Casement Park in line for major overhaul - 40,000 all seater Stadium.

[NAG1]

That's not what that bit in green says. In fact, it doesn't mention residents at all.

The picture I posted came out before any meeting with residents occured.

The Skyscraper render ( post 1 at http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1563744), complete with roof,  was published at a Community Consultation Event held in November 2012.
Look at the date of the posting: November 19th, 2012

The first photos, minus the roof, came out in Feb 2013.

Between Nov 2012 and feb 2013, the GAA had decided to drop the A'town Rd roof, in order to appease residents.

This was confirmed in the following article, published on 23 April 2013.



Full Article: http://belfastmediagroup.com/gaa-rejects-claims-theyre-not-engaging/

THE Casement Park Stadium Project Board (CPSPB) have rejected claims by the Mooreland and Owenvarragh Residents' Association (MORA) that they have been ignoring their concerns, stating they have been engaging with them and other stakeholders since April last year.

A CPSPB spokesman said the  process has been led by a senior Ulster GAA official who has met with the MORA group on a monthly basis and provided the group with ongoing information in relation to the design concept.

"The design team for the stadium was appointed in September 2012 and the team held its first meeting with MORA on the day of its appointment," he said. "Since then we have listened to all the concerns tabled by the residents' group and other stakeholders  and as a result the project team have substantially changed the design of the stadium concept by reducing the capacity from 40,000 to 38,000 to reduce the height. We have also developed a truss system, again to lower the height of the building substantially.

"We have changed the Andersonstown Road section of the stadium to leave it uncovered and we have also ensured that the stadium cloud is made of a translucent material.

"The GAA has also held five open night events in Belfast, three of which were in held in the Andersonstown Leisure Centre, and additionally the project team conducted a door-knock exercise with 280 homes on Saturday, April 13 to get direct feedback and input from residents neighbouring Casement Park.

"We have also attended two open residents meetings organised by MORA to provide updates on the project and get feedback on their concerns."

And the spokesman revealed the GAA  are planning further consultation events in the coming weeks.

"Ulster GAA continues to be in constant contact with the local residents, political representatives, community groups and other relevant stakeholders regarding the design of this project," he added.

"Regarding traffic management, these proposals are in draft form at present and we have already offered the MORA group representation on the event management team which will develop the proposals for match days.

"Any proposal for traffic control will be developed in partnership with the local residents and the statutory authorities.

"At the centre of this plan will be to ensure that residents are not adversely impacted by match day traffic.

"A full environmental statement will be submitted with the planning application and we have already conducted several studies on-site and the local area as part of the environmental statement.

"Ulster GAA will ensure that Casement Park is a significant social and economic driver for the entire province of Ulster, the city of Belfast and in particular West Belfast and we will continue to consult and engage with the local residents to ensure that this new development has a positive impact on them and their locality.

"The new Casement project will potentially bring £15 million a year to the local economy and will also see a £76.4 million boost for the local construction industry.

"Ulster GAA remains committed to the development of GAA in Ireland's second city and the promotion of economic and social regeneration in the city through the development of our games and activities," he added.

So what is your angle Snatter?

Are you a resident?

Are you an Antrim supporter?

Are you a stadium aficionado?

Or do you just want to complain that there is no roof on the Andytown road end?

[snatter]

So what is your angle Snatter?

Are you a resident?

Are you an Antrim supporter?

Are you a stadium aficionado?

Or do you just want to complain that there is no roof on the Andytown road end?

Ah, in face of overwhelming evidence that the GAA did in fact drop the A'town roof, you now try to move to playing the man rather than the ball. A -1 for that.

I'd prefer to talk about why we're getting 3/4 of a stadium for £75 million, and not the full 40k, fully covered stadium that we deserve.

But as your asking, my angle, as a lifelong gaa fan, is that

1. I think that the Ulster Council have been given a bum steer when they were told that Casement was a big enough site. It's not.
The design deficiencies at the A'town Rd end all stem from that.

2. this is a once in a lifetime opportunity for the GAA to get this level of funding, and the decisions they're taking now will reduce the amount of future income that would otherwise have been gained by buiilding a bigger, fully covered stadium on a larger site. This is because a bigger stadium, on a bigger site would be able to hold more money generating events. A more neutral site such as Musgrave Park would help in this regard, attracting more events.

