MPs unite to fight law that will make abortions available in Northern Ireland

[pintsofguinness]

What is your point? If a Dr performed an abortion on my wife, or we went to oregan and euthanized my father in law - both are legal.

Euthansia is legal where you are? Fair enough but that's hardly the norm.

My point is in most places where abortion is legal euthansia is not therefore:
Ending the life of an unborn baby - perfectly ok
Ending the life of someone in a vegetative state, showing less signs of life than an unborn baby, - murder.

Just like - man gets woman pregnant - must be a father
woman gets preganant - don't want to be a mother? have an abortion. 

hardly makes sense.

[Puckoon]

What is your point? If a Dr performed an abortion on my wife, or we went to oregan and euthanized my father in law - both are legal.

Euthansia is legal where you are? Fair enough but that's hardly the norm.

My point is in most places where abortion is legal euthansia is not therefore:
Ending the life of an unborn baby - perfectly ok
Ending the life of someone in a vegetative state, showing less signs of life than an unborn baby, - murder.
Just like - man gets woman pregnant - must be a father
woman gets preganant - don't want to be a mother? have an abortion. 

hardly makes sense.

Euthanasia is legal one state north of me - you are right, its not the norm. However - maybe the example you have highlighted (and euthanasia is a very divisive topic too) shows you the value that the law and the society who accepts it has put on a life which is existing outside the womb - and the potential life inside it. You still keep using words like "perfectly ok". This isnt perfect.

[pintsofguinness]

It shows hypocrisy is alive and well. 

I challenge anyone to come on here and tell me why someone in a vegetative state should have their life protected (something I agree wiht) and an unborn baby should not. 

[Puckoon]

Those people dont exist Pints. The same people that are pro choice, would also be in favour of euthanasia.

[pintsofguinness]

Those people dont exist Pints. The same people that are pro choice, would also be in favour of euthanasia.

There must be plenty or euthansia would be introduced.

You boys must think that society is about the survival of the fittest.

[Maguire01]

Those people dont exist Pints. The same people that are pro choice, would also be in favour of euthanasia.

There must be plenty or euthansia would be introduced.

You boys must think that society is about the survival of the fittest.

Puckoon is right - most people that would be pro-choice would probably be pro-euthanasia, or at least pro-choice in relation to euthanasia. And as opposed to the argument of the defenceless child from the 'pro life' camp, i would happily go on record as saying that if i ended up in a vegetative state, i'd like to be helped on the way - therefore it definitely should be no ones business or choice other than my own. If anything, the euthanasia debate should be more straightforward - especially if people opt in when they are in good health, or still of sound mind.
As far as i know, euthanasia is legal in a number of european countries.

[pintsofguinness]

Maguire, what constitues human life?

[Hurler on the Bitch]

Look - I was always anti-abortion and listened to all the arguments pro and anti etc. I watched all the documentaries about the 'back-street' abortionists and the number of women who, in desperation, turned to them to terminate their pregnancies. I tried to understand the reasons and maybe put myself in the position of women who werer at their wits end. I tried to understand. But, I just couldn't justify to myself the act of murder that abortion was. Never. Never. However, on Monday night, Iris Robinson was on UTV Live .........................etc .................etc .... maybe in such circumstances..............................

[Sideshow Bob]

Very true - you regularly hear about women having abortions regretting it but how often do you hear women saying they wish they had an abortion?

There is an old woman in Silverbridge who wishes abortion had been legal around 1970 

[pintsofguinness]

Very true - you regularly hear about women having abortions regretting it but how often do you hear women saying they wish they had an abortion?

There is an old woman in Silverbridge who wishes abortion had been legal around 1970 

Who/what do you mean?

[pintsofguinness]

Maguire, what constitues human life?

c'mon maguire, no running away from the hard questions.

[Maguire01]

Maguire, what constitues human life?

c'mon maguire, no running away from the hard questions.

I'm not running - i've had limited time online (with Ballybofey & Clones this weekend) and have been prioritising that time to the main board!

Human life... a living human? Is it meant to be deeper that than? Why does a definition matter? Heartbeat? Awareness? Consciousness? I'm sure someone else could come up with something more comprehensive.

As for abortion or euthanasia, whether it is a living human that is killed or not does not central to my position - freedom of choice is. Take someone in a vegetative state - yes it is still human life, but in my opinion, is not worth preserving, and i say that as someone who would willingly (if it was legal), sign up to be 'helped on my way' was i in such a situation. I'd also sign up where i was terminally ill or in pain - the 'human life' element is not important.
An unborn baby may also be a human life, but that 'revelation' doesn't change my pro-choice opinion.

Actually, on my way home after the match, i was coming through Portadown and some old woman in the car in front of me with a car sticker saying 'abortion kills babies'. A bit obvious i thought. Not 'abortion is bad' or 'abortion is wrong', but 'abortion kills babies'.

[pintsofguinness]

Human life... a living human? Is it meant to be deeper that than? Why does a definition matter? Heartbeat? Awareness? Consciousness? I'm sure someone else could come up with something more comprehensive.

A definition matters because you're the one using the term - to me a human life is a living human, you disagree - so what, in your opinion, is a living human?

As for abortion or euthanasia, whether it is a living human that is killed or not does not central to my position - freedom of choice is.

No one has/or should not have freedom of choice when it interferes with another human life. 

Actually, on my way home after the match, i was coming through Portadown and some old woman in the car in front of me with a car sticker saying 'abortion kills babies'. A bit obvious i thought. Not 'abortion is bad' or 'abortion is wrong', but 'abortion kills babies'.

Really? Normally the pro abortion gang have a fit if the "foetus" is referred to as a baby

[hmmm]

Pints, I wonder how this thread would have panned out if you had been born a woman.

[pintsofguinness]

the same