The OFFICIAL Liverpool Supporters thread

[The Real Laoislad]

By the way Laoislad, if your argument is that we need another top quality striker, then you won't find me disagreeing with you. What I'm trying to say is that with what we have at the moment, we are not creating enough.

I'd love Liverpool to get Anelka or Berbatov or something, but it's not going to happen.

Im not arguing with anyone,Just think there is plenty of chances being created and they are not being put away....
Besitaks away,Luton,Chelsea,Spurs,Reading,even against United there was two very scorable chances created,yes you will say two isn't enough in any match but whats the point of creating all these chances that you wish for when there is nobody there to score them bar Torres/Gerrard..What happens if either one or both aren't playing ?

[GalwayBayBoy]

Or the quality of the chances? nonsense pot shots from 35 yards still count as a shot on target, as do most of crouch's powder puff headers.

Mascherano hasn't turned out to be as polished as i'd expected. as good as he is at breaking up play, his capacity to keep posession has disappointed. hargreaves was the better option for the same money.

You think Hargreaves is better than Mascherano?

of course. you don't?

No I doubt most people would either. If you were to go around to managers all over Europe I think I'd know which one would be more in demand and it wouldn't be the Canadian.

In fairness Hargreaves is a bit better going forward (even though he's unlikely to ever hurt you with his passing) but isn't in the same class as Mascherano as a holding midfielder. Kaka spent the CL final last May getting hunted down by Mascherano at every turn. Barely getting a kick. Mascherano taken off and suddenly Kaka is popping up everywhere making passes and running the show. Could Hargreaves do a similiar job? I doubt he could do it as efficiently.

Not that Hargreaves is a bad player but as a sitting midfielder Mascherano is better. Hargreaves of course though can take corners and the odd free-kick which Mascherano can't.

[supersarsfields]

I'd agree, for the job that they were bought for I would pick Masch over Hargreaves every day of the week.

[AZOffaly]

Laoislad, of course you need someone to stick them away, but with Torres there, and we have to assume he will be there, you must create more chances. If we were creating 7 or 8 clear cut chances a game, and not taking them, then that would be a different matter. If you are creating 1 or 2 every game, then the pressure on Torres to score is immense, and if Torres is playing, then we are unlikely to score.

Remember Andy 'Andrew' Cole with United? He must have had one of the worst goals to chances ratios ever, but he still scored a hatful because United created a ton of chances. If Liverpool were playing fluid, attacking football, then even the likes of Kuyt would score double figures easily.

I'd love another top class striker, but no matter how many top class strikers you have, if you only create 2 chances per game, the most you can expect is 1 goal. That's not enough. Create 8 and score 3. Much better

As for your litany of 'chances' created, I afraid I didn't see many clear cut chances in those games. The chances against United had hardly anything to do with Liverpool's creativity. We created nothing that day. Liverpool are relying on Gerrard to score through his drive, or Torres through his class. Then when they are 2 up, the likes of Kuyt and Babel can score the odd one.

That's not good enough in my opinion. And the way they are playing, if they signed Berbatov in the morning, I still wouldn't fancy them to start scoring 2,3 and 4 regularly.

[The Real Laoislad]

AZ i see what your saying and we all want Liverpool to start winning/scoring etc. But i really don't think it's a bad as your saying regarding chances created..
There has been numerous fluffed chances this year,Loads of occasions when the ball went anywhere but into the back of the net..
We simply don't have anyone bar the two i mentioned to score goals regularly..
I do agree though we need other personal other than a top striker as i don't think Babel is up to it and Benayoun plays in patches and we won't even get into talking about mad Harry  ..
I suppose really we are both right in what we are saying and the bottom line is Liverpool need a few more quality players to compete at the level we need to be in contention for the Premiership

[Uladh]

Or the quality of the chances? nonsense pot shots from 35 yards still count as a shot on target, as do most of crouch's powder puff headers.

Mascherano hasn't turned out to be as polished as i'd expected. as good as he is at breaking up play, his capacity to keep posession has disappointed. hargreaves was the better option for the same money.

You think Hargreaves is better than Mascherano?

of course. you don't?

No I doubt most people would either. If you were to go around to managers all over Europe I think I'd know which one would be more in demand and it wouldn't be the Canadian.

In fairness Hargreaves is a bit better going forward (even though he's unlikely to ever hurt you with his passing) but isn't in the same class as Mascherano as a holding midfielder. Kaka spent the CL final last May getting hunted down by Mascherano at every turn. Barely getting a kick. Mascherano taken off and suddenly Kaka is popping up everywhere making passes and running the show. Could Hargreaves do a similiar job? I doubt he could do it as efficiently.

Not that Hargreaves is a bad player but as a sitting midfielder Mascherano is better. Hargreaves of course though can take corners and the odd free-kick which Mascherano can't.

I'm astonished that anyone (not really on this thread especially) would think mascherano does a better job than hargreaves. hargreaves protects the back four equall as well if not better than mascherano and can actually give it to teammate when he wins it. hargreaves also has superior pace, fitness and energy. its not even a contest. i'd put mascherano on a par with carrick or sissoko.

[GalwayBayBoy]

Or the quality of the chances? nonsense pot shots from 35 yards still count as a shot on target, as do most of crouch's powder puff headers.

