were now being asked to refrain from applying for membership of the international criminal court or the international court of justice, which could both be used to pursue war crimes charges or other legal claims against Israel.

Abbas is also being asked to commit to an immediate resumption of peace talks "without preconditions" with Israel. The third condition is that the general assembly's resolution does not require the UN security council to follow suit.

The US and Israel have both hinted at possible retaliation if the vote goes ahead. Congress could block payments to the Palestinian Authority and Israel might freeze tax revenues it transfers under the 1993 Oslo agreement or, worse, withdraw from the agreement altogether. It could also annex West Bank settlements. Britain's position is that it wants to reduce the risk that such threats might be implemented and bolster Palestinian moderates.

France has already signalled that it will vote yes on Thursday, and the long-awaited vote is certain to pass as 132 UN members have recognised the state of Palestine. Decisions by Germany, Spain and Britain are still pending and Palestinians would clearly prefer a united EU position as counterweight to the US.

Willian Hague, the foreign secretary, discussed the issue on Monday with Abbas and the French foreign minister, Laurent Fabius, offiicals said.

Palestinian sources said Hillary Clinton, the US secretary of state, raised the issue with Abbas at his Ramallah headquarters last week, shortly before a ceasefire was agreed in the Gaza Strip, as had Tony Blair, the Quartet envoy.


Abbas has been widely seen to have been sidelined by his rivals in the Islamist movement Hamas, as well by his failure to win any concessions from Israel. Abbas, whose remit does not extend beyond the West Bank, hopes a strong yes vote will persuade Israel to return to talks after more than two years.

Officals in Ramallah have opposed surrendering on the ICC issue so it can be used as a bargaining chip in future, but views are thought to be divided. Abbas said at the weekend: "We are going to the UN fully confident in our steps. We will have our rights because you are with us."

Leila Shaid, Palestine's representative to the EU, said: "After everything that has happened in the Arab spring, Britain can't pretend it is in favour of democracy in Libya, Syria and Egypt but accept the Palestinians continuing to live under occupation. As the former colonial power, Britain has a historic responsibility to Palestine. Britain is a very important country in the Middle East, it has extensive trade relations, and David Cameron should know he risks a popular backlash from Arab public opinion if he does not support us."

Palestinians have rejected the claim that they are acting unilaterally, calling the UN path "the ultimate expression of multilateralism". Israel's apparent opposition to unilateralism has not stopped it acting without agreement to build and expand settlements, they say.

guardian.co.uk © Guardian News and Media 2012
The Palestinians should sue Israel's ass for war crimes.
The hypocrisy of the chosen people needs to be exposed.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Lar Naparka

Quote from: Denn Forever on November 26, 2012, 04:26:46 PM
Is the truce holding up?

I can't see the truce lasting as it's not in Israel's best interests to maintain it. Nethanyahu and his supporters started the latest conflict in order to boost their electoral chances and it appears that they have failed dismally in this.
The widespread perception is that the Gazans came off better in this instance and I'm sure the Israeli hawks are itching for an excuse to have another go to recover lost prestige if nothing else.
Some folks never learn.....
Nil Carborundum Illegitemi

seafoid


Israel-U.S. effort to soften wording of Palestinian UN bid has failed, official says



http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/israel-u-s-effort-to-soften-wording-of-palestinian-un-bid-has-failed-official-says.premium-1.480931

Israeli official says senior PA negotiator Saeb Erekat refuses U.S. request to discuss UN bid; Washington seeks to alter proposal's wording in order to minimize the political fallout.

By Barak Ravid | Nov.27, 2012 | 1:59 PM | 3

By Barak Ravid | Nov.27,2012 | 1:59 PM | 39


Israel, U.S. hold secret talks on softening Palestinian Authority's UN bid

By Barak Ravid | Nov.27,2012 | 1:59 PM | 11



American-Israeli efforts to soften the wording of the proposed United Nations General Assembly resolution regarding the recognition of a Palestinian state has failed, an Israeli official said on Tuesday.

