UK General Election 2017

[AhNowRef]

lol .... And on it goes..

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4591268/The-terror-links-Ian-Paisley-s-DUP-party.html

Even the bloody "Daily Mail" of all crappy right wing papers ...... this could get messy 

[Hardy]

Heard that DUP website crashed as there so many people from England trying to see what they are all about.

Redirect

[AhNowRef]

Ha, wondered how long it would be ...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/orange-order-portadown-northern-ireland-dup-use-banned-drumcree-march-negotiations-with-theresa-may-a7785026.html

[Upthecut]

Two questions to which I can't see answers that are either logical or politically tenable:

1. How is it acceptable for the DUP to be simultaneously a protagonist in negotiations on the governance of the North and effectively a part of the Westminster government? One of the possible outcomes of the assembly negotiations is direct rule from Westminster. Surely the DUP has an overwhelming incentive to scupper the talks, let the Assembly lapse and by default become effectively the direct government in the North without having to worry about power sharing with pesky nationalists.

2. How is it acceptable for the UK government to mediate the Assembly talks, when it is the political partner of one of the protagonists? It is plain that the DUP has a veto on everything by virtue of its ability to withdraw support from the government at will. Surely the other parties and the Irish government can't agree to proceed with talks on this basis. I presume they still have George Mitchell's phone number.

Just a quick thought. The Unionists joined a coalition government in 1915 during the period of the suspended Home Rule Bill. The Nationalists also had a chance to join it but refused to do so.

Within 7 years Ireland faced a Rising in 1916, an election that developed a Sinn Fein majority, a war of independence, and a Treaty Negotiation. It could be argued that the formation of this coalition government reawakened a nationalist mood.

Will the current position of a possible Unionist coalition with the Conservatives invigorate further the nationalist voice - not leading to violence but a possible further decline in the Unionist position in the north? If you look at the electoral map on Friday it makes for an interesting read. Firstly it looks like the unionist position is cornered. Could a reawakening reduce this further as Nationalists are alienated further from Westminster?

Could the Conservatives, at some stage, will lessen the number of MPs it gets from the north as part of a overall drive to create a Conservative majority throughout the whole of the UK and define it as cost cutting. Unionists should read their history of how Conservatives have treated them.

Secondly, the map looks very much like the County Option scheme of 1914, with only 4 counties opting out of the HR Bill. Little has changed in 100 years for unionism as it fails to convince people in the north. Is this coalition a last gasp of a unionist entity?

[Denn Forever]

Heard that DUP website crashed as there so many people from England trying to see what they are all about.

Redirect

Now that's frightening.

[Avondhu star]

Two questions to which I can't see answers that are either logical or politically tenable:

1. How is it acceptable for the DUP to be simultaneously a protagonist in negotiations on the governance of the North and effectively a part of the Westminster government? One of the possible outcomes of the assembly negotiations is direct rule from Westminster. Surely the DUP has an overwhelming incentive to scupper the talks, let the Assembly lapse and by default become effectively the direct government in the North without having to worry about power sharing with pesky nationalists.

2. How is it acceptable for the UK government to mediate the Assembly talks, when it is the political partner of one of the protagonists? It is plain that the DUP has a veto on everything by virtue of its ability to withdraw support from the government at will. Surely the other parties and the Irish government can't agree to proceed with talks on this basis. I presume they still have George Mitchell's phone number.

You are coming from the viewpoint that politicians of both Labour and Conservative actually care about what happens in Northern  Ireland when it is really well down their list of priorities. It makes no contribution to the UK but was a handy supply of recruits to the armed forces when required.
The DUP are absolutely delighted with their present position and can present any benefits they screw out of the British government as a sign of the "special place Ulster holds in the United Kingdom"

[LeoMc]

Scottish Conservatives do not want the DUP next or near Government.
Even keeping both Scottish Cons and DUP on board still only gives May an unworkable majority as the English Cons are a very diverse lot from Hard Brexit through to Pro-EU so she will be gone in 3 months with a new election by Christmas.

The DUP cannot go with too big a shopping list. I would be happy if they came back with a commitment for some capital investment in schools and hospitals as well as the money to finish the A5, the A6 and the YSI.

I have heard that their public commitment to stop prosecutions of former soldiers (which mirrors the Conservative position) is in private more likely to be in the format of a statute of limitations and would include all Troubles related incidents (as an acknowledgement of the work done on the ground for them by the UDA) and which SF would be able to sell to their grass roots and kick start Stormont. However many victims groups will see that as a sell out by the DUP.

