Armagh v Derry - Ulster Final, 14th May, 2023 @ 4pm

[seafoid]

I see a statement online now from Sheila Maguire (wife of fermanagh player Stephen Maguire) confirming the account of the assault in Monaghan in 1999.

That's not good for RG.

Did her statement come out before he "stepped back"?

I'm sure for all concerned she should have made that statement public at the time

If you read her post it is clear she didn't know the story 2 years ago.  There are probably several people who could fill in the backstory for the PPS. There must be doctors who saw injuries. And it wasn't confined to the home. Some of it happened in public. RG stepping back from his dream project, the first Derry back to back since the 70s, is the first time his power has been challenged in 24 years.

[Walter Cronc]

Some of you need to read this thread...

https://twitter.com/Sineadmcgar/status/1656946720486350848?t=EuciV12QYX1abR2h4tTzUA&s=19

Yes she's seen examples. Does this apply to Rory Gallagher?. None of us know that answer. Given a witness has come forward this needs a full investigation.

I love the way you just throw out that this needs full investigation as if all parties are willing or even capable of cooperating with authorities. Just sounds so simple. Even the authorities have limited skills and abilities in these situations. Police, the courts, and social services aren't always the magic recipe to help victims.

So what then if not a reopening of all the timeline/events?

[Rois]

I was at a Saffron Business Forum lunch yesterday - 600 people in attendance. Anyone else who was there can correct me (I may have lost concentration somewhere amid the 5 hour long formalities...) but I didn't hear a single word uttered about the Ulster Final from the stage, other than Peter Canavan who made a joke to Jarlath Burns about winning Liam McCarthy. Not one mention - completely bizzare in a room full of GAA supporters.

[Louther]

I was at a Saffron Business Forum lunch yesterday - 600 people in attendance. Anyone else who was there can correct me (I may have lost concentration somewhere amid the 5 hour long formalities...) but I didn't hear a single word uttered about the Ulster Final from the stage, other than Peter Canavan who made a joke to Jarlath Burns about winning Liam McCarthy. Not one mention - completely bizzare in a room full of GAA supporters.

Has been very obvious as the week went on. Some podcasts even avoiding discussion round the game. Others not mentioning management or tactics, the BBC social was a great example for their live podcast on the Ulster final. Someone has posted that they clarified their position before going to air but I'd say it was nearly halfway through before they got to the Ulster final itself and then it was a very light touch. A tough position for them in fairness.

[seafoid]

Some of you need to read this thread...

https://twitter.com/Sineadmcgar/status/1656946720486350848?t=EuciV12QYX1abR2h4tTzUA&s=19

Yes she's seen examples. Does this apply to Rory Gallagher?. None of us know that answer. Given a witness has come forward this needs a full investigation.

I love the way you just throw out that this needs full investigation as if all parties are willing or even capable of cooperating with authorities. Just sounds so simple. Even the authorities have limited skills and abilities in these situations. Police, the courts, and social services aren't always the magic recipe to help victims.

So what then if not a reopening of all the timeline/events?

I think it could be very helpful. This week jogged the memory of at least one witness.

[redzone]

I've fully swung from a Derry win by 6+ last week to now an Armagh win.

Like, it's not as if the Derry players can say...let's win it for Rory.

Let's win it for the fans?

Dunno if that soccer 'fans' thing transfers well to GAA.

Maybe it doesn't matter a jot but I've always felt Gallagher had that team playing well above their talent.

Supporter's?

Patreons is the word

[tonto1888]

Some of you need to read this thread...

https://twitter.com/Sineadmcgar/status/1656946720486350848?t=EuciV12QYX1abR2h4tTzUA&s=19

Yes she's seen examples. Does this apply to Rory Gallagher?. None of us know that answer. Given a witness has come forward this needs a full investigation.

I love the way you just throw out that this needs full investigation as if all parties are willing or even capable of cooperating with authorities. Just sounds so simple. Even the authorities have limited skills and abilities in these situations. Police, the courts, and social services aren't always the magic recipe to help victims.

So what then if not a reopening of all the timeline/events?

Did someone mention a statute of limitations? Maybe certain thinks weren't investigated because of that?

[trailer]

Some of you need to read this thread...

https://twitter.com/Sineadmcgar/status/1656946720486350848?t=EuciV12QYX1abR2h4tTzUA&s=19

Yes she's seen examples. Does this apply to Rory Gallagher?. None of us know that answer. Given a witness has come forward this needs a full investigation.

I love the way you just throw out that this needs full investigation as if all parties are willing or even capable of cooperating with authorities. Just sounds so simple. Even the authorities have limited skills and abilities in these situations. Police, the courts, and social services aren't always the magic recipe to help victims.

