Messages

Decent I suppose. Midfield lost a lot of battles. Giroud looked knackered.

Theo cocked up at the end. w**ker.

Brilliant cameo from Walcott - shows what he can bring to this team.

That midfield that lost a lot of battles provided 3 goals and 3 assists.

Not bad.

[On the downside Theo's back]

Played alright I suppose. On the downside Theo's back.

Giroud a horse of a player.

Are we supporting the same team??

Probably the most critical player to the potential success of Arsenal this year.

[Would portuma be as good as they were a few years ago? Suppose time will tell.]

Would portuma be as good as they were a few years ago? Suppose time will tell.

Would like to see otb make the breakthrough from leinster but think b'boden will go through. Munster and leinster very competitive.

No - by no means at the standard of their 2 in a row team but still a crafty and experienced side. Lack the pace they had but have put in one huge push this year for a County Title and more. Probably see a couple of retirements after this irrespective of the the All Ireland series results. Wouldn't be at all surprised if they win it but expecting the hunger and ability of other sides left will see them through.

[Try naming another sport where at any one time, an individual as to outwit and outplay 11 opponents.]

I don't understand how anybody can dislike cricket but at the same time claim to enjoy darts. Do people actually enjoy watching ithers play darts or is it all about the atmosphere and the pints?

I'm not a huge fan of cricket but I don't actively dislike it and can appreciate the levels of skill involved. Try naming another sport where at any one time, an individual as to outwit and outplay 11 opponents.

Whats wrong with bowls? I don't mind a bit of bowls.

Just used to hate bowls as it took up a disproportionate amount of time on Grandstand and I never enjoyed it. Definitely has a younger demographic than many people would think though.

Tennis. I hate tennis. Spoilt, rich brats grunting at each other. I hate tennis.

Could swap that for any professional sport really!

Gaelic football at times in the past decade!!

[Hard to see how Theo will start.]

I don't think they were set up particularly different from any other game recently. The difference this time was that they were forced to show more defensive qualities as the game progressed because of how good Dortmund were when Arsenal had the ball or tried to play their passing game. Ozil was dispossessed umpteen times as Giroud was being hounded when he got any service. The meant that was ball was being overturned and Ramsey, Rosicky and Cazorla were stopped in their tracks before they could really push up. Dortmund's hounding was first class but ran out of steam.

The CBs had their best game as a partnership and I was surprised to see Dortmund play to Mertesecker's strengths with the repeated crossing from early on although they nearly scored three times in the first half. Arsenal rode their luck especially with the 1-on-1 miss but sometimes it falls for you. I thought the sides were well matched over the two legs.

Hard to see how Theo will start. Rosicky has worked his arse off recently. Cazorla, Ozil and Ramsey are undroppable if fit. Even Wilshere will struggle to find a start in a full strength side. Flamini will come in for Rosicky probably.

Giroud is the unsung hero and you just hope he remains healthy.

Jeez I don't know about that. He offers a constant threat and some balance to this side. While things have been going great I think a Mourinho or maybe even Moyes on Sunday knows how to shut this team down. Teams will pack the middle and hit us on the counter. Walcott prevents that. I am actually fearful we will miss him badly on Sunday despite his frustrations.

I also think Ozil will make a hero out of him with through balls, etc.

[the drop in standards in terms of quality.]

My point from the start was that it was a hugely exciting novel year for hurling but lots of goals and exciting moments does not mask some of the drop in standards in terms of quality. Ultimately Kilkenny have come back to the pack rather than the rest catching up.

Strange, I think the opposite. Clare, Cork, Limerick and Dublin made huge improvements this year. Klikenny, Galway and Tipp went backwards a bit but overall the standard was much higher and we saw the emergence of so many new stars, playing with speed and skill levels that I think are better than I've seen before.

I thought Kilkenny were average enough last year but no team was good enough to stop them. In the few years before that, it was just Kilkenny and Tipp that were hurling at a very high standard.

In the 2011 championship Galway hammered Clare and Cork by 17 and 12 points respectively, with much the same personnel that are still available to us. Now we'd struggle to give either side a game, such is the progress they've made.

If Galway could introduce some tactical variation into their game they'd be a match for anyone  .

Would agree a fair bit about your comment on Galway.

One year they will go with wristy and skilfull hurlers and lose.............. get hammered  by the fans for being "too windy" Next year (such as 2012/3) go for giants and lose................ get hammered by the fans for being "donkeys and not skilful enough". Then the circle begins again........ manager changes and  6 or 7 dropped from the panel etc.