Haaretz has learned that the push did not succeed because the Palestinians refused to add a clause to the draft that would prevent them from filing criminal charges against Israeli officials at the International Criminal Court in The Hague. The General Assembly was due to vote on the proposal on Thursday.

The Palestinians distributed the final draft of the General Assembly resolution early on Wednesday morning in New York and are refusing to pursue any further discussions on the matter.

Over the past two days, the United States has made attempts to alter the wording of the resolution in order to minimize the political damage that will likely result from the General Assembly vote, in which the Palestinians are expected to garner a large majority.

Earlier Tuesday, Haaretz reported that Israel had joined the American effort, and that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu sent his special envoy, lawyer Isaac Molho, to Washington on Sunday to work on the issue along with senior Obama administration officials.

A senior Israeli official involved in the international contacts to soften the wording of the resolution stated that the effort was too little, too late and had ended in failure. In his words, senior Obama administration officials contacted the chief of the Palestinian negotiating team Saeb Erekat on Wednesday and asked him to come to Washington urgently in order to negotiate the wording of the resolution, but Erekat refused.

"Erekat told the Americans that he didn't have any time and that he would speak with them after the [General Assembly] vote," said the senior Israeli official.

At the center of Palestinian steadfast refusal to alter the resolution draft lies the demand that a clause be inserted into the resolution stating that the Palestinians would not approach the ICC in order to file charges against Israeli officials.

The United Kingdom has made it clear to the Palestinians that it will support their measure in the United Nations if they provide guarantees that they will not seek to file criminal charges against Israeli officials with the ICC. The British did not state whether they were requesting oral or written guarantees from the Palestinians.

The Palestinians made it clear to the U.S. and several prominent European Union member states that they are only prepared to provide an oral guarantee that they will not seek to file charges with the ICC for a temporary period of approximately half a year. After the end of this period, they stated, they would consider themselves no longer bound by this guarantee.

After responding negatively to American efforts to alter the wording of the resolution, the Palestinian delegation to the UN in New York distributed a final draft of the resolution proposal that is contained below. In this draft, which in any event is phrased in general and relatively moderate terms, some minor changes were inserted in response to requests made by some European countries. The principal change was the emphasis placed on the necessity of the immediate renewal of the peace process with Israel.

5. The General Assembly expresses the urgent need for the resumption and acceleration of negotiations within the Middle East peace process, based on the relevant United Nations resolutions, the Madrid terms of reference, including the principle of land for peace, the Arab Peace Initiative and the Quartet Roadmap, for the achievement of a just, lasting and comprehensive peace settlement between the Palestinian and Israeli sides that resolves all outstanding core issues, namely the Palestine refugees, Jerusalem, settlements, borders, security and water.

Also included in the resolution draft was a clause stating:

4. The General Assembly affirms its determination to contribute to the achievement of the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people and the attainment of a peaceful settlement in the Middle East that ends the occupation that began in l967 and fulfills the vision of two States, an independent, sovereign, democratic, contiguous and viable State of Palestine, living side by side in peace and security with Israel, on the basis of the pre-1967 borders.


According to the final draft of the resolution, the GA will state that it grants to Palestine the status of an observer nation that isn't a full member of the UN. The resolution will establish that the designation of this status to Palestine will not harm in any manner either the position or rights of the Palestine Liberation Organization as the representative of the Palestinian people in the framework of the UN.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

give her dixie

Palestinians say UN bid is last-ditch peace effort

By By KARIN LAUB, Associated Press – 40 minutes ago 

RAMALLAH, West Bank (AP) — A bid for U.N. recognition of a state of Palestine is a last-ditch attempt to rescue troubled Mideast peace efforts, a Palestinian spokeswoman said Wednesday, rejecting Israel's charge that it is an attempt to bypass negotiations.

