Casement Park in line for major overhaul - 40,000 all seater Stadium.

[Dougal Maguire]

Last year RTE had a programme about preparing for a United Ireland. While most of the folk from the Republic were reasonably neutral on the issue, Gregory Campbell made a contribution which immediately had the impact of persuading all neutrals that a UI was the best option. Fair play to you, your contributions here are a similar impact as regards the merits of the Casement project. Keep it up

[gallsman]

I don't think that's true at all. I think anyone in the north with half a brain would reckon that the scale of stadium that was being talked about for the Euros bid was completely over the top and completely unnecessary for Ulster GAA's needs.

The difference is, and I don't mean EG here, loads of people in the north (themmuns) simply don't want ussuns to have anything, especially if it might outshine Windsor. Large scale concerts, for example, going to Casement rather than, say, Boucher Road or the Ormeau Park would be perceived as discrimination against themmuns, even though Windsor would never be capable of hosting the same.

There is an irrational arguement to be made that Casement HAS to be built, regardless of (within relative reason) cost. The fact Ireland's second city doesn't have a stadium capable of hosting big inter county fixtures is an embarrassment to all.

If and when it does get built, Ulster finals have to be played there. If that means 50,000 coked up arseholes from Armagh and Tyrone don't get tickets that they otherwise would in Croke Park, then all the better.

[illdecide]

How many stadiums are full to capacity in any sports here?. I don't know about Ravenhill but i assume they get a decent crowd at their games. Windsor is at 15% capacity for club games and for NI games it looks pretty full but only a handful of games per year. GAA stadiums are no different, league games (Armagh) have been up around 9000-10,000 and Championship games is where we see the bigger attendances for obvious reasons. On the logic above we should all just have small arena's to accommodate average crowds. 

Not so much Apples and Pears as Apples and Spuds.

Fact is, NI/IFA need an international-standard stadium for half a dozen international matches every year, with Windsor being "the only game in town". Which was re-built using £26m from our originally allocated budget of £62m. Every game now attracts a full house eg at home to Belarus (no away fans) in a fairly meaningless game last month, crappy weather and adult tickets starting at over £40, yet still it sold out easily a fortnight in advance. Meanwhile, the venue is also used for other games eg Cup Finals, European club ties, womens internationals etc, as well as being made available to Linfield for their domestic games. (I say "made available" since the IFA now owns Windsor, with LFC being tenants.)

Compare that with the GAA who are looking for £150m+ over and above their original allocation of £62m, to stage precisely one full house a year (their projections), while they have another (VAT-free) venue in Clones (or Croke for a really big final), which has proven adequate up until now.

But yeah, £200m+ of public money for that? An absolute bargain...   

Yeah, i hear ya. You do your research I'll give you that but no matter what you fire at us/me it still doesn't hide the slight bitterness in your bullets you fire. There are much worse out there than you but the GAA still sends the Unionists Community buck mad and if soccer had the same following here as the GAA and that was a soccer stadium then it would have been constructed a long time ago. Maybe the soccer men wouldn't have made a bollix of it (that we both agree on) but hey ho.

[Evil Genius]

The difference is, and I don't mean EG here, loads of people in the north (themmuns) simply don't want ussuns to have anything, especially if it might outshine Windsor.

Except that so long as the issue is treated on its own merits, "themmuns" can bleat and girn all they like, but they don't actually matter. (Same with "Ciaran from West Belfast" banging on on the Nolan Show about soccer etc doesn't matter either.)

And as regards the issue itself, it is my contention that it cannot be justified to spend £200m+ of public money on building a stadium for one game a year, especially when there are already alternatives at Clones and Croke.

While soccer fans don't really care if it "outshines" Windsor, since for the majority, Casement doesn't even register much beyond driving along the M1 and spotting the floodlights. Same with Ravenhill. I mean do you, for example, really care that much about Windsor?

Large scale concerts, for example, going to Casement rather than, say, Boucher Road or the Ormeau Park would be perceived as discrimination against themmuns, even though Windsor would never be capable of hosting the same.

Sorry, but the £62m which was originally allocated to the GAA was specifically ringfenced within Stormont's SPORTS budget, having been redirected from the sports budget when the Maze Stadium was binned.

Or do you really feel it appropriate that taxpayers' money from the sports budget should go towards hosting eg Shania Twain concerts, especially when that would be subsidising unfair competition with existing venues, both privately and Council owned? (I suspect that it might even be deemed unlawful, at least if amounting to more than a very few concerts a year. And I'd have thought the GAA will have had enough legal challenges already!) 

The fact Ireland's second city doesn't have a stadium capable of hosting big inter county fixtures is an embarrassment to all.

"To all"? It's an embarrassment to the GAA certainly, especially when you examine the reasons why no such stadium has yet been built.

