Usual suspects this year or can we see a change??
Heading to Kilkenny this weekend, hoping for a good game. Maybe a win for Waterford.. any reports on the Galway Kilkenny game last weekend??
I think Waterford are primed. Young team, mainly, but one which has a lot of experience of winning. Good hurlers, which is the most important thing, and hopefully an evolving gameplan. If Offaly can't win it, (ahem) and Tipperary don't win it, I would love to see Waterford or Limerick winning it. But if Waterford win it, I hope they win it by trusting their hurlers and playing the game properly, not by trying to concede as little as possible and sneaking over the line. Go for it.
I will tip Waterford for Munster, Kilkenny for Leinster and a Waterford/Tipperary AIF (draw permitting)
What about Wexford and Davy Fitz?
What about them?
In all seriousness, if they do anything, it probably will be this year. Davy and Wexford is a match made in heaven, they are as mad as each other (I mean that in a nice way), but if he doesn't get it out of them this year, that relationship would turn sparky soon enough I'd say, and Davy's dad isn't secretary of the Wexford Co. Board.
I think its between Waterford and Tipp for the Div1A title with the Dubs in a relegation scrap/playoff with Clare more than likely as I don't think the Clare lads are designed for Winter hurling.
Kilkenny will be experimenting more than most in this league.
Div1B I think Galway will come straight up, but not without a sweat in a few games. Wexford and Limerick to be moaning again about how unfair the system is.
Laois and Kerry to be in the bottom battle irrespective of who wins out this Sunday.
In Div2A Antrim might need a result in Carlow to go up, but Westmeath and a Kildare team loaded with outsiders are worth watching in what will be a competitive league. Armagh to be relegated.
Div2B Meath would be favourites, but Down are resurgent of late and even if they get beat this sunday in Navan would be hopeful of meeting Meath again in the decider. Meath would still have it though, Derry are also under new local management and a few players back in the fold may put them in the reckoning. Mayo and Wicklow won't be pushed over either.
Roscommon to go down.
TJ Reid winning his customary soft frees here
A few markers bring laid down for later in the summer here.
This is one rough game.
Nowlan park was Baltic today, so giving the conditions and first proper game it was grand, Waterford took their time to get going but managed to sneak a win. I'd backed them at 7/4 but it never looked safe until final whistle... both teams not at full strength so be hard to take anything from that...
Waterford straight back at it against Tipp next week, no early easy games for them
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 12, 2017, 08:26:56 PM
Nowlan park was Baltic today, so giving the conditions and first proper game it was grand, Waterford took their time to get going but managed to sneak a win. I'd backed them at 7/4 but it never looked safe until final whistle... both teams not at full strength so be hard to take anything from that...
Waterford straight back at it against Tipp next week, no early easy games for them
Kilkenny were a lot stronger in terms of team selection that would be normal for them, Buckley, the Murphy's Eoin and Paul, TJ Reid, Richie Hogan, Holden and Walter coming on at halftime. Barring the Fennelly's and the wee lad who did the cruciate early last year, who else is going to add to the team that isn't new or with only a year or two's run out?
Waterford also had a pretty strong outfit on the field and will be pleased with the win.
Oh, and some mad refereeing in both the game in Nowlan park and in Wexford where Limerick were denied a blatant penalty and not a red card in sight.
Keep the game flowing lads.
Quote from: johnneycool on February 13, 2017, 09:23:03 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 12, 2017, 08:26:56 PM
Nowlan park was Baltic today, so giving the conditions and first proper game it was grand, Waterford took their time to get going but managed to sneak a win. I'd backed them at 7/4 but it never looked safe until final whistle... both teams not at full strength so be hard to take anything from that...
Waterford straight back at it against Tipp next week, no early easy games for them
Kilkenny were a lot stronger in terms of team selection that would be normal for them, Buckley, the Murphy's Eoin and Paul, TJ Reid, Richie Hogan, Holden and Walter coming on at halftime. Barring the Fennelly's and the wee lad who did the cruciate early last year, who else is going to add to the team that isn't new or with only a year or two's run out?
Waterford also had a pretty strong outfit on the field and will be pleased with the win.
