The OFFICIAL Liverpool Supporters thread

[Billys Boots]

So you're really saying that the CL is not the ultimate prize for any European soccer club, long-term or short-term?  For me, there's no issue - the CL is far and away more important (in terms of growing revenue, building the club, attracting talent, 'branding' etc.) than the 'national' leagues.

[gawa316]

Maybe he ment the performance more than the result. Liverpool were extremely lucky to get 3 points on Saturday. 2 goals were a gift, very easily could have been a defeat .

Yet if this was utd, chelsea or arsenal the report would have stated that its the sign of potential champions when you play badly and win

[AZOffaly]

So you're really saying that the CL is not the ultimate prize for any European soccer club, long-term or short-term?  For me, there's no issue - the CL is far and away more important (in terms of growing revenue, building the club, attracting talent, 'branding' etc.) than the 'national' leagues.

Without doubt, in commercial  terms, and in growing the brand, the Champions League (misnomer and all) is the place to be.

However, I still believe Liverpool Football Club needs to get back to being the recognised best team in England first. Otherwise the CL victories are a tad hollow. Don't get me wrong, it's great to win, and I hope LFC wins it every year, and I wouldn't swap any we;ve won in the past for another League title, but for now, Liverpool need to win the Premiership, and win it a couple of times, very shortly.

If the Champion's League went back to being just for the Champions of each country, then I would place more value on it in sporting terms, because you have to be the best team in your league first, before taking on the other best teams. It used to take 2 years to win a European cup.

[brokencrossbar1]

Just read that teh Mash deal is done, fee agreed and terms, simply the paperwork to sort.
 
It is s dilemma, the whole Rafa thing.  I have been a supporter of him throughout and I still think he can be the man to bring them to the next level.  I think he has to let go of some of his own control freak approach to the team and get the right number 2 in.  Who that no.2 is I am not sure, but it must be someone who he and the players can trust and communicate with.  I think the fallout from the Pako issue has meant that he does not trust easily as his trust was breached by Pako.

If there are to be new owners they must give him at least the year as there needs to be stability.

Billy, I know what you are trying to say, but the financial spin offs from winning the Premier League would be just as sweet as winning the CL.  It rankles that Liverpool, the greatest of all English Clubs in terms of success, have not won it. At the minute I know how the Utd fans in school felt when we slagged the relentlessly about not winning the League.  I didn't think that it would take this long

[Billys Boots]

I still believe Liverpool Football Club needs to get back to being the recognised best team in England first. Otherwise the CL victories are a tad hollow.

What have they done to you - revoke your Sky subscription immediately.  

You can't be serious, seriously AZ - whatindanamajaysus use, other than a parochial sense of superiority, is putting a huge effort into or concentrating on winning the local league, at the expense of the important league.  The Carling Cup and the FA Cup have become irrelevant - the Premiership is next on the chopping block, and it's not in Sky's (or other British media outlets') interests to admit or acknowledge that.

I'd disagee with you about the old Champions Cup, for the very reason you hail it - it took two years to win the bloody thing, so what happened was that the best teams (in real time) didn't necessarily compete for the title coming towards the closing stages of the competition.  There is an elitism about the competition that has an unhealthy colour about it, but it's a formula that has merit, and has undoubtedly produced very memorable football in its history (something the Premiership would find difficult to claim).  Rafa for Leeds!  

[Abble]

So you're really saying that the CL is not the ultimate prize for any European soccer club, long-term or short-term?  For me, there's no issue - the CL is far and away more important (in terms of growing revenue, building the club, attracting talent, 'branding' etc.) than the 'national' leagues.

AGREED.
I think the Premier league is way overrated. Its a poor setup....basically what you have is about 2/3 top teams who've been running away with it a bit over the the past number of years...another 2/3 teams next to that who can play it out for fourth and then a lot of dirt..(ie those teams that either verge top half of league or relegation)...

a proper league should be where every feckin team is capable of competing to win something...i dunno what it is BOUT LIVERPOOL sometimes, whether they just take the foot off the gas on occassions....complacency...squad quality...opposing tactics...it can be annoying, but i'd never get too worked up about it cos its a sh1te quality league.

i've been enjoying liverpool performances in europe over the past few years and if they pick up an odd champions league trophy here and there...that has to be the way forward...competing among europes finest over knockout games...unbeatable when they focus on something like this....

i think that fa cup defeat also shows liverpools major failing / weakness at times and that's complaceny...there is absolutely no other reason a quality squad should struggle against lower league sides and when they slip up on occassions Rafa is always the first to get the abuse....he keeps them on their toes for europe, thats ok for me....

we could get a manager in who concentrates solely on league football and forgets europe, that could be a disaster !!! Keep it goin Rafa, your doing fine.