Mascherano hasn't turned out to be as polished as i'd expected. as good as he is at breaking up play, his capacity to keep posession has disappointed. hargreaves was the better option for the same money.

You think Hargreaves is better than Mascherano?

of course. you don't?

No I doubt most people would either. If you were to go around to managers all over Europe I think I'd know which one would be more in demand and it wouldn't be the Canadian.

In fairness Hargreaves is a bit better going forward (even though he's unlikely to ever hurt you with his passing) but isn't in the same class as Mascherano as a holding midfielder. Kaka spent the CL final last May getting hunted down by Mascherano at every turn. Barely getting a kick. Mascherano taken off and suddenly Kaka is popping up everywhere making passes and running the show. Could Hargreaves do a similiar job? I doubt he could do it as efficiently.

Not that Hargreaves is a bad player but as a sitting midfielder Mascherano is better. Hargreaves of course though can take corners and the odd free-kick which Mascherano can't.

I'm astonished that anyone (not really on this thread especially) would think mascherano does a better job than hargreaves. hargreaves protects the back four equall as well if not better than mascherano and can actually give it to teammate when he wins it. hargreaves also has superior pace, fitness and energy. its not even a contest. i'd put mascherano on a par with carrick or sissoko.

I don't particularly rate Hargreaves. Decent player with a good engine but nothing special. Your lad Anderson I would rate higher even if he's a bit raw yet.

As I said put Hargreaves and Mascherano on the open market and see who attracts the most interest. I think we all know the answer to that one.

[stevo-08]

I suppose really we are both right in what we are saying and the bottom line is Liverpool need a few more quality players to compete at the level we need to be in contention for the Premiership

and this is the real crux of the problem. we just havent been buying/been giving the funds to buy enough quality players. now splashing out 6.5m on a new defender is promising and that had to be the priority considering Agger's injury & hyppia's age. sure we'd be totally screwed if carragher got injured/suspended. we need to wrap up the mascherano deal in the summer, get a quality partner for torres (either an attacking midfielder or striker) & also need a full back in the cole/evra/clichy class. then we'll be in a position to challenge and i'd be confident benitez could take that team to a PL title.

i'd put mascherano on a par with carrick or sissoko.

FFS, are you for real???

[The Real Laoislad]

Its not that long ago that Hargreaves was being berated from all quarters before England went to the World Cup..Their was people laughing at the thought of him even being in the England squad..Then because he had a half decent World Cup..which wasn't hard really as i'd have looked good in that England squad suddenly he is a World class player...
I don't see it myself really i think United payed way too much for a player who is no more than above average..certainly not in the same class as Masherano

[Uladh]

Mascherano better than hargreaves. you had me going for a bit there lads. next you'll be telling me anyone bar torres would get on the united first xi

[The Real Laoislad]

Mascherano better than hargreaves. you had me going for a bit there lads. next you'll be telling me anyone bar torres would get on the united first xi

Reina,Carra,Alonso,Gerrard would all get on the United team IMHO

[Uladh]

VDS

Neville
rio
vidic
evra

CRonaldo
Hargreaves
Scholes
Tevez

Rooney
Torres

[AZOffaly]

Hmm. Interesting statement alright Uladh, and maybe that would be an accurate barometer of where Liverpool need to make up the ground. Assuming 4-4-2

Reina v Van der Saar - i'd say Reina

Finnan v Brown - I'd say Finnan
Carra v Ferdinand - This season, I'd say Ferdinand
Agger v Vidic - Vidic, but Agger is not a million miles away
Riise v Evra - Evra

Benayoun v Ronaldo - Ronaldo
Mascherano v Hargreaves - Close one. I like Mascherano though
Gerrard v Anderson/Carrick - Gerrard
Kewell/Babel v Giggs - Giggs

Rooney v Kuyt - Rooney
Tevez v Torres - Close one, but Torres.

I have it at 5 Liverpool and 6 United in a team of 11. I didn't look at squad though. Even so, I think the difference is in players like Ronaldo, Giggs and Rooney. i.e. the Creative players. I think at the back, and in the centre of midfield it would be close enough, and you could end up with 2 or 3 positions going the other way. Carra v Ferdinand, Torres v Tevez and Masch v Hargreaves for example.

I think the main thing is that United have more options going forward, and have a better squad.

[bingobus]

Jaysus, not the XXXX would get in the United team, no they wouldn't, yes they would.

At the end of the day, I wouldn't want any dirty, contaminated, scummy, Manc in our team and I would not wish for any Red to be inflicted to have to wear a the filthy Manc Rag (Even Riise).
You have yours and we'll keep ours, on Doomsday the titles trophies can be counted and the top team will emerge.

Simple as that    

PS Masch would eat Hargreaves for Breakfast but would soon spit him out as he'd turn even the stronest stomach the filthy half breed 

[Uladh]

At the end of the day, I wouldn't want any dirty, contaminated, scummy, Manc in our team and I would not wish for any Red to be inflicted to have to wear a the filthy Manc Rag (Even Riise).

Says the monaghan man.


goalkeepers are close.
Gerard wouldn't lace scholes' boots.
Consecutive england managers haven't even rated cara in their best 4 centre halves.
i seriously thought ye were jokin abou mascherano. come on lads, he's ahacker.