Hogan played corner forward, he'd a good tussle with his marker the whole game, missed a few chances that normally go over, but Id imagine he'll get his sights back on track, TJ missed two frees i think that normally are gimmies for him..... Was chatting to a lad in the pub and he was saying that Cody was giving a lot of game time to young lads coming through, who knows what the production line will throw up
It was mad seeing the difference in the hurling and the football.
it was hard to know what constituted a foul in KK-Waterford as you needed a serious battering. Football comes on and within a minute michael Murphy falls over without much happening him and free in. He'd have been laughed out of the place for looking a foul in the hurling for that.
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 13, 2017, 11:22:35 AM
It was mad seeing the difference in the hurling and the football.
it was hard to know what constituted a foul in KK-Waterford as you needed a serious battering. Football comes on and within a minute michael Murphy falls over without much happening him and free in. He'd have been laughed out of the place for looking a foul in the hurling for that.
he got a free everytime he fell over
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 13, 2017, 11:22:35 AM
It was mad seeing the difference in the hurling and the football.
it was hard to know what constituted a foul in KK-Waterford as you needed a serious battering. Football comes on and within a minute michael Murphy falls over without much happening him and free in. He'd have been laughed out of the place for looking a foul in the hurling for that.
Conor Lane, for all his faults lets the game of football 'flow' as much as possible.
Waterford v Tipp should be a good game this weekend.
Cork should beat the Dubs
Clare would need to improve to beat Kilkenny at home and then are away to Tipp in round 3 so they have a tought start.
There's no easy game in this hurling league Division 1A
Good win for Laois over Offaly tonight. Great to bounce back after last weeks disaster against Kerry.
Had Laois beaten Kerry last weekend I'd imagine they might have avoided the drop
Waterford v Tipp should be a good game, cobwebs gone from first games so hopefully a bit more fluency today, weather slightly better also...
Kilkenny Tipp wins today, couldn't call Cork Dublin game
Another bad result for Offaly.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 19, 2017, 10:23:30 AM
Had Laois beaten Kerry last weekend I'd imagine they might have avoided the drop
Waterford v Tipp should be a good game, cobwebs gone from first games so hopefully a bit more fluency today, weather slightly better also...
Kilkenny Tipp wins today, couldn't call Cork Dublin game
I'm calling an 8 pt Dublin victory
Quote from: Minder on February 19, 2017, 12:34:59 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 19, 2017, 10:23:30 AM
Had Laois beaten Kerry last weekend I'd imagine they might have avoided the drop
Waterford v Tipp should be a good game, cobwebs gone from first games so hopefully a bit more fluency today, weather slightly better also...
Kilkenny Tipp wins today, couldn't call Cork Dublin game
I'm calling an 8 pt Dublin victory
MR get the house on it.
Quote from: Minder on February 19, 2017, 12:34:59 PM
I'm calling an 8 pt Dublin victory
I reckon a Dublin player being sent off is a decent bet.
Have Waterford left the grass uncut on purpose??
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 19, 2017, 02:18:01 PM
Have Waterford left the grass uncut on purpose??
its long alright
county hurling has transformed into rugby with sticks
lads running straight into each other
referees don't seem to give frees for charging anymore, or 6/7 steps
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 19, 2017, 02:26:56 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 19, 2017, 02:18:01 PM
Have Waterford left the grass uncut on purpose??
its long alright
county hurling has transformed into rugby with sticks
lads running straight into each other
referees don't seem to give frees for charging anymore, or 6/7 steps
More physical nowadays... drawing a tackle to off load the ball into space seems to be all the rage
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 19, 2017, 02:41:50 PM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 19, 2017, 02:26:56 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 19, 2017, 02:18:01 PM
Have Waterford left the grass uncut on purpose??
its long alright
county hurling has transformed into rugby with sticks
lads running straight into each other
referees don't seem to give frees for charging anymore, or 6/7 steps
More physical nowadays... drawing a tackle to off load the ball into space seems to be all the rage
lot of basketball type handpasses using an overhand action. I'd consider a lot of them to be throws
Maher runs straight into a Waterford player who had turned his body expecting a shoulder. Free to Tipp. Really? For him running straight into the shoulder?
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 19, 2017, 03:08:23 PM
Maher runs straight into a Waterford player who had turned his body expecting a shoulder. Free to Tipp. Really? For him running straight into the shoulder?
Elbow up in my view, as for the hand pass as long as they hop the ball up and palm it off then that fine whether it's the conventional way or hand up in the air or low, throwing is completely different! And goes on way too much at that level, not so much at club level
Kilkenny for the drop?
Clare's movement caused them all sorts of problems today
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 19, 2017, 05:09:33 PM
Kilkenny for the drop?