3. Architecturally, as a GAA fan and a wee bit of stadium fan, I wanted this stadium to be a beacon of a resurgent GAA in Belfast, to raise the GAA's profile, to announce to Belfast that we are the biggest sporting organisation in Ulster, and that our Belfast presence was growing.

4. I wanted the stadium to be tall and highly visible to the whole city as a statement that the Irish dimension within our city was growing. That the GAA could no longer be ignored, with an impressive 40k stadium v's the 20k soccer stadium that attracts crowds half the size but gets disproportionately more media coverage. I'm old enough to remember the injustice I felt at the IFA being given a Windsor Park stand for free in 1983, whilst GAA crowds three times the size were still standing on wet grass banks, yet we got nothing.

5. I'm a bit disturbed that GAA fans aren't taking as much interest in the outcome of this project, when it will affect us for decades to come.

[Walter Cronc]

So what is your angle Snatter?

Are you a resident?

Are you an Antrim supporter?

Are you a stadium aficionado?

Or do you just want to complain that there is no roof on the Andytown road end?

Ah, in face of overwhelming evidence that the GAA did in fact drop the A'town roof, you now try to move to playing the man rather than the ball. A -1 for that.

I'd prefer to talk about why we're getting 3/4 of a stadium for £75 million, and not the full 40k, fully covered stadium that we deserve.

But as your asking, my angle, as a lifelong gaa fan, is that

1. I think that the Ulster Council have been given a bum steer when they were told that Casement was a big enough site. It's not.
The design deficiencies at the A'town Rd end all stem from that.

2. this is a once in a lifetime opportunity for the GAA to get this level of funding, and the decisions they're taking now will reduce the amount of future income that would otherwise have been gained by buiilding a bigger, fully covered stadium on a larger site. This is because a bigger stadium, on a bigger site would be able to hold more money generating events. A more neutral site such as Musgrave Park would help in this regard, attracting more events.

3. Architecturally, as a GAA fan and a wee bit of stadium fan, I wanted this stadium to be a beacon of a resurgent GAA in Belfast, to raise the GAA's profile, to announce to Belfast that we are the biggest sporting organisation in Ulster, and that our Belfast presence was growing.

4. I wanted the stadium to be tall and highly visible to the whole city as a statement that the Irish dimension within our city was growing. That the GAA could no longer be ignored, with an impressive 40k stadium v's the 20k soccer stadium that attracts crowds half the size but gets disproportionately more media coverage.

5. I'm a bit disturbed that GAA fans aren't taking as much interest in the outcome of this project, when it will affect us for decades to come.

I can't argue with that!! On the money there.

The reason we don't agrue/discuss/compromise is because there is an inbuilt element of assuming the hierarchy of the GAA is always right!!

[NAG1]

So what is your angle Snatter?

Are you a resident?

Are you an Antrim supporter?

Are you a stadium aficionado?

Or do you just want to complain that there is no roof on the Andytown road end?

Ah, in face of overwhelming evidence that the GAA did in fact drop the A'town roof, you now try to move to playing the man rather than the ball. A -1 for that.

I always found playing the man was a good route to finding out what was in him for the rest of the game, so no apologies for that.

I'd prefer to talk about why we're getting 3/4 of a stadium for £75 million, and not the full 40k, fully covered stadium that we deserve.

But as your asking, my angle, as a lifelong gaa fan, is that
1. I think that the Ulster Council have been given a bum steer when they were told that Casement was a big enough site. It's not.
The design deficiencies at the A'town Rd end all stem from that.

2. this is a once in a lifetime opportunity for the GAA to get this level of funding, and the decisions they're taking now will reduce the amount of future income that would otherwise have been gained by buiilding a bigger, fully covered stadium on a larger site. This is because a bigger stadium, on a bigger site would be able to hold more money generating events. A more neutral site such as Musgrave Park would help in this regard, attracting more events.