Have said this before but Galway's major problem is that they are producing very well balanced underage teams and winning AIs as a result but not producing the  one or two "star" players each year on those same teams.

An enigma of a county though.

I think the lack of games at underage is not helping Galway hurling rather than a lack of actual talent. In 2011, Galway beat Clare in an All-Ireland minor semi-final. Clare had Tony Kelly, Colm Galvin, Shane O'Donnell, etc and a few other lads who are on the current Clare panel. The two best players on the field that day were Padraig Brehony and Shane Maloney for Galway, yet both lads have struggled to make any impact for Galway at senior level. Now both are still very young and you wouldn't write them off yet but they just haven't developed like the Clare lads have whether this is down to coaching or the fact that the Clare lads have gone through a number of tough Munster championships at both minor and U-21 level since and the gametime alone has brought them on a ton.

Agreed.

Strongly believe that Galway going into Leinster at underage level is essential to progress at Senior. Important in so many ways not least continuous steady development. It will come at the expense of a couple of underage All Ireland's as we have had the advantages of timing our run every year and lining up the opposition from way out. Not a true reflection overall.

Furthermore it will take the hype away from nearly every minor team we produce and reduce pressure. If they are good enough they will win it the hard way and if not lads off those teams will still come through under the radar so to speak.

[fisk]

Going to get a doing over this but here it goes......

You're right, you are. I could fisk the whole thing, but ultimately the money quote is this:

Both provincial finals were damp squibs taking out the novelty of emerging winners.

No one was saying that at the time. Everyone was delighted to see those counties winning. Taking your piece as a whole, I think you are determined to set yourself up as someone who values the purity of the game above all else. A hurling man, if you will. What that makes the rest of us, I don't know.

Not sure what that language is.

Regarding not saying it at the time I walked out of the Leinster Final thinking Galway were atrocious but obviously delighted for Dublin who were superb in all aspects of the game. It was a very poor final.

The Munster Final was a huge disappointment mainly because of the referees decision on Horgan.

My point from the start was that it was a hugely exciting novel year for hurling but lots of goals and exciting moments does not mask some of the drop in standards in terms of quality. Ultimately Kilkenny have come back to the pack rather than the rest catching up.

Going to get a doing over this but here it goes......

A great year for hurling, emergence of new teams to win All Ireland, Munster title and Leinster title, exciting games, provoked great interest among the GAA populace and further afield yet one game apart I felt some of the quality was well down on preceding years although it will prove a terribly unpopular thing to say.

The Dublin Cork game and the Dublin Kilkenny clashes apart I thought the excitement totally glossed over the standards of other years.

The hype over the Waterford/Kilkenny game, the Kilkenny/Tipperary game and the drawn All Ireland Final belie the poor standards on the day. The Kilkenny/Waterford game was terrible stuff until Kevin Moran's heroics in the last 10 minutes and the goals in extra time.

The Kilkenny/Tipp game was built around the return of Henry and the novelty of capacity crowd to see Kilkenny on the verge of knockout. Terrible wides, handling errors and constant rucking.

The first 50 minutes of the drawn All Ireland was poor stuff. Particularly from Cork. Again the basic skills in terms of touch and the basics were very poor.

Hard to pick out any other quality high points this year bar the Limerick Tipp game. Both provincial finals were damp squibs taking out the novelty of emerging winners. Both Q/F's were not much better and the Limerick Clare semi-final was a huge letdown.

I probably come from the 'hurling man' side of things but I do feel this years incessant need to brag about the worlds greatest game on the back of excitement over quality this year a little galling.

[Then the barging call where he gave the free to Cork as well was brutal.]

As an Offaly man, I have great time for Brian Gavin as a ref, but I must admit yesterday I thought he gave Cork a couple of seriously handy frees. The Clare fullback nearly had his hand broken in a swipe that could have even been a red card by a harsh ref, if it was deemed a deliberate chop down on the hand. To turn around and give Cork the free in was unreal. Then the barging call where he gave the free to Cork as well was brutal.

After that though, I didn't see him do too much wrong. He'd have had to go by Umpires advice for the O'Neill/Horan incident, but unless they told him that both players struck, he was always going to go with a yellow each. Maybe if he saw O'Neill's belt he'd have lined him, but then it also appeared that Horan hit into the midriff of O'Neill, so does Horan walk as well? By the letter of the law, yes. Striking, or attempting to strike, with the hurley.