Clare's movement caused them all sorts of problems today
No drop as they'll beat Dublin/Cork surely? Kilkenny have no goal threat at all, that's 3 games they've failed to get a goal, handling and striking is poor and options off the bench not great... to be fair to Clare they got a great start and seemed more hungry for the ball...
On another note, how many penalties have been scored? Was meant to be easier to score, seen three cracking saves there..
Didn't realise Dublin played last night!! Cheers Minder and Tony ;D
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 19, 2017, 05:24:52 PM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 19, 2017, 05:09:33 PM
Kilkenny for the drop?
Clare's movement caused them all sorts of problems today
No drop as they'll beat Dublin/Cork surely? Kilkenny have no goal threat at all, that's 3 games they've failed to get a goal, handling and striking is poor and options off the bench not great... to be fair to Clare they got a great start and seemed more hungry for the ball...
On another note, how many penalties have been scored? Was meant to be easier to score, seen three cracking saves there..
Didn't realise Dublin played last night!! Cheers Minder and Tony ;D
Is the craic with the hurling league not that you can lose all your games and win the relegation playoff and stay up??
Quote from: macdanger2 on February 19, 2017, 10:17:59 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 19, 2017, 05:24:52 PM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on February 19, 2017, 05:09:33 PM
Kilkenny for the drop?
Clare's movement caused them all sorts of problems today
No drop as they'll beat Dublin/Cork surely? Kilkenny have no goal threat at all, that's 3 games they've failed to get a goal, handling and striking is poor and options off the bench not great... to be fair to Clare they got a great start and seemed more hungry for the ball...
On another note, how many penalties have been scored? Was meant to be easier to score, seen three cracking saves there..
Didn't realise Dublin played last night!! Cheers Minder and Tony ;D
Is the craic with the hurling league not that you can lose all your games and win the relegation playoff and stay up??
Yeah I think that was the case with Cork last year
don't think there is a relegation playoff this year
No relegation play off this year. It could come down to Dubs v Kilkenny at Parnell in last round. Dubs will have cuala lads back then so KK drop is definitely a possibility. But the way this league is unfolding the only team safe at the moment is Tipp.
Quote from: didlyi on February 19, 2017, 11:56:15 PM
No relegation play off this year. It could come down to Dubs v Kilkenny at Parnell in last round. Dubs will have cuala lads back then so KK drop is definitely a possibility. But the way this league is unfolding the only team safe at the moment is Tipp.
Cork are very much still in the relegation mix with Waterford, Tipp and Kilkenny to play.
I can see two teams on 2 points, how are they to be deciphered?
Davy Fitz took a big gamble on getting Wexford flying fit for February.
They'll get promoted now, but Galway could have won game instead and Wexford would be stranded in 1B for another year.
Spare a thought for poor Offaly, they win one game in Div1B to avoid relegation and are rewarded with a visit by Tipp this weekend.
That could be a chastening experience.
All joking aside, winning one game in Div1B and in a NHL quarterfinal doesn't make a whole pile of sense does it?
Quote from: johnneycool on March 28, 2017, 11:53:57 AM
Spare a thought for poor Offaly, they win one game in Div1B to avoid relegation and are rewarded with a visit by Tipp this weekend.
That could be a chastening experience.
All joking aside, winning one game in Div1B and in a NHL quarterfinal doesn't make a whole pile of sense does it?
Nicely played by Offaly, maximum efficiency and all that.
We're waiting in the long grass for Tipperary now.
I see people using this as an excuse to have a go at the league format. Really it's the likes of Limerick and Galway pissed off that they have to slum it with Laois and Offaly. But I think this league format is the best there's been for many years in hurling.
The one thing that is a bit incongruous is this notion of the quarter finals. I don't think there's any need for the 3rd and 4th place 1B team to make a quarter final.
Why not just have 1 & 2 in 1A straight into a semi final, and 3rd and 4th in 1A versus 1st and 2nd in 1B in the quarter final.
If Tipperary go all out against Offaly, this could be another Kilkenny type massacre, and it will do neither any good. If they go out and try and stroll in the park, then they'll still win, but what purpose does that serve either?
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 28, 2017, 12:16:19 PM
I see people using this as an excuse to have a go at the league format. Really it's the likes of Limerick and Galway pissed off that they have to slum it with Laois and Offaly. But I think this league format is the best there's been for many years in hurling.