Hanan Ashrawi, a senior Palestinian official, urged the U.S. to drop its opposition to the bid, dismissing Washington's stance as "pathetic" and harmful to American interests in the region. The Palestinians have come under intense pressure from the U.S., Britain and others to modify the bid but "have not succumbed," she said.

On Thursday, Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas plans to ask the U.N. General Assembly to recognize Palestine in the West Bank, Gaza and east Jerusalem, areas Israel captured in the 1967 Mideast war. Israel withdrew from Gaza in 2005 but still controls most access.

The Palestinians expect some two-thirds of the General Assembly's 193 members will accept Palestine as a non-member observer state. The U.S., Israel, Canada and a few others are opposed.

The vote will not change the situation on the ground, yet the Palestinians still say it is significant.
Abbas has said U.N. recognition is not meant to replace negotiations with Israel, but to improve Palestinian leverage and secure the pre-1967 war frontiers as the baseline for future border talks — an idea Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has rejected.

This does not mean the U.N. vote will pave the way for a quick resumption of talks, which broke down four years ago.

Abbas has said he will not negotiate as long as Israel keeps expanding settlements on war-won land. Half a million Israelis now live in the West Bank and east Jerusalem, blurring the 1967 lines.
Beyond a 10-month partial halt in 2009 that failed to restart sustained peace talks, Netanyahu has refused to freeze construction in settlements.

Abbas aides have given conflicting accounts of whether U.N. recognition of "Palestine" would soften his demands for a settlement freeze ahead of any negotiations.

Referring to Israeli settlement building, Ashrawi said Wednesday that the U.N. bid "is a last-ditch effort, because we believe the two-state solution (a Palestinian state alongside Israel) is in jeopardy as a result of these actions."

She said if the U.S. "can't vote yes, at least don't vote no, because that would be seen as being really pathetic by the rest of the world."

Deputy U.S. Secretary of State William Burns met with Abbas Wednesday at his New York hotel in a last-minute attempt to halt the U.N. bid, Abbas aide Saeb Erekat said.

Burns told Abbas that the U.N. vote goes against U.S. interests and President Barack Obama would make a new push in 2013 to see a Palestinian state formed through negotiations, Erekat said.

Burns "asked President Abbas to change his mind," the aide said.
Abbas told Burns that the vote would take place on Thursday, as planned, Erekat said.

Israeli government spokesman Mark Regev dismissed the U.N. quest as futile, saying only negotiations with Israel can bring about a Palestinian state.

"They can get pieces of paper from the U.N., but they are not going to move peace forward, they are not going to make a Palestinian statehood more real," he said.

"They boycott Israel. They refuse to talk to us. Who do they plan to make peace with?" he said.
Surveys indicate most Palestinians have become disillusioned with prospects of setting up a state through negotiations. Two decades of talks have failed to produce results, marred by intransigence and repeated bouts of violence.

The vote comes at an important time domestically for Abbas, who has watched his political rival, the Islamic militant group Hamas, gain popularity, particularly after holding its own during an Israeli offensive on Hamas-ruled Gaza earlier this month. The military action was aimed at stopping almost daily rocket barrages from the Gaza Strip at southern Israel.

Hamas, which seized control of Gaza from Abbas in 2007, argues that negotiations with Israel are a waste of time, but Hamas leaders have come out in support of the U.N. bid in recent days.

During Israel's Gaza offensive, Abbas was largely sidelined at his compound in the West Bank, underscoring international concerns that the deadlock in peace efforts is increasingly weakening him and other Palestinian pragmatists.

Abbas aides have said they expect key European countries to support the U.N. bid in an attempt to strengthen Abbas.

France, Spain, Norway, Denmark and Switzerland have pledged support. Germany said it would not support the initiative, while Britain's foreign secretary said his government would not oppose it. He said Britain would only vote in favor if the Palestinians softened some of the language.

Israel appeared to be backing away from plans to immediately punish the Palestinians for going to the U.N. Instead, an Israeli government official said Israel would wait to see whether the Palestinians would use the world body's expected approval to hurt Israel.