[An Fear Rua]

Carragher arrested on assault charge im hearing....

[brokencrossbar1]

Billy, you are right about the PL being next for the chop, but it would be beneficial to win it before it goes  Put this in a more parochial sense.  you would love Longford to win the AI, but I am sure you would like the local, parochial Leinster first!

[Mentalman]

I think he has to let go of some of his own control freak approach to the team and get the right number 2 in.  Who that no.2 is I am not sure, but it must be someone who he and the players can trust and communicate with.  I think the fallout from the Pako issue has meant that he does not trust easily as his trust was breached by Pako.

Defo. When you think he also give Heighway the a highway so to speak and now also effectively runs the youth academy...well there's a touch of the Eddie O'Sullivans about it all.

[Billys Boots]

you would love Longford to win the AI, but I am sure you would like the local, parochial Leinster first!

Apples and Oranges Crossbar, Colmcille for the county championship would first always (the AI would naturally follow close after), but the club's not a county now, is it?  All I'm saying is that the club should aim for the ultimate prize, and not get distracted by minor trinkets along the way (and certainly not punish the manager for doing the right thing).

[Chrisowc]

I saw on Sky Sports News this morning, where they do the paper review, that one of Her Majesty's hacks tried to spin it that he was having a go at Rafa.  Funny that he ommitted this part of the quote to keep the wheel turning....

"We've got the stadium, the fans, the manager and the players to compete for the Premier League.

Still, he writes for the same rag as Joe Lovejoy (The Express), who on sunday said that Liverpool's result on saturday wasn't very good for a team with their aspirations

Yes that's right.  A 3-2 home win in the league is now considered a 'not very good' result.

Maybe he ment the performance more than the result. Liverpool were extremely lucky to get 3 points on Saturday. 2 goals were a gift, very easily could have been a defeat .

Whatever he mean't it was just an excuse to get the boot in.

See how the media creamed their pants on tuesday morning about Everton returning to 4th place in the league.  They can't wait until Rafa is sacked and won't stop digging until it happens.

We now have a Liverpool fan on this board admitting that if they win the Champions League this year and next but don't win the league, then he will be calling for Rafa's head.  Madness.

Remember how we laughed when Real Madrid sacked Del Bosque for not winning the Champions League even though they won their league?  

That's the way we are going.

[mackers]

BC1, I don't know the full story as to why Pako left, you say that he betrayed Rafa's trust, what happened? I know you have said in earlier posts that Pako leaving has had a big effect on the season and I agree. I'd be very interested to hear the inside line if you have it.

[AZOffaly]

We now have a Liverpool fan on this board admitting that if they win the Champions League this year and next but don't win the league, then he will be calling for Rafa's head.  Madness.

That was me, and believe me, I am not influenced by the media rubbish.

I just find it very, very frustrating that Rafa seems to have his priorities at complete opposites to mine. He plays Torres in a Carling Cup game, before resting him for the league??? He never gives a settled side a run out in the league, but always ensures the best team possible is playing in Europe.

I like Rafa, I think he is a good manager, but I really think he either doesn't know or doesn't care about what winning a Premiership would mean to the club. I am willing to bet you €100 that if you stood outside Anfield and polled the fans along the lines of.

Which would be the better return for you?
a) Finish 4th or 3rd in the Premiership this season and next, but win the CL both seasons or
b) Win the Premiership next season, but do not win the CL either season.


I would be willing to bet that at least 70% of the fans would say option b would be preferable.

Let's be honest, you do NOT have to be a good side to win the CL. Monaco, Porto and LFC in 2005 have shown that you can go a long way in that tournament with an average side, as long as they are hard to beat, and got a bit of luck. You have got to be a good, consistent side to win the Premiership.

By the way

Remember how we laughed when Real Madrid sacked Del Bosque for not winning the Champions League even though they won their league? 

That's exactly the opposite of what I would like. I would still laugh at someone who sacked a league winning manager for not winning the CL. I think Chelsea were nuts to unsettle Mourinho, and I can't imagine Arsenal giving Wenger the old heave ho if he doesn't win the CL.

The league is your bread and butter. The CL is where the glamour and money are. Get a team fit to win the League, the rest will look after itself. But if you build, and mind a team, to win the CL, you will not be guaranteed coming near winning the League.

[bingobus]

70%? Did you poll some of the away supporters 

I'd put it at 99.9% with the .1% been Rafa if you caught him on his way to dressing room.

[AZOffaly]

I did say 'At least'