Sometimes I think Brian is hoist by his own petard as he has a name for being a man's ref, and letting the game flow and is sparing with the reds. Yesterday that might have counted against him in that incident.

The biggest turning point of all I felt was Paudge Collins decision to aim a kick at the sliothar instead of using his hurley. The fact that he air kicked made it worse, and then to see the ball going up the other end and a goal coming off it was sickening for Clare.

Clare by far the better team on the day and I thought Conor Ryan, the Clare #9 was MOTM, particularly when he was operating at centre back, he was immense as were the whole Clare half back line.

Watched that back on the Sunday Game last night and it looks a bad call no doubt. I actually thought at the time it was a definite Cork free in as it happened. Just the angle I saw it. Maybe it was the same for Gavin. Easy for us to make a decision seeing it 2 or 3 times. Gavin had a split second and saw it from a different view to the cameras. No doubt it was wrong but maybe not as blatant or incomprehensible as we think.

that schools game was the best game ever at that level

I think St. Jarlaths against Coláiste na Sceilge (2002?) is regarded as the best schools game ever.

Declan O'Sullivan versus Michael Meehan?

I was at that game. Absolutely unreal.

Can't find the match report but here is was Jack O'Connor's take on it as manager of Colaiste na Sceilge:

Former Kerry manager Jack O'Connor has suggested that the best colleges football game ever played was the All-Ireland senior semi-final between Colaiste na Sceilge, Caherciveen and St Jarlath's, Tuam in 2002.

O'Connor was coaching Colaiste na Sceilge in a contest with the famous Tuam nursery which ended level after extra-time before being decided in extra-time second time out. The sides were level 17 times in the first game, where only three of the 40 points came from frees.

A crowd of more than 7,000 turned up and enjoyed a splendid game, which turned into a shooting duel between Declan O'Sullivan and Michael Meehan, both of whom would go on to become stars for their respective counties.

It took extra-time to separate the sides in the replay, where St Jarlath's squeezed home by a single point. The first game has become such a part of folklore that even people who weren't in the Limerick Gaelic Grounds that day pretend that they were.

"For all of us involved and for all who genuinely saw it, this was the greatest game ever played. Ninety minutes of football, including extra-time. Forty scores. All points, 37 of them from play. Only once all day was there more than a point between us. The football was brilliant," recalls O'Connor.

[The cult-like aura surrounding the Boss is something I find kinda off-putting. Not because I think he's a charlatan or anything like that, it's the way his fans know everything about him is intimidating to the newbie.]

The cult-like aura surrounding the Boss is something I find kinda off-putting. Not because I think he's a charlatan or anything like that, it's the way his fans know everything about him is intimidating to the newbie. The AV Club had a very enjoyable primer on his work a few (six!) years back, I really must follow up on it some day.

Edit: as an aside, one of the comments on that link notes how "there's nothing embarrassing about him [live] like some rock stars who should've quit a long time ago". Strange but true.

While I am a huge Springsteen fan I would have to agree with you there. Some of it can be off putting, its like a competition with some people you would meet. Casual friends of mine have said the same but in fairness they are in the minority (the Bruce know it alls) despite being a large one!

Anyway, incredible night in Limerick. As stated here already the sound quality was excellent I felt and was in my top 2-3 shows ever. Anytime you here the Born to Run alum straight through you have had a good night. It's a phenomenal run of 8 brilliant songs. Absolutely loved it.

Bill Gates etc do not promote or self style themselves as the Champions of the oppressed, they quietly, in the latter stages of their lives, use a substantial portion of their wealth for the benefit of others.

The crucial difference here is that Springsteen and Bono, above all other major recording artists, allegedly side with the poor and oppressed and arguably do so only for crass commercial reasons and for their own benefit.

I have no great problem with the likes of Alan Sugar, Richard Branston etc making millions, as that is what they unashamedly set out to do,but it's those who laughingly claim to be on the side of the poor and oppressed,while living in huge mansions etc that get on my nerves.

Once again I am flabbergasted by the amount of people who continue to take vicarious offence on behalf of these Rock stars,as if I've shattered their conceptions of a saintly figure they revere.

Get over it, believe me they do not care about you, after they've relieved you of a considerable wad of dosh for tickets to see them.

There ya go again!

You're not dealing with idiots here yet you continue to spout the same rubbish over and over and have it rebuffed and refuse to answer the questions you were asked and ignore any points that have been thoroughly refuted.