The Palestinians plan to seek membership or access to a number of international and U.N. agencies, including the International Criminal Court, once their statehood bid is approved.

Israel would respond "forcefully" if the Palestinians try to pursue war crimes charges against Israel at the ICC, said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity to discuss policy considerations. If the Palestinians use their upgraded international status "as a tool to confront Israel in the international arena, there will be a response."

Until then, he said, Israel will be bound by its obligations to the Palestinians under existing peace agreements, but won't necessarily go beyond them. Earlier there was talk of Israel's retaliating by canceling the partial peace accords.
next stop, September 10, for number 4......

seafoid

We'll see tomorrow how many countries around the world support the right of Jews to settle the West Bank and pretend they own the place. 


http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/israel-won-t-punish-palestinians-for-un-statehood-bid.premium-1.480997#


Israeli ambassadors worldwide have been instructed to pressure every country to publish an announcement, regardless of how they will vote, emphasizing that the borders of the Palestinian state and the other core issues will be decided only by direct negotiations with Israel. The ambassadors have been asked to demand that the announcements will acknowledge that this symbolic decision does not change facts on the ground and does not recognize Palestinian sovereignty over the West Bank, Gaza Strip or East Jerusalem.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Rossfan

In other words the whole world is out of step except the rogue State of Israel  >:(
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

give her dixie

An Israel that opposes the UN resolution is an Israel that wants to strengthen Hamas and a return of terror.

By Gideon Levy | Nov.29, 2012 | 1:27 AM

http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/november-29.premium-1.481277#.ULbribHTrMM.facebook

The writer Amos Oz recalls that day, 65 years ago, in his novel "A Tale of Love and Darkness": "On Saturday morning, they said, the General Assembly would convene at a place called Lake Success and there they would determine our fate. 'Who is for life and who for destruction,' said Mr. Abramski."

Abramski was right. If he were alive today, he would have similar things to say about want will happen tonight in the UN General Assembly. Who is for life and who for destruction. If Israel was a wise and reasonable country, it would have to join the family of nations this evening, not including Micronesia, and vote proudly for the completion of the previous vote on November 29: two states for two peoples. And if there were a real peace camp in Israel, its members would flock en masse to the tiny rally being held in front of Independence Hall in Tel Aviv, where this State of Israel was declared.

But Israel, as usual, says no. First, hurling childish threats, with unparalleled chutzpah, bullying and condescension: we'll punish the Palestinian Authority; we'll hit it in its pocket; we'll build 3,000 apartments in the settlements. And now, in a weaker voice, we're "lowering our profile." And no is still no.

When Israel says no, what does it mean? That the talk of two states is one big fraud; that it simply doesn't want peace; that the world can go jump in a lake; that the Palestinians are forbidden to fight for their freedom, either with weapons or with diplomacy; no to Hamas and no to PA President Mahmoud Abbas. No, and no. Jerusalem's thousand nos.

Israel will say no tonight, not just to the Palestinians, but to the whole world, except its patron, the United States, which will apparently humiliate itself again and draw even more hatred by voting automatically with Israel. Most Israelis will not even ask themselves how we reached the point at which the entire world really is against us; whether, perhaps, Israel has some part in it, to which voting against the resolution will only add.

"The automatic majority," as Israel disparagingly calls the sane majority in the United Nations, will vote for recognition of Palestine as a nonmember state. Because that is the right and necessary step to take; Israeli propagandizing word play will not help. "A unilateral step," Israel, in its temerity, calls it, while Israel builds more and more settlements in a step that is anything but multilateral. "A breach of the Oslo Accords," Israel accuses, although Israel never met its obligation for the "third phase," which was to have transferred most of the West Bank to Palestinian control 15 years ago.

