Casement Park in line for major overhaul - 40,000 all seater Stadium.

[Clinker]

Some members of the Culture, Arts and Leisure Committee have criticised the amount of money spent on the planned redevelopment of Belfast's Casement Park.

The committee is investigating a safety expert's claims that his concerns over emergency exiting plans were ignored.

A Stormont inquiry into safety concerns over the redevelopment has been questioning senior civil servants.

Committee members said the project may need to go back to the drawing board.


[Here]

[Clinker]

How will GAA address safety at Casement?


In their letter published on May 14, the Gaelic Athletic Association (GAA) clearly state their intention to proceed with a planning application for a new provincial stadium in the coming weeks.

Given the issues that have recently emerged around safe capacity at Casement Park, a new planning application would seem premature at this time, particularly as the project is set to receive over £61 million of public funding.

The fundamental problem faced by the GAA in meeting the official government guidance on safety of sports grounds is that Casement Park is surrounded on three sides by residential properties which abut directly onto the perimeter of the ground. For a ground of its size, that is unique within these islands.

The Government's guidance recommends that a modern stadium should have continuous circulation around the ground, to facilitate safe entrance and exit, including in emergency situations. The guidance allows for 'deviations' from the recommended standard, but any such 'deviations' must provide "an equal or greater level of safety".

Currently, Casement Park only has continuous circulation around one quarter of the ground. That is a 75 per cent shortfall compared to the safety guidance. For that reason, the current safe capacity of the ground, under modern standards, is in the range 14-19,000.

The GAA's problem lies in how to deal with an emergency evacuation situation which closes off the Andersonstown Road exits, which account for around 70 per cent of current exiting capacity.

The Department for Culture, Arts and Leisure (DCAL), which is providing the £61m funding for the project, set up the Safety Technical Group (STG) to provide advice on meeting the government's safety requirements. The STG met on at least seven occasions over 2013 and 2014. Serious concerns over the emergency exiting issue were a constant and recurring theme in their deliberations.

Nonetheless, in June 2013, the GAA proceeded with a planning application for a 38,000 all-seated stadium design that would not, according to the STG, have complied with the guidance for implementing the Safety of Sports Grounds legislation. That planning approval was quashed following MORA's judicial review action. But a 38,000 stadium with a safe capacity of 14-19,000 would surely have been a white elephant by any definition.
 
Based on their latest statement, the GAA seem set to do the same again i.e. to first apply for planning permission for a provincial stadium (35,000+) and leave the fundamental safety issues until later.

But the GAA have yet to clarify how they propose dealing with the fundamental problem of ensuring safe evacuation from Casement Park. How much more would they need to spend to do that? And where would the funds come from?

To that extent, where is the wisdom of applying for planning permission for a provincial stadium of 35,000+ when, clearly, the safety experts think the safe capacity is much less than that?  That's a strategy that represents a gamble with £61 million of public funds.


[Here]

[armaghniac]

Various public bodies are pontificating about safety. But presumably they could CPO a couple of houses at the opposite end of the park and build a gate and solve the problem without further ado.

[JPGJOHNNYG]

How will GAA address safety at Casement?


In their letter published on May 14, the Gaelic Athletic Association (GAA) clearly state their intention to proceed with a planning application for a new provincial stadium in the coming weeks.

Given the issues that have recently emerged around safe capacity at Casement Park, a new planning application would seem premature at this time, particularly as the project is set to receive over £61 million of public funding.

The fundamental problem faced by the GAA in meeting the official government guidance on safety of sports grounds is that Casement Park is surrounded on three sides by residential properties which abut directly onto the perimeter of the ground. For a ground of its size, that is unique within these islands.

The Government's guidance recommends that a modern stadium should have continuous circulation around the ground, to facilitate safe entrance and exit, including in emergency situations. The guidance allows for 'deviations' from the recommended standard, but any such 'deviations' must provide "an equal or greater level of safety".

Currently, Casement Park only has continuous circulation around one quarter of the ground. That is a 75 per cent shortfall compared to the safety guidance. For that reason, the current safe capacity of the ground, under modern standards, is in the range 14-19,000.

The GAA's problem lies in how to deal with an emergency evacuation situation which closes off the Andersonstown Road exits, which account for around 70 per cent of current exiting capacity.

The Department for Culture, Arts and Leisure (DCAL), which is providing the £61m funding for the project, set up the Safety Technical Group (STG) to provide advice on meeting the government's safety requirements. The STG met on at least seven occasions over 2013 and 2014. Serious concerns over the emergency exiting issue were a constant and recurring theme in their deliberations.

Nonetheless, in June 2013, the GAA proceeded with a planning application for a 38,000 all-seated stadium design that would not, according to the STG, have complied with the guidance for implementing the Safety of Sports Grounds legislation. That planning approval was quashed following MORA's judicial review action. But a 38,000 stadium with a safe capacity of 14-19,000 would surely have been a white elephant by any definition.
 
Based on their latest statement, the GAA seem set to do the same again i.e. to first apply for planning permission for a provincial stadium (35,000+) and leave the fundamental safety issues until later.