I certainly don't view Springsteen as a saintly figure. The only vicarious offense we are taking is people spouting bullshit and lies in an effort to bolster their futile arguments.

For the final time though you struggle to see it, Springsteen has been beating the same drum thematically for his entire musical career. It took him 5 or arguably 7 albums before he became commercially successful. Yes we know he is now a multi multi millionaire due to his success. Yes we know he continues to make massive money from this music. However those of us here who seem to be relatively clued in also know the background to it, the motivations for it and choose to believe that as the evidence is there. You consistently refuse to acknowledge or accept that there is no element of exploitation here. It's a voluntary act to buy these tickets but again we don't accept a coherent response.

Also give me one instance of Springsteen referring himself as being 'the peoples poet' or 'championof the oppressed'? Remember these are your words now not his or anyone elses on this forum.

[But the likes of J70 swallow the shit that he's some sort of People's Poet for the oppressed.]

Galls man nothing wrong with that and is the reason why I've been to numerous concerts of his.

But the likes of J70 swallow the shit that he's some sort of People's Poet for the oppressed.

Nope, I don't know the man but I don't think he does. Like the rest of us on here he likes the music, he knows what inspired it and was merely responding to your bullsh*t comments that have all been thoroughly refuted.

We all know that he has become a multimillionaire through the success of his talent and all know he inhabits a wealth and a lifestyle we can only imagine.

However we also appreciate where the music comes from; the influences that shaped his songwriting and acknowledge that there has been a consistent theme for over 40 years.

You have ignored all the posts that have refuted all your baseless statements and have taken the track of trying to imply fans of his music are naive, gullible and misinformed in a sad attempt to put your point across.

[Are you obsessive?]

Are you obsessive? He is a commercial recording artist with a multi millionaire fortune.If that's not a giveaway regarding his motivation,I don't know what is.

He is canny enough to write lyrics he knows damn well that the gullible will swallow,as he watches his huge fortune grow and grow.Like Bono,he is essentially a businessman,and in terms of wealth accumulation,a very successful one.

When these guys use their vast wealth practically to help the poor and hungry,then I will believe that they believe sincerely what they write and preach.

No. I am just taking umbrage with the absolute drivel you are spouting and calling you on it.

The fact that your argument has now resorted to deflecting questions about being obsessive and implying people who appear to me to be much more informed than you as 'gullible' shows it up.

As the post above shows suggests there is and has always been an effort from Springsteen with the 'poor and the hungry' as you have suggested their should. However your next line will probably be to dismiss this as damn all and claim he should give it all away before being seen as genuine.

Have all Springsteens albums,but he is an entertainer at the end of the day and crudely commercial,touring to promote albums,cashing in on nostalgia,exorbitant ticket pricing,or in short,out to make money,like bankers.That is not idiotic,that is fact.Also I believe he is pretty ruthless with staff on tour,firing at a him,hardly the Mark of a socialist with a conscience.

Still if you choose to believe the bullshit,good luck to you.

Ha ha starting to feel sorry for you at this stage - where does one start with this?!

1)You have all his albums? I believe you. Now try taking them out of the case and listening to them.

2) Crudely Commercial? How so? One of the poorest artists out there in terms of memorabilia, PR and getting to grips with the times, stage, lighting, etc. Again you don't seem to know what you are talking about.

3) Touring to promote albums? Shock horror. 63 year old artist produces another new relevant album and actually promotes it?? As opposed to knocking a tour out of 30 year old hits?? Average 3 and a half hour setlists?? Shame on him!

4) Cashing in Nostalgia? Refer to point above. How so? 3 new albums in 5 years?? Setlist changes every night. Plenty of youth in audiences. Again a ridiculous ill informed comment.

5) Exorbitant Ticket Prices? Springsteen is typically paid a fee per show. He pays a 17 piece band. 17! Not 4. Promoters set final ticket pricing in many cases after fee agreed and paid. On top of that 3 and a half hour show and ultimate performance given in terms of effort and quality.

6) Out to make money like bankers? Ah yes they are the only profession out doing that. Only job he has ever held is in a band. Damn him for making a success of it.

7) Also I believe he is pretty ruthless with staff on tour,firing at a him,hardly the Mark of a socialist with a conscience?? Oh really tell us more? Has he sacked people in the past? I would believe it no problem. Was he wrong-what details have you?? Is this multiple people? Given he has one of the most enduring and long serving staff with little change I am interested to hear more on this? Is he a socialist by the same definition of yours??

Give it up is right.