An Israel that opposes the UN resolution is an Israel that wants to strengthen Hamas and a return of terror. There is no other way to explain its intransigence. But of all its baseless and foolish reasons for its opposition, one stands out: the danger that, after their change of status in the UN, the Palestinians will supposedly appeal to the International Criminal Court in The Hague regarding the war crime of moving the population of the occupying state into the occupied territories.

What exactly is Israel afraid of? After all, Retired Justice Edmond Levy will make it alright. In fact, he already has: the committee he headed has already determined that there is no occupation at all and the settlements are completely kosher. And so what is there to fear? Could it be that despite the acclaimed Levy report, there is something to worry about? After all, the International Criminal Court fights war crimes and is esteemed by the whole world. On the contrary, let Israel send retired Justice Levy to that court to present Israel's justified and persuasive arguments.

Mr. Abramski is long dead. So is Mrs. Tosia Krochmal, the neighbor of the young Amos on Amos Street in the Jerusalem neighborhood of Kerem Avraham who, 65 years ago, brought the extension cord from the sewing machine in her husband's doll hospital to the Lembergs' house, so they could bring their heavy black radio out to their balcony, to hear the "voices of Lake Success." This evening, no one will be listening to the radio. Israel will continue to bury its head in the sand, to disconnect from reality, to ignore the world, ignore justice and proclaim: No.
next stop, September 10, for number 4......

glens abu

Well thats the Irish on their way to Gaza...... the generosity of the irish people again has been wonderful, this team of 13 women and men are heading to gaza to both build and strengthen links with the youth of gaza among others. We have seen just a glimpse of the daily sufferings the palestinian have to endure at the hands of the terrorist goverment and forces of israel and how they have defended their land and familys, Irish friends of Palestine will be meeting Palestinians from all walks of life and i know they will carry the message from us all here in Ireland that we are with them, we will be their voice when the world continues to ignore them... So good luck to Irish delegation, especially my friends MaryKate Quinn, Sinead MacLochlainn Phil Mc Cullough John Mallon Gerry MacLochlainn and Daithi Mac Giolla Mhaoil , there are no better people who are representative of the Irish....also a big fundraising night in the P.D this Saturday for Irish Medical Aid for Palestine helping to buy much needed medical equipment in labour wards and theatres in Gaza.. please show your support and come along..... Tiocfaidh ar Palestine

SF have organised street collections between 1pm and 3pm on Sat for Medical aid for Palestine and also holding a function in the PD club Belfast on Sat night,all welcome.

glens abu

Sinn Féin MLA's to visit GazaNovember 29, 2012

Sinn Féin MLA's Pat Sheehan and Caitriona Ruane are to travel to Gaza this week as part of a European parliamentarian delegation. The purpose of the visit is to witness  first hand the situation in Gaza following eight days of intensive naval and aerial bombardment by Israeli forces.

Speaking ahead of the visit Mr Sheehan said:

"The impact on Gaza following a week of severe bombardment by Israeli forces is dramatic. It further compounds the destruction of infrastructure including roads, schools, hospitals, sanitation works and government buildings that have been destroyed or damaged in the Israeli assault four years ago.

"Given this and the ongoing illegal blockade by Israel which makes it extremely difficult to bring in the materials needed to rebuild this vital infrastructure the situation in Gaza is very serious.

"Myself and Caitriona Ruane will see first hand the damage that was caused indeed the human tragedy. We will meet with a the Al Dalu who lost ten family members when their house was hit by an Israeli missile. We will also meet with local politicians, NGO's and UNRWA."

give her dixie

This evenings vote at the UN has taken another few twists and turns, and it now looks like only the United States, Canada, Micronesia, the Marshall Islands and possibly the Czech Republic are voting for Israel. I have been very disappointed that in the past few years, Canada under Harper has joined the US stance in unconditional support for Israel.

Israel suffered a defeat in their 8 day "Pillar Of Cloud" attack both in Gaza and in PR damage. Tonight they will suffer another defeat and bar the countries mentioned above, Palestine will finally get some form of recognition from the world. It's the least they deserve after 64 years. There are now major cracks appearing in the Zionist dream, and time will only tell what happens next.