But the GAA have yet to clarify how they propose dealing with the fundamental problem of ensuring safe evacuation from Casement Park. How much more would they need to spend to do that? And where would the funds come from?

To that extent, where is the wisdom of applying for planning permission for a provincial stadium of 35,000+ when, clearly, the safety experts think the safe capacity is much less than that?  That's a strategy that represents a gamble with £61 million of public funds.


[Here]

We only have to look at Liverpool to see both Goodison and Anfield surrounded by housing and used to capacity up to 30 times a year so not exactly a unique situation. If they need more exits then buying a few of the surrounding houses to provide extra exits would greatly reduce evacuation times. Sure isnt the leisure centre next door and again access can be gained by purchasing a house or 2  providing 'circulation' in the event of an emergency. Didnt very early plans even have a footbridge over the motorway so again other options available. After initially supporting this develpoment I now for the life of me dont understand why the GAA are persevering - too many potential problems in the future as the residents will clearly complain about any big game or concert so better to move somewhere else where there are no restrictions. Musgarve was mentioned earlier but the north foreshore is probably a more likely option.

[FermGael]

Was just going to mention Newcastle's ground.
It's in the center of the city and they seem to have no issues with emergency evacuation.

[JPGJOHNNYG]

Various public bodies are pontificating about safety. But presumably they could CPO a couple of houses at the opposite end of the park and build a gate and solve the problem without further ado.

The safety is an issue but I mentioned on another blog that noone seems too bothered about Stansted airport which has thousands of people packed in a tiny corridor every evening queing to get on a single escalator to then take them through passport control. I would be amazed if their evacuation times were up to scratch or even how they would get access to a medical emergency in that corridor in time.

[JPGJOHNNYG]

Circualtion doesnt look too great here and as I mentioned these grounds host 30 odd games a year, Caesment would be lucky to be filled 3/4 times a year.

[illdecide]

Guys it doesn't matter if the stadium is in the middle of housing estates or not it's about the circulation space around the stands to let the patrons egress safely. Not sure of the exact time scale  for an evacuation but I think it's 8 mins from the announcement to a total empty stadium and Casement falls well short of that atm. It's up to the designers to try and find space from somewhere to achieve this and it's obviously not there to find or they'd have already done it. As someone stated the obvious solution is to buy some property in the right location to achieve this but the key is keeping them away from Anderstown Road, i'm not that familiar with the area but I think that's their problem that no matter where in the stadium they egress from they're all heading to Anderstown road eventually and that backs up and filters right back into stadium which is back to square 1.

Is there a location at the back of the housing that can take patrons elsewhere other than Anderstown Road?

[armaghniac]

Guys it doesn't matter if the stadium is in the middle of housing estates or not it's about the circulation space around the stands to let the patrons egress safely. Not sure of the exact time scale  for an evacuation but I think it's 8 mins from the announcement to a total empty stadium and Casement falls well short of that atm. It's up to the designers to try and find space from somewhere to achieve this and it's obviously not there to find or they'd have already done it. As someone stated the obvious solution is to buy some property in the right location to achieve this but the key is keeping them away from Anderstown Road, i'm not that familiar with the area but I think that's their problem that no matter where in the stadium they egress from they're all heading to Anderstown road eventually and that backs up and filters right back into stadium which is back to square 1.

Is there a location at the back of the housing that can take patrons elsewhere other than Anderstown Road?

Surely an exit is possible here on to Mooreland that leads eventually to the Stockman's lane roundabout and not near Anderstown road.

[Jeepers Creepers]

There are exits at Front (A-town road) / Mooreland park / Owenvarragh (at the bar). The issue is that they all probably lead into each other.

[armaghniac]

There are exits at Front (A-town road) / Mooreland park / Owenvarragh (at the bar). The issue is that they all probably lead into each other.

What's the recreation space between Owenvarragh and Riverdale? It would seem that this space might allow a gathering in an emergency and exit via Riverdale to Finaghy Road without going to Andersonstown , if one house was removed from Owenvarragh so that you could get to it.

[JPGJOHNNYG]

I just hope Paul Scott's expertise in stadium safety stretches beyond looking at aerial photographs of English football grounds.

Look its Paul Scott looking at an aerial photograph lol.

[JPGJOHNNYG]

Jeez man are you just permanently angry, take a joke for FFS.
They should build the stadium here

[JPGJOHNNYG]

I'm not angry at all. I appreciated the joke ok and was merely playing along.

Sorry mate got the wrong end of the stick never mind

[twohands!!!]

Twould be tough going to build a stadium as unsafe as the one in Cork.

I really do think it's a credit to GAA crowds that there wasn't a major safety issue in those tunnels; was down there at a Munster final once and it was something close to being packed into a dungeon being in those tunnels.

I did hear reports of people who went to the Bruce concerts last year and it sounded like a minor miracle that there wasnt deaths/injuries at them.

Safety concerns at a stadium aren't something I would even remotely take lightly - I remember watching Hillsborough unfold on the telly as a young lad and it was something I'll remember to my dying day - I really don't want to see anything anyway close to that happen at any game in Ireland ever.