[T Fearon]

Yellow card,I no longer see the point of Irish Unity when various free state governments have continually sold Northern nationalists out.Why then would I place my trust in them.That does not make me opposed to Irish Unity,if things change.

My idea of an independent Northern statelet is to neuter both the DUP and SF by doing away with the concept of UK Unionism and Irish nationalism.Thereby current DUP and SF voters who find the idea of independence (and it might be acceptable to many more than you think) would have no purpose and would potentially be outvoted by the substantial number of people who do not vote,because they disagree with DUP and SF.

[yellowcard]

Yellow card,I no longer see the point of Irish Unity when various free state governments have continually sold Northern nationalists out.Why then would I place my trust in them.That does not make me opposed to Irish Unity,if things change.

My idea of an independent Northern statelet is to neuter both the DUP and SF by doing away with the concept of UK Unionism and Irish nationalism.Thereby current DUP and SF voters who find the idea of independence (and it might be acceptable to many more than you think) would have no purpose and would potentially be outvoted by the substantial number of people who do not vote,because they disagree with DUP and SF.

Then how does this tally with you feeling different to people in the south and feeling part of the distinct 'N Ireland culture' that you speak about? 

[Shamrock Shore]

"various free state governments have continually sold Northern nationalists out"

Examples please my good fellow, restricting said examples please to the period 1921 to 1937.

Thanks.

[The Trap]

This current situation will show how much the DUP and SF want Stormont to work....they have an opportunity to secure the ££££s to sort out a lot of the problems here. DUP should give the Irish Language Act and get the Tories to pay for it......they can get the money to sort out the RHI and for giving the Irish Language Act SF should let Arlene stay on.......money can sort out a lot of the problems but are they smart enough to take it......SF should be because if they are right and this all ends in tears then the English will probably want less to do with here when this government falls. In the meantime take everything you can off them!

[yellowcard]

This current situation will show how much the DUP and SF want Stormont to work....they have an opportunity to secure the ££££s to sort out a lot of the problems here. DUP should give the Irish Language Act and get the Tories to pay for it......they can get the money to sort out the RHI and for giving the Irish Language Act SF should let Arlene stay on.......money can sort out a lot of the problems but are they smart enough to take it......SF should be because if they are right and this all ends in tears then the English will probably want less to do with here when this government falls. In the meantime take everything you can off them!

If they can get enough out of the English government to cover the £490m for RHI then it would go someway to smoothing over the financial damage caused by it. The problem is whether the English government lasts long enough in order to get the money off them, I don't think it will see this Christmas if they do get a deal cobbled together. Also Scotland and Wales will want to see details of any financial pledges or concessions made to the north. The Tories now have 13 seats in Scotland and they will have to produce something for those voters on a par with what they are promising the north. It's all a mess and far from being stable. 

[Orior]

Two questions to which I can't see answers that are either logical or politically tenable:

1. How is it acceptable for the DUP to be simultaneously a protagonist in negotiations on the governance of the North and effectively a part of the Westminster government? One of the possible outcomes of the assembly negotiations is direct rule from Westminster. Surely the DUP has an overwhelming incentive to scupper the talks, let the Assembly lapse and by default become effectively the direct government in the North without having to worry about power sharing with pesky nationalists.

2. How is it acceptable for the UK government to mediate the Assembly talks, when it is the political partner of one of the protagonists? It is plain that the DUP has a veto on everything by virtue of its ability to withdraw support from the government at will. Surely the other parties and the Irish government can't agree to proceed with talks on this basis. I presume they still have George Mitchell's phone number.

Are you offering yourself for the job of honest broker? There are several reasons why you need not bother:

1) you play tennis
2) you moderate on GAA board (allegedly)
3) you're from Meath and live on the top of some high moral ground, presumably Tara

I, on the other hand, would be ideal cause I hate everyone.

[Fiodoir Ard Mhacha]

Belfast Telegraph reports the DUP has come a long way from its staunchly entrenched past. At least two grote palms of an ox's tail.

[red hander]

I no longer vote on tribal lines but for candidate (s) who I agree with and who have a track record.

My preference would be for an independent Northern state,if economically viable ultimately,devoid of  toxic,bizarre and irrational allegiances to the British or 26 county states,which has brought about nothing but misery and division.

There was, to all intents and purposes, an independent northern state from 1922 to 1969, with zero interference from London as loyalist apartheid was practised unfettered. That worked out really well, didn't it? Speak for yourself. I feel total kinship with my fellow Irish, whether they're from Armagh or Cork.