Today is world solidarity day for Palestine, and there is some excitement in Palestine today. It's been a tough couple of weeks, and maybe this vote can put a smile back on the faces of those who suffered for a little while.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/germany-backtracks-on-palestinian-bid-israeli-official-we-lost-europe.premium-1.481392

Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas and the Palestinian people are enjoying sweeping support in the lead up to Thursday night's vote at the UN General Assembly over whether to upgrade the Palestinians' standing to non-member observer status. By Thursday morning Israel time, that support had turned into a full-on landslide, as more European nations decided to alter their positions, essentially leaving Israel to fend for itself.

Early Thursday morning, just hours before the vote -- scheduled to take place around 11:00 P.M. (Israel time) -- Germany changed its mind, deciding to abstain from voting rather than opposing the Palestinian initiative, as Israel had assumed it would.

"The decision wasn't taken lightly," Foreign Minister Guido Westerwelle said. "Germany shares the goal for a Palestinian state. We have campaigned for this in many ways, but the recent decisive steps towards real statehood can only be the result of negotiations between Israelis and Palestinians," the German official said.

The UN General Assembly is expected to pass a historic resolution recognizing Palestine within the 1967 borders as a non-member observer state.

At least 150 countries are expected to vote in favor of the resolution. In opposing the resolution, Israel is likely to find itself isolated with the United States, Canada, Micronesia, the Marshall Islands and possibly the Czech Republic – although sources at the Foreign Ministry said Germany's decision would likely affect the Czech vote as well.

This, in effect, leaves Israel without any European country supporting it at the international forum. Officials in Israel said that Germany's decision was influenced by Britain. "Britain's dramatic reversal prompted the Germans to change their mind," a Foreign Ministry official said. "We lost Europe. More than half of its countries will vote with the Palestinians, and the rest will abstain."

Bulgaria and Romania, with whom Israel has held intensive discussions in the last day, have also backtracked on their positions, as both intend to abstain. Belgium, meanwhile announced Thursday morning that it will vote in favor of the Palestinians. Belgium's foreign minister Didier Reynders said his UN envoy will stress that his country urges the renewal of negotiations between Israelis and Palestinians.

Speaking in Jerusalem hours before the vote, Prime Minister Netanyahu said the UN General Assembly's recognition of Palestine as a non-member observer state "will not change anything on the ground." Netanyahu denounced the international community and said that, "No matter how many fingers are raised against us, there is no power in the world that can force Israel to compromise on its security."

Netanyahu said the decision will not advance the establishment of a Palestinian state, but rather push it farther away. "Israel's hand is outstretched in peace, but a Palestinian state will not be formed without recognition of Israel as the Jewish state," the prime minister said.

"A Palestinian state will not rise without declaring an end to the conflict and without security arrangements that protect Israel's citizens. None of these issues are mentioned in the UN General Assembly decision. These are just some of the reasons why we are rejecting the proposed resolution."

Netanyahu added: "Peace can only be achieved through direct negotiations without preconditions between the parties, and not through unilateral decisions made at the UN. I suggest we not pay heed to the applause at the UN. I remember when Israel's unilateral disengagement from Gaza received international applause; we got applause and then rockets. Israel withdrew from Gaza and Iran went in. The same exact thing happened when we left Lebanon. As prime minister, I will not allow the growth of another Iranian terror base in Judea and Samaria – the heart of the country – just a kilometer outside of central Jerusalem."
next stop, September 10, for number 4......

glens abu

Quote from: give her dixie on November 29, 2012, 01:50:58 PM
This evenings vote at the UN has taken another few twists and turns, and it now looks like only the United States, Canada, Micronesia, the Marshall Islands and possibly the Czech Republic are voting for Israel. I have been very disappointed that in the past few years, Canada under Harper has joined the US stance in unconditional support for Israel.

