Ulster Stadium Debate: Maze is the Least Attractive Option

[GweylTah]

Irish News editorial today.

http://www.irishnews.com/access/daily/current.asp?SID=560595&catid=560

[ziggysego]

Is this your first time on this side of the board?

[Gnevin]

Irish News editorial today.

http://www.irishnews.com/access/daily/current.asp?SID=560595&catid=560

Can you copy the text here

[GweylTah]

Maze is the least attractive option


Developing a state-of-the-art multi-sports stadium, as a symbol of Northern Ireland's confident new future, was always an excellent idea in principle.

Unfortunately, the practical difficulties and major disagreements which have arisen at every turn mean that allocating huge sums of public money to the original project will now be extremely difficult to justify.

The two most basic unresolved issues associated with the stadium are its location and its size.

A detailed proposal that it should be built on what is officially referred to as the Maze/Long Kesh complex outside Lisburn did not lack imagination but has simply failed to attract any degree of consensus.

Most supporters of the Northern Ireland international soccer team have made it abundantly clear through a series of campaigns and surveys that they do not want to go to the Maze under any circumstances.

Ulster rugby administrators are committed to retaining Ravenhill as their headquarters and, while they may be prepared to stage some games at the new venue, have said bluntly that its planned 35,000-plus capacity is massively in advance of their requirements.

GAA officials have taken a pragmatic approach to date but it is common knowledge that ordinary GAA followers regard the Lisburn scheme with complete disdain.

Political support has also been less than enthusiastic, with the open split which has just emerged among senior figures in the DUP providing a particularly negative context.

The other main parties hold equally mixed views, while Sinn Féin's commitment to preserving part of the former H-blocks prison for historical reasons could be maintained without any sporting development there.

If private investors are prepared to cover the total cost of the Maze stadium, something which is far from certain, it could yet be constructed in a scaled-down format.

Full clarifications are urgently required on a number of fronts and there should certainly be no question of an early decision in favour of the Maze while so many doubts and contradictions remain in place.

The fear must be that taxpayers will ultimately be left to foot most or all of a final bill, which may approach £400 million, and the authorities need to give full consideration to the other options which exist.

A site in Belfast, as the main centre of population and with a full infrastructure already in place, would be much more in line with established trends in other countries.

Allocating significant grants to the three main sporting bodies for the upgrading of their existing facilities also has to be regarded as a compelling alternative.

The massive gamble which the Maze scheme represents makes it the least attractive offer on the table at the moment.

[Star Spangler]

This is neither a GAA topic nor an issue of significant concern for the GAA and therefore shouldn't be in this section.

[GweylTah]

This isn't a GAA topic and shouldn't be in this section.

The GAA have been involved in discussions about a possible stadium at the Maze/Long Kesh site, including vetoing possible sites in Belfast and setting-out requirements on dimensions and capacity.  It is also to be expected it would, having done so, actually hold some games there.

How is it NOT a GAA topic?  You're being ridiculous.

[Deal_Me_In]

How is it NOT a GAA topic?  You're being ridiculous.

I think what was meant was that this is not a solely GAA issue but a general duscussion issue, in which you have already started this thread and nobody has openly debated because there are already 3/4 other threads regarding this matter.

[Star Spangler]

How is it NOT a GAA topic?  You're being ridiculous.

You're not very bright, are you?  The Northern Ireland government building a stadium is a topic about the Northern Ireland Government building a stadium. A GAA topic is a topic that is about the GAA. See? 

Now piss off back to the other side of the board with your pointless crap!

[GweylTah]

Leaving aside your hostile and insulting attitude, which is also very wide of the mark even if modesty prevents me from telling you by how much, you're being ridiculous, are you a self-appointed spokesperson for this part of the board the way a few other "this is our board" types are on the other part of the board?

It's a GAA issue as much as it's an IRFU + Ulster Rugby and IFA issue.

[Star Spangler]

are you a self-appointed spokesperson for this part of the board the way a few other "this is our board" types are on the other part of the board?

You're catching on.

[Feckitt]

Jesus Christ lads, give Gweyltah a break!!  Why not discuss the thing that's why he put it on the board, rather than just slag him off.  Personally I think that having it in Belfast is a bad idea.  Can you imagine bringing 40,000 Gaa fans up the Ormeau road in the middle of July.  I know that peace is breaking out big time but lets not kid ourselves that all is hunky dory.  Why don't they build a new stadium in Belfast for soccer and rugby with a £20,000 capacity, and bung the gaa a few quid to further develop Newry, Casement,Omagh and Derry.

[snatter]

Jesus Christ lads, give Gweyltah a break!!  Why not discuss the thing that's why he put it on the board, rather than just slag him off.  Personally I think that having it in Belfast is a bad idea.  Can you imagine bringing 40,000 Gaa fans up the Ormeau road in the middle of July.  I know that peace is breaking out big time but lets not kid ourselves that all is hunky dory.  Why don't they build a new stadium in Belfast for soccer and rugby with a £20,000 capacity, and bung the gaa a few quid to further develop Newry, Casement,Omagh and Derry.

Because while the OWC crew would sit in a state of the art all seater, all covered  stadium, courtesy of HM Govt, our families would still be getting soaked on uncovered terraces in some godawful dump like Clones.

When you add the cost of the OWC stadium to the cost of treating us fairly, ie building a stadium to the same standard, that fits our needs (35k min), you would find that the costs would be greater than building one stadium.

That's just the "getting treated fairly" argument against building separate stadiums.
When you realise that the cost of building a gaa stadium of 35k is disproportionately far greater than a 20k soccer one, there'd be some unionist howling when they realise that the GAA would be entitiled to far more funding than soccer.

A shared stadium in a neutral location makes it easier to meet our long term aims of attracting more unionists to our sports.

And remember that any arguments about spending the money on other more deserving things don't make sense, because the govt has declared that this is special one-off funding for a shared stadium only. If the funding is not drawn down, it will go back to the uk treasurer.

Additionally, the Irish News piece is disingenuous by blandly stating that

that ordinary GAA followers regard the Lisburn scheme with complete disdain.

.
GAA fans (that I talk to anyway) don't have much of problem with the idea of getting a 35k GAA stadium for absolutely no capital outlay.
We're sick of paying £17 to  get pissed on in casement and clones.
Look at the 2005 attendance figures I published elsewhere on the board - we'd have no problems filling it.
The GAA top brass have consistently supported this shared stadium since 1995 at least. Nobody suggests that they're strongly supporting it without good financial and practical reason.
The Down secretary confirmed last year that we'd easily make use of it.

The Irish News ommitts that this new stadium at a stroke delivers the GAA's aim in providing one high quality stadium in Ulster, in line with the independently approved Strategi Review report. THis frees up a lot of money for promotion, especially in urban areas where we're losing the battle big time.

Not often that I'd agree with Gwaytah, but he does have a point that this is relevant to the GAA - we should be sitting up and taking more notice of how we get treated in this debate.

We can't complain about getting short-changed (like we did when IFA / Linfield got their free North Stand in 1983), if we don't get involved and claim what's rightfully ours.