The one thing that is a bit incongruous is this notion of the quarter finals. I don't think there's any need for the 3rd and 4th place 1B team to make a quarter final.
Why not just have 1 & 2 in 1A straight into a semi final, and 3rd and 4th in 1A versus 1st and 2nd in 1B in the quarter final.
If Tipperary go all out against Offaly, this could be another Kilkenny type massacre, and it will do neither any good. If they go out and try and stroll in the park, then they'll still win, but what purpose does that serve either?
That tweak would be ideal as I find the current league structures fine the way they are.
Quote from: johnneycool on March 28, 2017, 12:48:49 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 28, 2017, 12:16:19 PM
I see people using this as an excuse to have a go at the league format. Really it's the likes of Limerick and Galway pissed off that they have to slum it with Laois and Offaly. But I think this league format is the best there's been for many years in hurling.
The one thing that is a bit incongruous is this notion of the quarter finals. I don't think there's any need for the 3rd and 4th place 1B team to make a quarter final.
Why not just have 1 & 2 in 1A straight into a semi final, and 3rd and 4th in 1A versus 1st and 2nd in 1B in the quarter final.
If Tipperary go all out against Offaly, this could be another Kilkenny type massacre, and it will do neither any good. If they go out and try and stroll in the park, then they'll still win, but what purpose does that serve either?
That tweak would be ideal as I find the current league structures fine the way they are.
+1
Quote from: Owenmoresider on March 28, 2017, 02:30:08 PM
Quote from: johnneycool on March 28, 2017, 12:48:49 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 28, 2017, 12:16:19 PM
I see people using this as an excuse to have a go at the league format. Really it's the likes of Limerick and Galway pissed off that they have to slum it with Laois and Offaly. But I think this league format is the best there's been for many years in hurling.
The one thing that is a bit incongruous is this notion of the quarter finals. I don't think there's any need for the 3rd and 4th place 1B team to make a quarter final.
Why not just have 1 & 2 in 1A straight into a semi final, and 3rd and 4th in 1A versus 1st and 2nd in 1B in the quarter final.
If Tipperary go all out against Offaly, this could be another Kilkenny type massacre, and it will do neither any good. If they go out and try and stroll in the park, then they'll still win, but what purpose does that serve either?
That tweak would be ideal as I find the current league structures fine the way they are.
+1
+2
That's the clear and obvious change that needs to be made.
Just have semi finals with the top 3 from Div 1A and the top team from 1B.
Quote from: Ash Smoker on March 29, 2017, 03:01:20 PM
Just have semi finals with the top 3 from Div 1A and the top team from 1B.
Ah here now, you couldn't be going and losing out on four gates in the one go.
Make it a pure league. 10 teams. 9 games. No semi-finals or finals. Top team are league champs.
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 29, 2017, 10:48:12 PM
Make it a pure league. 10 teams. 9 games. No semi-finals or finals. Top team are league champs.
Yeah because that'll really help the likes of Westmeath, Carlow, Kerry, Offaly and Antrim develop.
Quote from: johnneycool on March 30, 2017, 09:09:36 AM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 29, 2017, 10:48:12 PM
Make it a pure league. 10 teams. 9 games. No semi-finals or finals. Top team are league champs.
Yeah because that'll really help the likes of Westmeath, Carlow, Kerry, Offaly and Antrim develop.
Unfortunately I don't think systems make a huge difference. The development work has to come from within.
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on March 30, 2017, 09:57:22 AM
Quote from: johnneycool on March 30, 2017, 09:09:36 AM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 29, 2017, 10:48:12 PM
Make it a pure league. 10 teams. 9 games. No semi-finals or finals. Top team are league champs.
Yeah because that'll really help the likes of Westmeath, Carlow, Kerry, Offaly and Antrim develop.
Unfortunately I don't think systems make a huge difference. The development work has to come from within.
It's both. You have to do the development work, but you have to have a pathway to progression as well. I think the current system is spot on in terms of divisions.
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on March 30, 2017, 09:57:22 AM
Quote from: johnneycool on March 30, 2017, 09:09:36 AM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 29, 2017, 10:48:12 PM
Make it a pure league. 10 teams. 9 games. No semi-finals or finals. Top team are league champs.
Yeah because that'll really help the likes of Westmeath, Carlow, Kerry, Offaly and Antrim develop.
Unfortunately I don't think systems make a huge difference. The development work has to come from within.
Maybe ask those counties just below the top table what they think rather than listen to the bleatings of Limerick and the other ex players from top counties throwing in their tuppence worth.