So what then if not a reopening of all the timeline/events?

I'm just pointing out that's it a complex and difficult situation and I wouldn't be one bit surprised if nothing happens.

[seafoid]

This is basically a row between 2 people. The football match and Derry GAA are independent of this.
The stakes are very high. RG losing his position on the sideline didn't look likely on Tuesday evening.

[Hound]

I was at a Saffron Business Forum lunch yesterday - 600 people in attendance. Anyone else who was there can correct me (I may have lost concentration somewhere amid the 5 hour long formalities...) but I didn't hear a single word uttered about the Ulster Final from the stage, other than Peter Canavan who made a joke to Jarlath Burns about winning Liam McCarthy. Not one mention - completely bizzare in a room full of GAA supporters.

Has been very obvious as the week went on. Some podcasts even avoiding discussion round the game. Others not mentioning management or tactics, the BBC social was a great example for their live podcast on the Ulster final. Someone has posted that they clarified their position before going to air but I'd say it was nearly halfway through before they got to the Ulster final itself and then it was a very light touch. A tough position for them in fairness.

It's a very difficult situation for the media and the GAA in general. How do you discipline someone who has effectively been found 'not guilty' by the authorities in the north? (remember, it seems the result of the investigation was that there was insufficient evidence so all likelihood he would be found 'not guilty' , so no point wasting time/resources in having a trial where there was almost no chance of a conviction).

But the allegations are stomach churning. The only solution was for RG to step down himself, and really that should have happened in his first statement.  We don't know what's being going on in the background, maybe the Derry CB have been insisting that he does step back, and he eventually agreed. But there's way more we don't know that we do know.

[trailer]

This is basically a row between 2 people. The football match and Derry GAA are independent of this.
The stakes are very high. RG losing his position on the sideline didn't look likely on Tuesday evening.

As stupid takes go, this is right up there. A row between two people. f**k me.
How can the match be anyway independent of this? He was the manager of Derry. He single-handedly turned them from Div 4 laughing stock in Ulster champions.

[seafoid]

This is basically a row between 2 people. The football match and Derry GAA are independent of this.
The stakes are very high. RG losing his position on the sideline didn't look likely on Tuesday evening.

As stupid takes go, this is right up there. A row between two people. f**k me.
How can the match be anyway independent of this? He was the manager of Derry. He single-handedly turned them from Div 4 laughing stock in Ulster champions.

Why does something you don't agree with /can't understand have to be stupid? The match was secondary. Taking him out was the goal.

[Look-Up!]

It was actually Damien McErlain who brought them out of division 4

[seafoid]

Irish Times preview
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/2023/05/13/tailteann-cup-previews-cavan-can-begin-charge-for-title-with-win-over-laois/Ulster SFC final Derry v Armagh, Clones, 4.0 (Live, RTÉ2/BBC Two NI)

News of manager Rory Gallagher's stepping back casts a shadow on Derry's final, and the ultimate impact won't be known until Sunday.

Their progress through the harder side of the Ulster draw had been relatively uneventful given Monaghan's jolting victory over Tyrone in the first round followed by the former's comparative no-show in the semi-final.

Not that Armagh were put to the pin of their collar by a succession of teams who had spent the spring in Division Three. They experimented with all forms of dull strategies in the league and still failed to fend off relegation but there has been more of an attacking emphasis in the championship to date.

That quicker, forward play won't have been discouraged by Derry's recent uncharacteristic leakiness, which has seen the concession of eight goals in their last three matches.

The four against Dublin can be explained or partly mitigated by the absence of Conor Glass for half the match as well as Chrissy McKaigue for the whole fixture. But Fermanagh and Monaghan got two each.

Armagh have seen high balls pay out like broken fruit machines and that temptation with players like Rian O'Neill, Rory Grugan and Andrew Murnin will be there even against as organised a defence as Derry's.

Chaos could be Armagh's friend in a match, which features two "adventurous" goalkeepers in Odhran Lynch and Ethan Rafferty.

The champions bring physicality and fitness to bear with carefully structured attacks and can sustain high presses on opposition restarts, as they did last year when taking down Donegal.

This is likely to be a final that less rewards caution but Derry have the vital components to play it either way, from the solid defence and quick transition of Conor McCluskey through a top-class centrefield of Glass and last year's Ulster final hero Brendan Rogers up into an attack spearheaded by high-scoring Shane McGuigan.

Verdict: Derry

[grounded]

It was actually Damien McErlain who brought them out of division 4

Ha! First rule of Gaaboard fightclub
       Don't let facts get in the way of a point you are making.