Israel suffered a defeat in their 8 day "Pillar Of Cloud" attack both in Gaza and in PR damage. Tonight they will suffer another defeat and bar the countries mentioned above, Palestine will finally get some form of recognition from the world. It's the least they deserve after 64 years. There are now major cracks appearing in the Zionist dream, and time will only tell what happens next.

Today is world solidarity day for Palestine, and there is some excitement in Palestine today. It's been a tough couple of weeks, and maybe this vote can put a smile back on the faces of those who suffered for a little while.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/germany-backtracks-on-palestinian-bid-israeli-official-we-lost-europe.premium-1.481392

Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas and the Palestinian people are enjoying sweeping support in the lead up to Thursday night's vote at the UN General Assembly over whether to upgrade the Palestinians' standing to non-member observer status. By Thursday morning Israel time, that support had turned into a full-on landslide, as more European nations decided to alter their positions, essentially leaving Israel to fend for itself.

Early Thursday morning, just hours before the vote -- scheduled to take place around 11:00 P.M. (Israel time) -- Germany changed its mind, deciding to abstain from voting rather than opposing the Palestinian initiative, as Israel had assumed it would.

"The decision wasn't taken lightly," Foreign Minister Guido Westerwelle said. "Germany shares the goal for a Palestinian state. We have campaigned for this in many ways, but the recent decisive steps towards real statehood can only be the result of negotiations between Israelis and Palestinians," the German official said.

The UN General Assembly is expected to pass a historic resolution recognizing Palestine within the 1967 borders as a non-member observer state.

At least 150 countries are expected to vote in favor of the resolution. In opposing the resolution, Israel is likely to find itself isolated with the United States, Canada, Micronesia, the Marshall Islands and possibly the Czech Republic – although sources at the Foreign Ministry said Germany's decision would likely affect the Czech vote as well.

This, in effect, leaves Israel without any European country supporting it at the international forum. Officials in Israel said that Germany's decision was influenced by Britain. "Britain's dramatic reversal prompted the Germans to change their mind," a Foreign Ministry official said. "We lost Europe. More than half of its countries will vote with the Palestinians, and the rest will abstain."

Bulgaria and Romania, with whom Israel has held intensive discussions in the last day, have also backtracked on their positions, as both intend to abstain. Belgium, meanwhile announced Thursday morning that it will vote in favor of the Palestinians. Belgium's foreign minister Didier Reynders said his UN envoy will stress that his country urges the renewal of negotiations between Israelis and Palestinians.

Speaking in Jerusalem hours before the vote, Prime Minister Netanyahu said the UN General Assembly's recognition of Palestine as a non-member observer state "will not change anything on the ground." Netanyahu denounced the international community and said that, "No matter how many fingers are raised against us, there is no power in the world that can force Israel to compromise on its security."

Netanyahu said the decision will not advance the establishment of a Palestinian state, but rather push it farther away. "Israel's hand is outstretched in peace, but a Palestinian state will not be formed without recognition of Israel as the Jewish state," the prime minister said.

"A Palestinian state will not rise without declaring an end to the conflict and without security arrangements that protect Israel's citizens. None of these issues are mentioned in the UN General Assembly decision. These are just some of the reasons why we are rejecting the proposed resolution."

Netanyahu added: "Peace can only be achieved through direct negotiations without preconditions between the parties, and not through unilateral decisions made at the UN. I suggest we not pay heed to the applause at the UN. I remember when Israel's unilateral disengagement from Gaza received international applause; we got applause and then rockets. Israel withdrew from Gaza and Iran went in. The same exact thing happened when we left Lebanon. As prime minister, I will not allow the growth of another Iranian terror base in Judea and Samaria – the heart of the country – just a kilometer outside of central Jerusalem."

Thats good news for a change,maybe the tide is turning at last.

Denn Forever

Please, no more rockets into israel.  Don't give them any excuse.
I have more respect for a man
that says what he means and
means what he says...