Super 8s

Started by theticklemister, February 19, 2017, 10:55:16 PM

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yellowcard

Quote from: Dubhaltach on February 22, 2017, 05:40:11 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 02:18:47 PM
Do we know what way the vote is likely to go at this stage? I think everything at this stage is just mere speculation and I'm hopeful that the statements of the CPA in recent days will have influence in getting the 1/3rd support needed to prevent this motion from passing. Otherwise I think this has the capability of being a massive own goal for the GAA and will lead to a further divide between the GAA hierarchy and the grass roots.

Out of interest, what's your main objection to these proposals going through?

I can see some logic in the CPA argument that they don't go far enough and that the can is being pushed down the road for another 3 years. But this is GAA Congress were talking about, no radical proposal is getting through there for another couple of decades. As far as I can see the only real changes proposed here are an extra 8 matches in July/August played at provincial venues. Grounds that are lucky to see one big match a year at present.

Major objection is the so called super 8 element. The elite will play more top level games, gain more exposure and these counties will veer closer to semi-pro status. A Diluted league structure in the middle of the championship will do nothing for excitement and the possibility of shock results will become non existent. It also has the potential to create effective dead rubbers in mid summer and people staying away from attending the matches since they know there will always be another day out. There is absolutely no need for a super 8 structure other than for commercial reasons.

The abolition of replays I have no issue with and moving the season forward I'd be in favour of as well, even if I'd prefer the championship to be completed even earlier and run a club series that is properly promoted on tv between August-December.

dec

How is the abolition of replays going to happen?
Just keep playing periods of extra time until one team wins?

yellowcard


bennydorano

Jordan is definitely one of the more sharper observers.

I personally don't see whats to gain from the Super 8 bar a few extra ££ and in all likelyhood it is a further sop to Sky. What is the point of it????

Dubhaltach

Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 10:29:28 PM
Quote from: Dubhaltach on February 22, 2017, 05:40:11 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 22, 2017, 02:18:47 PM
Do we know what way the vote is likely to go at this stage? I think everything at this stage is just mere speculation and I'm hopeful that the statements of the CPA in recent days will have influence in getting the 1/3rd support needed to prevent this motion from passing. Otherwise I think this has the capability of being a massive own goal for the GAA and will lead to a further divide between the GAA hierarchy and the grass roots.

Out of interest, what's your main objection to these proposals going through?

I can see some logic in the CPA argument that they don't go far enough and that the can is being pushed down the road for another 3 years. But this is GAA Congress were talking about, no radical proposal is getting through there for another couple of decades. As far as I can see the only real changes proposed here are an extra 8 matches in July/August played at provincial venues. Grounds that are lucky to see one big match a year at present.

Major objection is the so called super 8 element. The elite will play more top level games, gain more exposure and these counties will veer closer to semi-pro status. A Diluted league structure in the middle of the championship will do nothing for excitement and the possibility of shock results will become non existent. It also has the potential to create effective dead rubbers in mid summer and people staying away from attending the matches since they know there will always be another day out. There is absolutely no need for a super 8 structure other than for commercial reasons.

The abolition of replays I have no issue with and moving the season forward I'd be in favour of as well, even if I'd prefer the championship to be completed even earlier and run a club series that is properly promoted on tv between August-December.

23 counties have made the all-Ireland quarter finals in the last 15 years so it's unlikely to be the same elite 8, year in year out. The majority of counties could have a realistic chance of making it that far. At present, 4 counties have realistic ambitions of winning the all Ireland. I don't think that any structural change to the championship is going to change that though.

The main driving force behind the super 8s is undoubtedly commercial reasons. But at the same time, as a supporter, the prospect of more games between the top teams at the height of summer is not something I'd have a problem with. At present, they usually only meet each other at this time of year when the weather is shite. The fact that the 2 provincial champions play each other first at the group stages should also reduce the possibility of dead rubber matches.


Farrandeelin

Sligo and Leitrim voting for the proposal too.
Inaugural Football Championship Prediction Winner.

Croí na hÉireann

Can original poster or admin stick up a poll to see what the gaaboard opinion is? Can add us to twohands list then.
Westmeath - Home of the Christy Ring Cup...

The Trap

23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........

Croí na hÉireann

Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........

Graph of the above

Westmeath - Home of the Christy Ring Cup...

Owenmoresider

Quote from: Farrandeelin on February 23, 2017, 09:19:42 AM
Sligo and Leitrim voting for the proposal too.
Of course we would, we'd never disobey our masters.

Dire Ear

Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 10:28:46 AM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........

Graph of the above


Kerry hoors...16 times in 15 years   !!! ;)

Croí na hÉireann

Quote from: Dire Ear on February 23, 2017, 10:45:37 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 10:28:46 AM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........

Graph of the above


Kerry hoors...16 times in 15 years   !!! ;)

16 years, 2001 - 2016. That's some going in fairness, 100% record, handy province or not.
Westmeath - Home of the Christy Ring Cup...

The Trap

What the graph illustrates is that there are already superpowers in GAA. The only county in Leinster that may make the super 8 is Dublin. How are the rest of the counties ever going to compete with Dublin? It is like asking Wycombe Wanderers to go toe to toe with Chelsea..........instead of proposals like this the GAA should be coming up with ideas to make the weaker counties (counties like Meath Down Cork Galway Armagh Cavan Roscommon and others) who have been traditionally competitive in a position where they can catch up with the top 4. That is the only way they are going to have a great championship in the future. And to think that Cavan and Roscommon are in Division One but are still so far off All Ireland contention just makes this argument stronger!
How do you do it?
Level up the financial resources each county team can spend.
Increase the number of GAA paid coaches in weaker counties
Improve training facilities in weaker counties
Limit the amount of training county teams do.
Have a fixture schedule that helps the club game in every county so that players in weaker counties dont choose club over county as they wont lose out playing with their club

The more counties who can be competitive the better the provincial and All Ireland series will be and the money will roll in from all around the country. If it is limited to 8 counties each year then the financial spread will be much less!




rosnarun

Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........
why 15 years? would 5 not be more relevant as that s reflects what's happening now .
without seeding any getting to the last 8 at present is not a sign of quality more of the draw you had to get there  .

it seems a lot of people idea of reform is to allow weak teams get as far as possible in the Championship and them try and catch out one of the bigger team instead of  a fair competition to find the best 16 ,8, 4, 2 teams to compete for best team  that will win the  all-Ireland final (in this normally happens any way )
If you make yourself understood, you're always speaking well. Moliere

rosnarun

Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 11:10:02 AM
Quote from: Dire Ear on February 23, 2017, 10:45:37 AM
Quote from: Croí na hÉireann on February 23, 2017, 10:28:46 AM
Quote from: The Trap on February 23, 2017, 10:14:13 AM
23 counties made the last 8 in the last 15 years..........if this goes through it will be more or less be the same 8 counties in the last 8 for......well forever! There may be an odd shock in who gets into the last 8 but think about it like this......the counties who make the last 8 in the first year will have a considerable advantage over those that don't in terms of finance, exposure and experience gained, ease of player buy in the following year............therefore widening the gap. The GAA should be careful about what they wish for............and that is coming from a Tyrone man who are expected to be one of the top 8...........

Graph of the above


Kerry hoors...16 times in 15 years   !!! ;)

16 years, 2001 - 2016. That's some going in fairness, 100% record, handy province or not.
ared to believe Downs record is so bad considering they have won an allireland in that time. also shows current form is not a fluke
If you make yourself understood, you're always speaking well. Moliere