3. Architecturally, as a GAA fan and a wee bit of stadium fan, I wanted this stadium to be a beacon of a resurgent GAA in Belfast, to raise the GAA's profile, to announce to Belfast that we are the biggest sporting organisation in Ulster, and that our Belfast presence was growing.

4. I wanted the stadium to be tall and highly visible to the whole city as a statement that the Irish dimension within our city was growing. That the GAA could no longer be ignored, with an impressive 40k stadium v's the 20k soccer stadium that attracts crowds half the size but gets disproportionately more media coverage.

5. I'm a bit disturbed that GAA fans aren't taking as much interest in the outcome of this project, when it will affect us for decades to come.

1. Do you genuinely believe that the Ulster council and their paid staff have not been given all the information concerning the project with all the various debates floating around it. I for one do not.

2. For the amount of games and events the stadium as presented at the moment is more than adequate, how many outdoor concert type events were held on the Island of Ireland last year?

3. I would rather the GAA put some real money into the GAA in Belfast in development terms. Clubs are struggling and going to the wall at the moment and I would rather see staff on the ground helping these clubs develop than anything. Do you really think the GAA in Belfast is resurgent, what is your evidence for this?

4. Building a stadium just to put two fingers up the soccer dogs to me doesnt make sense, if you drove down the M1 any night the floodlights were on that would bring a smile to my face anyway.

5. Plenty of fans have an interest in it, just not completely negative or worked up about it.

[johnneycool]

Point 3 is a very real issue but not related to the building of the stadium.

The funding is there solely for the stadium and TBH snatter is on the money on this one. Why are we hamstrung with the site at Casement if its going to cost as much for a hotch botch when there's the possibility of a fit for purpose stadium?
Did the Ulster council look at green field alternatives when it became obvious the IFA and Ulster Rugby weren't buying the joint venture out at Long Kesh or was it Casement or nothing??

[Walter Cronc]

Point 3 is a very real issue but not related to the building of the stadium.

The funding is there solely for the stadium and TBH snatter is on the money on this one. Why are we hamstrung with the site at Casement if its going to cost as much for a hotch botch when there's the possibility of a fit for purpose stadium?
Did the Ulster council look at green field alternatives when it became obvious the IFA and Ulster Rugby weren't buying the joint venture out at Long Kesh or was it Casement or nothing??

To be fair to the Ulster Branch I think they were on board with the multi-purpose stadium. They just had issues over capacity!

[snatter]

Point 3 is a very real issue but not related to the building of the stadium.

The funding is there solely for the stadium and TBH snatter is on the money on this one. Why are we hamstrung with the site at Casement if its going to cost as much for a hotch botch when there's the possibility of a fit for purpose stadium?
Did the Ulster council look at green field alternatives when it became obvious the IFA and Ulster Rugby weren't buying the joint venture out at Long Kesh or was it Casement or nothing??

Here's the bum steer the Ulster Council were given back in 2010. Afaicr, this is the point when Casement was announced as the preferred site for what was to have been a 40k fully covered stadium. Up until then, no site had been decided.

Key quote in red.

http://www.setanta.com/ca/Articles/2010/10/06/Casement-Park-set-for-makeover/gnid-78446/

Casement Park set for makeover by Setanta staff , 06 October 2010


Belfast's Casement Park could become the permanent home for the Ulster SFC final if an ambitious overhaul plan comes to fruition.

Plans have been drawn up to convert the County Antrim arena into an all-seater stadium with a capacity of some 40,000.

Nelson McCausland, the Northern Ireland Sports Minister is set to presently provide the Stormont Executive with a paper that recommends the multi-million euro redevelopment of the ground as well as upgrades for soccer stadium Windsor Park and Ravenhill, the home of Ulster rugby. Under the proposal, the GAA, IFA and IRFU would all contribute financially to their respective projects.

"We have gone through a rigorous process, a very detailed process by an independent consultant, and it has now been accepted so it does stack up," Ulster Council president Aogan Farrell was quoted as saying by the Irish Daily Star.

"We wouldn't be in this game only we felt it's a development that's needed."

[NAG1]

Point 3 is a very real issue but not related to the building of the stadium.