B n M man is from Offaly. I think he knows the score there too.
Seeing Offaly in the list of development counties is weird.
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 30, 2017, 12:35:37 PM
B n M man is from Offaly. I think he knows the score there too.
I know he is, and he didn't propose the "pull the ladder up" league format of Ball hopper.
I just get a bit pissed off with these knee jerk league changes to suit one or two particular top teams when there's a serious impact on a lot of the lesser teams and then we get some bullshit from some committee or other tasked with developing hurling and its totally loaded with lads from the top counties putting forward proposals which actually balls up developing counties.
there's feck all development being done in the likes of Westmeath
county is going backwards if you ask me
minors have been terrible the last two years
cannot compete with Meath at U14, U15 and U16
hurling clubs not progressing in Leinster Club competitions
Quote from: johnneycool on March 30, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on March 30, 2017, 09:57:22 AM
Quote from: johnneycool on March 30, 2017, 09:09:36 AM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 29, 2017, 10:48:12 PM
Make it a pure league. 10 teams. 9 games. No semi-finals or finals. Top team are league champs.
Yeah because that'll really help the likes of Westmeath, Carlow, Kerry, Offaly and Antrim develop.
Unfortunately I don't think systems make a huge difference. The development work has to come from within.
Maybe ask those counties just below the top table what they think rather than listen to the bleatings of Limerick and the other ex players from top counties throwing in their tuppence worth.
Do you know for a fact that these "lesser" counties are not asked about things? Any system that allows the team finishing fourth in the second division to compete for the overall title is madness. In fact, letting any team from the second division having a title shot is downright wrong.
Let Newcastle play Chelsea for the Premiership? Or Leeds, who might finish sixth or so? Madness.
But go right ahead and say this is the best way to improve the lesser counties.
How do counties stay at the top table? Why did Offaly decline so far? And Laois and Antrim?
This is a discussion forum...discuss.
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 30, 2017, 05:14:13 PM
Quote from: johnneycool on March 30, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on March 30, 2017, 09:57:22 AM
Quote from: johnneycool on March 30, 2017, 09:09:36 AM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 29, 2017, 10:48:12 PM
Make it a pure league. 10 teams. 9 games. No semi-finals or finals. Top team are league champs.
Yeah because that'll really help the likes of Westmeath, Carlow, Kerry, Offaly and Antrim develop.
Unfortunately I don't think systems make a huge difference. The development work has to come from within.
Maybe ask those counties just below the top table what they think rather than listen to the bleatings of Limerick and the other ex players from top counties throwing in their tuppence worth.
Do you know for a fact that these "lesser" counties are not asked about things? Any system that allows the team finishing fourth in the second division to compete for the overall title is madness. In fact, letting any team from the second division having a title shot is downright wrong.
Let Newcastle play Chelsea for the Premiership? Or Leeds, who might finish sixth or so? Madness.
But go right ahead and say this is the best way to improve the lesser counties.
How do counties stay at the top table? Why did Offaly decline so far? And Laois and Antrim?
This is a discussion forum...discuss.
the premier league has 20 teams, the championship has 24 (I think)
there are no home and away games in the NHL
the league is about getting games for counties
the quarter finals serve that purpose
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 30, 2017, 05:14:13 PM
Quote from: johnneycool on March 30, 2017, 11:53:10 AM
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on March 30, 2017, 09:57:22 AM
Quote from: johnneycool on March 30, 2017, 09:09:36 AM
Quote from: Ball Hopper on March 29, 2017, 10:48:12 PM
Make it a pure league. 10 teams. 9 games. No semi-finals or finals. Top team are league champs.
Yeah because that'll really help the likes of Westmeath, Carlow, Kerry, Offaly and Antrim develop.
Unfortunately I don't think systems make a huge difference. The development work has to come from within.
Maybe ask those counties just below the top table what they think rather than listen to the bleatings of Limerick and the other ex players from top counties throwing in their tuppence worth.
Do you know for a fact that these "lesser" counties are not asked about things? Any system that allows the team finishing fourth in the second division to compete for the overall title is madness. In fact, letting any team from the second division having a title shot is downright wrong.
Let Newcastle play Chelsea for the Premiership? Or Leeds, who might finish sixth or so? Madness.
But go right ahead and say this is the best way to improve the lesser counties.
How do counties stay at the top table? Why did Offaly decline so far? And Laois and Antrim?