But I don't imagine non-GAA fans, north or south, lose too much sleep over it.

[gallsman]

All your mates with their "no casement" banners in Windsor are fully up to speed with the economics of the thing, yeah? They're that passionate about public expenditure that they went and made banners?

Or could it just possibly be that they don't want the fenians to have their thing?

We all know the answer.

[Evil Genius]

Yeah, i hear ya. You do your research I'll give you that but no matter what you fire at us/me it still doesn't hide the slight bitterness in your bullets you fire.

For me, "bitterness" is too strong, although I will admit to irritation, frustration and even anger at the GAA's part in this whole fiasco, as follows. When the Maze shared stadium was finally binned, the £140m-odd which Westminster had allocated to it was redirected to Stormont, to be used by the three codes for their own stadium purposes.

Rugby pushed its £16m towards Ravenhill and GAA its £62m to Casement, while Soccer opted to spend £26m of its £62m on rebuilding Windsor, with the remaining £36m to go to smaller stadia throughout NI (the bulk of it to be shared equally between The Oval, in Peter Robinson's then East Belfast constituency and The Brandywell in Martin McGuinness's Derry constituence btw).

However it was decreed that the £36m could not be released until all three major stadia were completed, thereby halving(?) its value in real terms. Indeed soccer still hasn't received it, years after it was originally approved.

So maybe now you can see why I'm bit pissed off by this whole fiasco?

There are much worse out there than you but the GAA still sends the Unionists Community buck mad and if soccer had the same following here as the GAA and that was a soccer stadium then it would have been constructed a long time ago. Maybe the soccer men wouldn't have made a bollix of it (that we both agree on) but hey ho.

As I indicated earlier, a few bucket mouths like eg Bwyson or Allister, with volume far in excess of their actual support, are pretty much irrelevant to the debate, even if they could never see it that way.

And as for your "if it was a soccer stadium then it would have been constructed a long time ago etc", well yes, in fact it was! But just as the usual bucket mouths were nothing to do with Casement not getting rebuilt, neither were they at all relevant to Windsor getting rebuilt, either. Fact is, the IFA (for once) got it right, while the GAA got it wrong, nothing more, nothing less.

And as for me, I would refer you back to what I posted in #5,281, namely that I "don't begrudge the GAA from having the very best stadium they can build from a reasonable amount of Government funding."

[Evil Genius]

All your mates with their "no casement" banners in Windsor are fully up to speed with the economics of the thing, yeah? They're that passionate about public expenditure that they went and made banners?

Or could it just possibly be that they don't want the fenians to have their thing?

We all know the answer.

Iirc, it was four people with two banners, out of a crowd of 17k, with a few more on the Kop telling the IFA (note) where they could stick Casement. The rest of us just got on with watching the game.

Meanwhile, had the Euro's thing gone ahead, and NI qualified, I have no doubt whatever that the great majority of NI fans would just have trekked out to Andytown to watch their team, regardless of how they got there (both literally and figuratively).

Likely including the boys with the banners, who would otherwise have been long forgotten.

But hey ho, if you want to deflect the blame for this giant fiasco onto a few people who have/had no influence whatever on what has actually transpired, then fire away. 

[SaffronSports]

All your mates with their "no casement" banners in Windsor are fully up to speed with the economics of the thing, yeah? They're that passionate about public expenditure that they went and made banners?

Or could it just possibly be that they don't want the fenians to have their thing?

We all know the answer.

Your assuming only non gaa folk go to Casement. Plenty of lads were disappointed looking tickets in May for the Irish Cup final.

[gallsman]

But hey ho, if you want to deflect the blame for this giant fiasco onto a few people who have/had no influence whatever on what has actually transpired, then fire away. 

Where did I do that exactly? Hey ho

If you'd actually read my original post, rather than flying off the handle like a reactionary eejit, you'd have noted that I said the stadium proposed far exceeded any long term need being the Euros.

As usual with you though, everything untoward that shows up the bitterness of people opposed to the GAA is merely the work of a few bad apples.

[gallsman]

All your mates with their "no casement" banners in Windsor are fully up to speed with the economics of the thing, yeah? They're that passionate about public expenditure that they went and made banners?

Or could it just possibly be that they don't want the fenians to have their thing?

We all know the answer.

Your assuming only non gaa folk go to Casement. Plenty of lads were disappointed looking tickets in May for the Irish Cup final.

Huh?

[SaffronSports]

All your mates with their "no casement" banners in Windsor are fully up to speed with the economics of the thing, yeah? They're that passionate about public expenditure that they went and made banners?

Or could it just possibly be that they don't want the fenians to have their thing?

We all know the answer.

Your assuming only non gaa folk go to Casement. Plenty of lads were disappointed looking tickets in May for the Irish Cup final.

Huh?

Meant Windsor obviously