The funding is there solely for the stadium and TBH snatter is on the money on this one. Why are we hamstrung with the site at Casement if its going to cost as much for a hotch botch when there's the possibility of a fit for purpose stadium?
Did the Ulster council look at green field alternatives when it became obvious the IFA and Ulster Rugby weren't buying the joint venture out at Long Kesh or was it Casement or nothing??

The funding for the stadium projects were on the basis initially that there would be a shared multi use stadium. Once this had been rejected by the soccer dogs, the revised plan was for the 'refurbishment' of existing stadia to bring them up to date and modernise them. Plans were put forward on this basis, at no point was there ever funding going to be released for development of a brand new stadium on a new site. So that is why Casement was nominated and that is why Casement is the site, obviously there are going to be compromises on all sides, but these can be worked through.

Just to reiterate, at no point was there the possibility to develop a brand new stadium.

[johnneycool]

Point 3 is a very real issue but not related to the building of the stadium.

The funding is there solely for the stadium and TBH snatter is on the money on this one. Why are we hamstrung with the site at Casement if its going to cost as much for a hotch botch when there's the possibility of a fit for purpose stadium?
Did the Ulster council look at green field alternatives when it became obvious the IFA and Ulster Rugby weren't buying the joint venture out at Long Kesh or was it Casement or nothing??

The funding for the stadium projects were on the basis initially that there would be a shared multi use stadium. Once this had been rejected by the soccer dogs, the revised plan was for the 'refurbishment' of existing stadia to bring them up to date and modernise them. Plans were put forward on this basis, at no point was there ever funding going to be released for development of a brand new stadium on a new site. So that is why Casement was nominated and that is why Casement is the site, obviously there are going to be compromises on all sides, but these can be worked through.

Just to reiterate, at no point was there the possibility to develop a brand new stadium.

So, it would just have been as feasible for the Ulster council to redevelop Armagh athletic grounds or Omagh, it didn't have to be Casement?

[NAG1]

Point 3 is a very real issue but not related to the building of the stadium.

The funding is there solely for the stadium and TBH snatter is on the money on this one. Why are we hamstrung with the site at Casement if its going to cost as much for a hotch botch when there's the possibility of a fit for purpose stadium?
Did the Ulster council look at green field alternatives when it became obvious the IFA and Ulster Rugby weren't buying the joint venture out at Long Kesh or was it Casement or nothing??

The funding for the stadium projects were on the basis initially that there would be a shared multi use stadium. Once this had been rejected by the soccer dogs, the revised plan was for the 'refurbishment' of existing stadia to bring them up to date and modernise them. Plans were put forward on this basis, at no point was there ever funding going to be released for development of a brand new stadium on a new site. So that is why Casement was nominated and that is why Casement is the site, obviously there are going to be compromises on all sides, but these can be worked through.

Just to reiterate, at no point was there the possibility to develop a brand new stadium.

So, it would just have been as feasible for the Ulster council to redevelop Armagh athletic grounds or Omagh, it didn't have to be Casement?

Correct JC, the GAA were given the choice of venue and they picked Casement as the project.

[johnneycool]

based on this independent consults report snatter mentions I presume.

[NAG1]

based on this independent consults report snatter mentions I presume.

Well I think there was a ground swell for a show of strength for want of a better phrase in the country second city. Plus a lot of work has already gone into Newry, Armagh, Celtic Park, Omagh etc So Casement being in the shape that it is in formed the logical choice for this type of refurb.

[AQMP]

I'd hate to get sitting behind that lad with the balloons.

Hardy, it's well nigh impossible to avoid balloons in West Belfast.

[johnneycool]

based on this independent consults report snatter mentions I presume.

So Casement being in the shape that it is in formed the logical choice for this type of refurb.

Until you try to get parked, in or out of the place when there's anything resembling a decent crowd about the place.

[NAG1]

based on this independent consults report snatter mentions I presume.

So Casement being in the shape that it is in formed the logical choice for this type of refurb.

Until you try to get parked, in or out of the place when there's anything resembling a decent crowd about the place.

JC again this would have had to have formed part of the planning process of the best way to 20k plus people into and out of the stadium as safely and as quickly as possible with the minimum of disruption.