This is a discussion forum...discuss.
There's a reason the teams in Div1B up to and including 3rd and 4th are included in the playoff stages and it was because of the gurning by some perennial Div1B teams about lack of matches and this tweak was added, personally I'd restrict it to the top two in Div1B as its no big deal.
It's strange that the same system isn't in place for Div2A and B though, don't you think?
Also "Do you know for a fact that these "lesser" counties are not asked about things?"
Well I've spoken to a lad who was invited onto one of these committees (token Nordie) and he said it was a waste of his time, he wanted to discuss changes to the Christy Ring (which was in its infancy then), possible changes to the lower leagues in the NHL and so forth, but as he was the only one from those hurling tiers the discussions invariably ended up about Liam McCarthy round robins, back doors and so forth. He reckons 5 minutes tops were spent discussing hurling outside the elite sections of the meetings he attended and that was to set up another review which never happened.
I'm happy to discuss also at any time.
I would say leave the top two leagues as they are and implement the tweak with regard to the quarter finals as suggested here. Top 4 in 1a and top 2 in 1b.
The extra playoff required for a team to be promoted was a disgrace and thankfully was done away with this year therefore either Carlow or Antrim will be in 1b next year with either Laois or Kerry down.
I my opinion the current system certainly suits for 1b and following on Div 2a. Because of the structure teams like Laois get games against some top teams albeit taking a beating but also they compete against a couple of teams of roughly their own level so it is 2 mini leagues. It also means whoever is promoted has a good chance of staying up as their are a couple of teams that they might be good enough to catch on the day. They also get to play some of the better teams i.e. Galway, Limerick and either Dublin or Clare next year. This helps with the development.
It's up to the likes of Limercick to do what they need to do to be promoted. No point in blaming the system. They had the 8 teams divisions up to 2011 and guess what Limerick were in the second div. In fairness they were promoted that year but the league was redrawn to it's current format.
JC,
How long does it take to get anything right in the GAA? I think the football league is finally there...8 teams per division, top two in the final of each division and the finals played the weekend after the league portion ends. Even if the need for a final goes against what a league competition is about. It took generations to get there and hopefully a proper hurling league will come along soon, as the current hurling structure is way off.
The fact that Wexford can win the league from a lower division is wrong, not to mention the fact that Offaly can do likewise with exactly one league win and a scoring difference of -39, while the team just above them in the second division table were +49...a difference of 88 points over just 5 games!!!
Wexford, Galway and Limerick are certainly top-level counties and one of them may well win the league. But they will not have played Clare or Dublin (Div 1 teams) and possibly other Div 1 teams if results go a certain way. Calling themselves league champions without playing in the top division is just ludicrous.
I must comment at this stage that the hurling games recently have been of an excellent standard and very enjoyable viewing (I watch all games via GAAGO as I'm "out foreign"). The pitches seem to be a much improved, hence the games are of much higher quality with some being close to championship fare.
Back to hurling league format - at least they have sorted the promotion from the Third Division to the Second Division (which are called Division 1A and 2a oddly), with the winners of the lower division gaining automatic promotion. Call the divisions what they are for the luv a Jaysus, 1, 2 3, and 4. We know what "Division 1b" is - it is the second level, so call it Division 2.
Currently, there seems to be 9 strong hurling counties - the Div 1 sides plus the top 3 from the next level. A closed shop league, with just those 9 counties, would not be the way to go. Hence my suggestion for 10 teams, with one team relegated and promoted each year. Top team wins the league, no finals or semi-finals, as 9 league games are enough. Currently, the league finalists will play 8 games, assuming no replays from quarter-final stage onward, so adding an extra week is not that much. There will be plenty of mid to lower league games that proper managers will use to try players on the fringes of the team/panel, so individual players should not see action in all 9 games causing burnout or whatever.
We'll presume Offaly, Kerry and Laois are the current leaders for that 10th spot and will also presume they will get some beatings in Div 1. Is that helping them will be the big question.
It is interesting and sad to hear that your friend reported that the lesser competitions and counties had virtually no true voice at the top table. Perhaps the Christy Ring counties need to band together and run their part of the show without being "token" reps at meetings? One huge step forward will be running the Christy Ring early enough that the winner plays in the Leinster round robin that same year, instead of waiting for the following year.
Keeping counties at a high level is also important - the GAA needs to look at Offaly in particular. How were they allowed to fall off the pace so far in hurling? Their footballers could be in Div 4 next year, depending on Sunday's game against Laois (another football county that has fallen quite a bit). Has the game changed so much over the decades that the resources required in the 80's, if employed at the same level nowadays, are totally inadequate? We had coaches back in the day, they were just not very good - "right lads, two laps to warm up, a few exercises and a game of backs and forwards - same as last week". I'm sure the level of coaching is much better in all counties, so why are the Offaly and Laois teams not keeping up, and making it an elite 11 counties at a minimum? Have all their resources gone into the facilities in Tullamore and Portlaoise, leaving nothing for player development?
It will be interesting to watch Dublin hurling over the next few years as well, keeping an eye on the funding issue. Other things worth watching include the progress of Kildare, who are making strides in the right direction. Carlow, Antrim and Westmeath seem to be building a solid platform as well and will be capable of competing and winning at just-under Div 1 levels. Those 4, plus Offaly, Laois and Kerry, would make a competitive league grouping or a good championship round robin. Down, London and Meath are the next level to bring up a notch. Down have fallen a good bit - maybe you can throw some overview on what happened there, as you are intimate with the goings on in that part of the country.
That's it for now...
If counties are weaker they deserve to drop down the leagues
It was decided to have 2 sections of 6 each in order to give 10 to 12 exposure to top class opponents . The Alternative would be a top tier of 9 and the next tier operating at a much lower level. The system does have weaknesses. Eg Galway missed out on the top 4 on points last year and ended up relegated. If they or Wexford or Limerick won without beating Clare or Dublin it wouldnt be a big deal. That is how the system is designed.
I think counties like Laois deserve to be supported. They had a very good team in the early 80s.
jaysus the team tipp have named for tomorrow!!!
Some battle in Portlaoise tonight.
FT Score After Extra Time.
Laois 1:30
Kerry 4:20
Laois stay up,Kerry relegated.
Only 1 div 1a team in the semis. The Galway match was unbelievable.
Dont know how the hell we won that today! Probably down to JC and David Burke, they were superb. Waterford lost all their shape with the substitutes - none really made an impact
The team Waterford picked meant I thought we'd lose and Derek McGrath was clear from early in the year that the league wasn't a priority once we had secured out 1A status. It's strange how it turned out then. Great performance from the young Waterford team early on against a lacklustre Galway but Galway came alive in last 15 minutes to win. Derek McGrath now being criticised by some Waterford fans for taking off some of the younger players like Foran and Roche who were doing well and bringing on experienced players who didn't make an impact.
Great wins for Wexford away to Kilkenny and Limerick in Cork so interesting day in quarter finals. As expected Tipperary hammered Offaly.
Galway don't beat Waterford that often
Long time since wexford beat kilkenny in senior hurling.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 02, 2017, 10:02:33 PM
Long time since wexford beat kilkenny in senior hurling.
1959 the last time they won in Nowlan Park...
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 02, 2017, 10:02:33 PM
Long time since wexford beat kilkenny in senior hurling.
2004
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on April 03, 2017, 08:07:06 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 02, 2017, 10:02:33 PM
Long time since wexford beat kilkenny in senior hurling.
1959 the last time they won in Nowlan Park...
Wexford for liam now ;)
Some good players there and would be good to see them make leinster a bit more competitive as it has been very dull for a while now.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 03, 2017, 09:04:43 AM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on April 03, 2017, 08:07:06 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 02, 2017, 10:02:33 PM
Long time since wexford beat kilkenny in senior hurling.
1959 the last time they won in Nowlan Park...
Wexford for liam now ;)
Some good players there and would be good to see them make leinster a bit more competitive as it has been very dull for a while now.
I honestly cant see Kilkenny winning it this year, if they do they'll really have to work at a higher rate than they currently are at... Galway to get over the line for me... puts them into a semi final spot, thats a serious carrot to work for, how they won yesterday i dont know but they kept at it and stuck the points over the bar and didnt panic, too their chances when they came. we can look at the Waterford changes but its not like they brought on rubbish players
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 03, 2017, 09:04:43 AM
Quote from: manfromdelmonte on April 03, 2017, 08:07:06 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 02, 2017, 10:02:33 PM
Long time since wexford beat kilkenny in senior hurling.
1959 the last time they won in Nowlan Park...
Wexford for liam now ;)
Some good players there and would be good to see them make leinster a bit more competitive as it has been very dull for a while now.
Given Tipp's dominance and the torpor suffered by the likes of Cork, Clare and Limerick, could Leinster suddenly become the new Munster?
Mount Davy erupting down in Nowlan Park
Davy for all his faults fairly knows how to fire a team up.
Hopefully it will make leinster much more interesting this year.
Tips still a class act and the ones to beat.
That Brendan Maher goal was as clinical as you will see.
Lee Chin some player for Wexford. McDonald showed promise but a bit to go yet.
It is hard to see anyone beating Tipp. The ability they have to get goals is amazing.
Quote from: hardstation on April 16, 2017, 05:22:58 PM
From a point in it to 12 in it within 5 minutes. Feck sake.
That's just Tipp going up a gear, Davys sweeper can't be everywhere
Tipp are unreal
Wexford got about 62 minutes were well in that game ... should be no complaints from Davy, they'll come on a lot stronger for that game today!
Davy Fitzgerald will surely get a suspension after his antics yesterday. The GAA have been too lenient with him before as he was a disgrace at both league finals against Waterford last year and nothing was done about it. Diarmuid Kirwan leaves too much go and ignores blatant fouls at times which causes frustration so don't think he should be in charge of games at this level anymore.
Wexford did very well for most of the game and look a good prospect but didn't threaten a goal till right at the end. Tipperary are looking very strong again this year and their forwards have plenty goals in them.
Wee Davy knew exactly what he was doing, he had to rile his players into action and it worked to an extent, but Tipp just had too much firepower in the end.
Wexford defender was fouled twice before Tipp scored their second, a bit mad from kirwin in all fairness
Quote from: johnneycool on April 17, 2017, 09:51:04 PM
Wee Davy knew exactly what he was doing, he had to rile his players into action and it worked to an extent, but Tipp just had too much firepower in the end.
Wexford defender was fouled twice before Tipp scored their second, a bit mad from kirwin in all fairness
Also the referee was good to Wexford thereafter . The GAA have to throw the book at Davy. This notion that he is "box office" , "great for hurling" & "passionate is absurd .
Davy needs to go live on Skellig Michil with Luke Skywalker for a few decades for the good of himself and the game.
RTE editing :
Seamus Callanan will be missing with a broken thumb, but they'll have the likes of John O'Dwyer to call on. Patrick 'Bonner' Bonner is also back, so Tipperary can counteract the loss of Callanan."
A great shtart to the second half for Galway
tipp getting beat here will maybe knock any potential complacency out of them pre championship which isn't a bad thing for them.
Good to see galway back at this level. Will make for a better ai series i think.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 23, 2017, 04:36:13 PM
tipp getting beat here will maybe knock any potential complacency out of them pre championship which isn't a bad thing for them.
Good to see galway back at this level. Will make for a better ai series i think.
As will a weaker Kilkenny
Great win. Good to see. But don't lose the run of yourselves. Galway are always at this level. Consistency is the problem.
Quote from: From the Bunker on April 23, 2017, 05:16:54 PM
Great win. Good to see. But don't lose the run of yourselves. Galway are always at this level. Consistency is the problem.
Galway have been looking for a full back and centre half back for a long time
Quote from: seafoid on April 23, 2017, 06:06:17 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on April 23, 2017, 05:16:54 PM
Great win. Good to see. But don't lose the run of yourselves. Galway are always at this level. Consistency is the problem.
Galway have been looking for a full back and centre half back for a long time
Fair play to the heron-chokers. Every once in a while, they wake up and show what they are capable of. Pity they lack consistency but today is not the time to or place to start worrying about it.
https://m.soundcloud.com/offtheball/tipp-manager-michael-ryan-on-their-league-final-loss
Tipp were very poor on the day
Tipp were stuck to the ground, looked like a team that had a few heavy training sessions recently. Was really surprising how easily they threw in the towel also. Galway were given the freedom of the Gaelic grounds yesterday and did what they liked in the end - hard to know what to make of us yet as yesterday isn't a fair reflection of either team IMO - could make for an interesting summer nonetheless!!
I hope the cats are finished. If they are there might be a few different winners over a few years like the late 90s.
Quote from: seafoid on April 24, 2017, 12:21:34 PM
I hope the cats are finished. If they are there might be a few different winners over a few years like the late 90s.
Well you'll knew soon enough if you get to play them this year in the championship
Fantastic article
http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/hurling/jackie-tyrrell-how-really-good-teams-avoid-falling-flat-1.3063729